Smith 610 observations

[rugerp89ipsc]

awesome, thanks for the link.

How hard is it to find moon clips for a 686 and is it expensive to get the cylinder worked on to fit them?

I am hoping in a steel match, 5 shots a stage, 5 hits, but who knows, it would be nice to have the option to shoot an ipsc match or practice reloads...

[10mmdave]

awesome, thanks for the link.

How hard is it to find moon clips for a 686 and is it expensive to get the cylinder worked on to fit them?

I am hoping in a steel match, 5 shots a stage, 5 hits, but who knows, it would be nice to have the option to shoot an ipsc match or practice reloads...

Is this a 7 shoot or a 6 shot ??

IIRC, some folks here have done moonclips in 686's so hopefully they'll chime in, I also think they are pretty brass

sensitive so a search may help you out.

I have some old 6 shot 38/357 clips I'm working with right now, they fit an older 586 with tight-ish brass

but not a new 686, this is mentioned on TK's web site.

TK Custom at moonclips.com, Brownells, or Dave @ Heathco (TK sells his clips also) are some sources for clips,

I think Ranch products sells 7 shot clips and maybe 6 shots as well.

As far as the conversion, $75 to $125, you should only have to send the cylinder to get it done.

TK's site lists some folks.

[sargenv]

I think I might be the culprit that loves the RIMZ moons in my 610... and I can hardly wait for S&W to pay the bribe money to CA so that I can pickup another 610 as a backup. I recently picked up an additional 60 RIMZ moons.. now I can load for an entire major match and not have to deal with demooning and remooning.

I was wondering about the accuracy thing someone mentioned. It might be that the barrel is a bit stiffer, ie more metal, than the 45 since they are probably (speculation) the same outside diameter, but the 610 has a smaller hole drilled in it, meaning more meat/steel/whatever and then that would make the barrel stiffer. I've found that my 610 has pretty good accuracy with any kind of load. I don't have a 625 so I can't make a comparison. I wore out 500 pieces of Federal 10 mm brass (with full power loads) before I even contemplated using mine for competition, so by the time it got a trigger job and everything all tricked out, it was already well on it's way to being broken in and glass smooth. If I could find a local club to shoot Handgun sillouette, I might stoke up some full power 10 mm ammo and see what it could do at 200 meters..

I made a choice about 2 years ago to use nothing but minor loads for competition. My thinking was "why change the load between sports". Load one so you know it's consistency and you know what to expect all the time. In doing that I feel that I improved quite a bit and that simplified things for me. The only time it hinders me is when I'm going too fast, minor does penalize you pretty good if you don't make them count (uspsa mainly). When I shoot ICORE I really try to slow down and make my hits all inthe A zone. I'm still trying to settle on a load for my 627.

Someone else mentioned having an 8 3/8" L frame.. the Safariland 002 with that little loop on the end removed should work nicely for it. Ok, it's not exactly the best holster out there, but that's the only holster I use for my 610. I've gotten my draws down to the 1 second range with it and could probably do better with practice. I've cut some of the retention off of it since in it's stock form it is pretty stiff. With the L frame, the cylinder is a bit smaller, so the draw won't be as problematic as the N frame.

[rugerp89ipsc]

wow. That was a lot of good info.

What is the preferred barrel length on a 610 and is that mainly for the sight radius?

[10mmdave]

wow. That was a lot of good info.

What is the preferred barrel length on a 610 and is that mainly for the sight radius?

preferred length is up to you, folks shoot 4, 5, and 6.5 inch barrels

If you want to dabble in IDPA you can't go bigger that 4 inch.

5 inch is nice if you have the eye's and the money, this version commands high prices these days

but might be more suited to ICORE and USPSA (has to be a stock 5 inch to play ICORE)

6.5 is the most common, heavier than all the rest and I like the longer sight radius.

Soaks up recoil better due to the weight but then you have to push that weight around during the stage.

I'll be shooting my "Outlaw" 6.5 inch 610 in USPSA this year along with a 5 inch (cut down) model.

Good luck with your choice, i don't think we're making it any easier

[vrmn1]

The 6.5" barrel you really have to drive to the target. The little I have shot mine I am liking that. I do love the longer sight radius.

[Tom E]

5 inch is nice if you have the eye's and the money, this version commands high prices these days

but might be more suited to ICORE and USPSA (has to be a stock 5 inch to play ICORE)

6.5 is the most common, heavier than all the rest and I like the longer sight radius.

Soaks up recoil better due to the weight but then you have to push that weight around during the stage.

I'll be shooting my "Outlaw" 6.5 inch 610 in USPSA this year along with a 5 inch (cut down) model.

Do you have a preference? 5 or 6.5? I guess what I'm asking is which you'd pick if you could have only one.

[10mmdave]

5 inch is nice if you have the eye's and the money, this version commands high prices these days

but might be more suited to ICORE and USPSA (has to be a stock 5 inch to play ICORE)

6.5 is the most common, heavier than all the rest and I like the longer sight radius.

Soaks up recoil better due to the weight but then you have to push that weight around during the stage.

I'll be shooting my "Outlaw" 6.5 inch 610 in USPSA this year along with a 5 inch (cut down) model.

Do you have a preference? 5 or 6.5? I guess what I'm asking is which you'd pick if you could have only one.

I haven't had enough time to shoot the 5 inch gun so I can't really say, I like my "Outlaw" 610

a lot as it weights about the same as a 5" but has the 6.5" sight radius.

Also, as I mentioned, getting a 5 inch is an expensive deal, making one out of a 6.5" will cost as much

as buying a 5" (well maybe a little less ) but then you won't be beating up a collectible.

I've shot the stock 6.5" 610 fine this past year so I think I would stick with that if I had to choose one.

[sargenv]

I prefer the longer sight radius and weight of the 6.5" bbl. As soon as S&W pays the California Bribe list (aka the safe handgun list) and allow the new 610 into the state again, I have a standing order for a 6.5" model. Though MichaelS said he talked to S&W @ the SHOT show and that might not be happening.. I just hope the guy I talked to at S&W is more correct than the guys he talked to.

[10mmdave]

I prefer the longer sight radius and weight of the 6.5" bbl. As soon as S&W pays the California Bribe list (aka the safe handgun list) and allow the new 610 into the state again, I have a standing order for a 6.5" model. Though MichaelS said he talked to S&W @ the SHOT show and that might not be happening.. I just hope the guy I talked to at S&W is more correct than the guys he talked to.

Hope it works out for you Sargenv, we have some of the same stupid rules/laws here in Massachushits

[Glenn Tracey]

The accuracy thing...... Two years ago I sent a NIB 25-2, and a used 5" 625-2 up to S&W to have some work done on both. That was before I learned some Forum members could turn out better actions than S&W. I'm sure S&W could, but won't, because of their liability concerns.

Regardless. The 25-2 (Model of 1955), I was told By the Smith @Smith, was never thought of as a "really accurate" revolver, even though it supposedly was a "target" piece. My 625-2 was re-barreled with the Mikulek barrel configuration and special short cylinder, to match my Performance Center 625-7 Mikulek style & the 5" .bbl was relagated to the parts drawer.

Okay, they both come back. The 25-2 has a test target......one ragged hole using 230 gr. JHP of some unknown brand. It's not been fired since. The newly barreled 625's test target had one flyer and five decently touching, but not what I would call a match perfect group. But after several thousand rounds that 625 barrel has finally come into it's own and from a hand held rest, it is one ragged hole with 230 gr. ball.

Somewhere during my dickering (the 625 had to go back twice) with the Smith's at Smith we talked the 610.

After all the above here is the upshot.

The 25-2 wasn't considered by S&W to be "really accurate". Some were. Most apparently weren't. At least I have one that is, though I confess I don't know how they measure "accurate".

On the other hand, the same "Smith" said that they, (S&W) found the 610 was possibly the most accurate centerfire revolver they ever made throughout that era. No reason given because I was too stupid to ask why that was so. I shoot the 625 or 610 equally well, or bad. Out of the four 625's and three 610's I own I can't find any difference in the accuracy once I find the right ammo combination. All are highly accurate enough for the IPSC "A" Zone though I only get there about half the time. For some reason, my 4" 610 gets more double taps into the target and I seem to enjoy shooting it more than the .45's. Anyway, you now know what the Manufacturer's thought was the most accurate of the two.

[snertley]

I got a 686 cut for moons by Bob Miles and it works great with moons or not. He doesnt cut the cylinder all the way flush so you dont have to use moons if you dont want too.

The last year I have been shooting USPSA with my 610 6.5" and having a blast. I won a slot to nationals with it and hope to make a good showing there. The only thing ive done to my 610 is have the cylinder chamfered pretty aggesively.

Ive been using WWB 165gr in Ranch moon clips with good result. The gun shoots better than me. I have been using the Bianchi cup 002 holster i bought like 12yrs ago for my 686. I did take the heat gun to it to open it up a little, but i may take the dremel tool to it soon just to speed it up a bit. Good luck.

[10mmdave]

I got a 686 cut for moons by Bob Miles and it works great with moons or not. He doesnt cut the cylinder all the way flush so you dont have to use moons if you dont want too.

The last year I have been shooting USPSA with my 610 6.5" and having a blast. I won a slot to nationals with it and hope to make a good showing there. The only thing ive done to my 610 is have the cylinder chamfered pretty aggesively.

Ive been using WWB 165gr in Ranch moon clips with good result. The gun shoots better than me. I have been using the Bianchi cup 002 holster i bought like 12yrs ago for my 686. I did take the heat gun to it to open it up a little, but i may take the dremel tool to it soon just to speed it up a bit. Good luck.

What's your power factor with that WWB ? always looking for off the shelf ammo to try !

[10mmdave]

The 25-2 wasn't considered by S&W to be "really accurate". Some were. Most apparently weren't. At least I have one that is, though I confess I don't know how they measure "accurate".

On the other hand, the same "Smith" said that they, (S&W) found the 610 was possibly the most accurate centerfire revolver they ever made throughout that era. No reason given because I was too stupid to ask why that was so. I shoot the 625 or 610 equally well, or bad. Out of the four 625's and three 610's I own I can't find any difference in the accuracy once I find the right ammo combination. All are highly accurate enough for the IPSC "A" Zone though I only get there about half the time. For some reason, my 4" 610 gets more double taps into the target and I seem to enjoy shooting it more than the .45's. Anyway, you now know what the Manufacturer's thought was the most accurate of the two.

I think Glenn's last paragraph sum's up very well, it dosen't matter what you shoot, barrel length, caliber, whatever

Some shoot L frames better than N frames, it's how well YOU shoot that particular revo.

So just dig around in that safe and drag out that round gun and git to it

[Carmoney]

That was before I learned some Forum members could turn out better actions than S&W. I'm sure S&W could, but won't, because of their liability concerns.

I can't imagine a bona fide liability concern over smoothing and lightening a double-action mechanism on a revolver that typically leaves the factory with a 2-pound single-action trigger pull. I just think most of the people at the factory who knew how to turn out a decent action job are now long-retired. The "action jobs" that are supposedly done on some of the current Performance Center guns are an embarrassment. I've seen better double-action pulls on Swingline staple guns.

[snertley]

If my memory is right the WWB stuff makes like 175 pf. It has made it in every match that they have chono'd. I remember last year at the WI section match the guys were very suprised at the consistancy in the ammo. I think the hight to low spread was only 2fps.

[10mmdave]

If my memory is right the WWB stuff makes like 175 pf. It has made it in every match that they have chono'd. I remember last year at the WI section match the guys were very suprised at the consistancy in the ammo. I think the hight to low spread was only 2fps.

Thanks for the info, I'll have to pick up a box (jeez, wonder what that will cost ) and try 'em out !

[DougCarden]

Dave, the WWB 165 fmj runs about 170 through my 5in STi....FWIW......violent and I didnt like it at all....

DougC

[snertley]

The WWB shot very nice in my 6.5" 610 and I didnt feel a great deal of recoil with my XD tactical either. The WWB is all ive shot for the last 3yrs. (just started the Revo USPSA stuff last June). I guess its all subjective. I has shot very clean in both guns. But then again I do shoot full power Ball Ammo in my Single stacks in matches!

Edited February 14, 2008 by snertley

[10mmdave]

Dave, the WWB 165 fmj runs about 170 through my 5in STi....FWIW......violent and I didnt like it at all....

DougC

Of course it was violent Doug !!

what with that big hunk of steel sliding back and forth in front of your eyeball

[snertley]

I found my score sheet from the Chrono stage at last falls Area 3.

WWB 165gr

1066fps

1069fps

1071fps

average 1068

PF 176.3

This is almost the exact same as I get out of my 5" XD .

[m627]

New guy here....shooting ICORE & speed steel at Saddle Butte near Shedd Oregon.....using 4" 610 with astounding performance....

loading cast lead 180 RNFP and FTCs with good effect; prefer Unique powder at this point. Gotta go, will be back...

[snertley]

Velcomen

[Guninhand]

If you load a good quality JHP bullet (like Montana's excellent 230 gr. JHP or 185 gr. JHP) you can get great groups at any velocity. JHP's fly well at low speeds because they stabilize easily since their mass is more centralized, like a HBWC. Same goes for SWC's. But now your reload's going to suck, and who needs all that much accuracy in USPSA?

Great info. Anyone try the 230 gr JHP in .45GAP brass in a 625?

[mwx40x40]

If you load a good quality JHP bullet (like Montana's excellent 230 gr. JHP or 185 gr. JHP) you can get great groups at any velocity. JHP's fly well at low speeds because they stabilize easily since their mass is more centralized, like a HBWC. Same goes for SWC's. But now your reload's going to suck, and who needs all that much accuracy in USPSA?

Great info. Anyone try the 230 gr JHP in .45GAP brass in a 625?

I tried it and was unimpressed. Rim of the GAP is slightly different than ACP. They fit my moonclips really loose. Not to mention accuracy seemed to fall off. That being said , I seem to remember one of the better roundgun shooters on this forum having a lot better luck with them.