9 Major Brass Sorting

[austinkroe]

Ok, I did a search and I didn't find information to my satisfaction. So, I went through and read all 41 pages of this sub-forum and still didn't find what I wanted.

How do you all sort out brass for 9 major? What are the defects you look for and where? I already sort my brass by headstamp and I was wondering what more I need to do. I am thinking about getting a 9 major gun and from what I have read the key to safety is using good brass (STI variants built well can take the pressures of reasonably and safely loaded ammo).

Are extractor/ejector marks acceptable?

What else is there to look for besides cracked cases(scratched maybe?)?

I read about checking the case OD after firing to check for pressure but I didn't understand. Anyone care to explain?

How do you tell when a primer pocket is getting loose?

Does an EGW sizing die work the brass too much to be safe at 9 major pressures?

What happens to the gun if bad brass is used at normal 9 major pressures (blown barrel, permanent damage to the gun, etc.)? What does a blown casehead do to the gun?

Any brass not to use specifically (I have WIN, R-P, WCC, and FC)?

For those loading it multiple times: how do you know when it is time to toss the brass?

I think I have the powder, OAL, and primers down from the considerable reading I have done but are there any other tips regarding brass or safety I might not have covered that are exclusive to 9 major? I know I asked a lot of questions but in regards to brass I have seen "once fired and leave it". There are others at my club loading 9 MINOR and I want to know if I pick something up that has multiple loading at minor that I would be safe if I follow good brass QC. I just don't know what good brass QC is because I have only loaded for 9 minor and 45 and all I really look for there is really nasty brass.

TIA

Edited December 10, 2007 by austinkroe

[n2ipsc]

For my major 9's, I...

• Chuck anything that has significant ejector marks or chewed rims (extractor)
  Chuck anything that has smeared or flattened lettering on the casehead
  Chuck anything that has an obvious expansion ring near the base of the case
  Chuck anything that has badly flattened/smeared primers/obvious high pressure signs
  Chuck anything that is split
  

While loading, I also chuck any case where the primer doesn't seat with some resistance (i.e. loose primer pockets) - if it seats freely with no resistance, I'd much rather lose a primer than my breechface.

I also look for obvious bright expansion rings after sizing through an EGW undersized die - may have escaped initial inspection and been worked hard when sizing (PS - case lube is your friend).

Although I prefer single headstamps (Win, Fed, R-P), I'm using some batches of mixed brass with no apparent problems or issues, so I can't speak to "good" or "bad" brands (other than to note that the vast preponderance of the loose primer pockets I encounter seem to be with PMC cases).

Re. loading multiple times...I don't. The whole point of 9mm major, for me, is to not sweat getting my brass back (laziness, if you like)...

Re. effects of a casehead separation or the like...can't speak to it, haven't seen it (in a handgun, anyway), haven't experienced it.

[Carlos]

The 9mm case is far stronger than most people give it credit for - the widespread use of Major9 proves it.

BUT, I have heard of exaclty TWO (2) case failures with it and I own one of the failed cases; that case had probably been loaded 10 or more times and it showed evidence of haveing been to a commercial reloader (the pocket was machine-cut to remove the possibility of primer crimp).

THe key is to start with verified ONCE FIRED brass. The failed case given to me by a friend was bought off the web and was advertized as "once fired" - but that turned out to be false.

Buy/obtain brass from a source you trust. My Nagel built Major 9 Glock gets only 9mm brass given to me by friends in law enforcement; their range is closed to the public and the brass is all true once fired.

I get about 4 or 5 loadings from mine before I lose them or relegate them to Minor use.

One other point: there is one brand of 9mm that you can visually verify as once fired: S&B. The factory primers are sealed in red & its easy to see if these cases have been to a commercial reloader (avoid commercially reloaded cases at all costs; they often have many many loads on them and often fail). True, the high-quality machined primer pockets do have a sharp edge due to their precision process. BUT, these are very very strong and well made cases.

[SA Friday]

For my major 9's, I...

• Chuck anything that has significant ejector marks or chewed rims (extractor)
  Chuck anything that has smeared or flattened lettering on the casehead
  Chuck anything that has an obvious expansion ring near the base of the case
  Chuck anything that has badly flattened/smeared primers/obvious high pressure signs
  Chuck anything that is split
  

Excellent list. I would add two: any brass that I feel takes above average motivation to resize, and anything with an unknown headstamp. I usually throw out all foreign headstamps too. I really focus on the primers If they are hammered flat, I toss them out. The only exception to this is some Military stuff I get in bulk and I know is only once-fired.

If you know the 9mm brass was shot out of a SMG, chuck it. I have see quite a few SMG fired rounds fail at minor pf's. Driver8M3 had a rash of about 5 of these for a week or so. They blew out right near the base, but didn't separate.

[smokshwn]

mmmmmm, let's see if I can explain the complexity of my brass sorting/loading/examination process. Buy brass, clean if necessary, load, shoot, leave on ground, repeat.

I am right at 35k rds and have not noticed any significant problems loading for 9mm major at all. For a little while there seemed to be a run of Speer brass that had case rims that were a little thick as some would not slide into the shellplate slots, and occasionally a primer will hang up on the brass that was originally loaded with a non toxic primer. Other than that, IMHO if you keep your load within reason and most importantly YOUR GUN AND MAGS ARE SET UP CORRECTLY FOR 9MM (mine was done by Dan Bedell) you shouldn't see any significant problems.

Edited December 10, 2007 by smokshwn

[austinkroe]

Chuck anything that has an obvious expansion ring near the base of the case

Can you tell me more about what an expansion ring is? Is it like a guppy-belly? (After going through the EGW die the brass looks more polished where the die touched it, does that have anything to do with it?)

Edited December 10, 2007 by austinkroe

[AWLAZS]

mmmmmm, let's see if I can explain the complexity of my brass sorting/loading/examination process. Buy brass, clean if necessary, load, shoot, leave on ground, repeat.

if you keep your load within reason and most importantly YOUR GUN AND MAGS ARE SET UP CORRECTLY FOR 9MM (mine was done by Dan Bedell) you shouldn't see any significant problems.

Hey thats the same way I do it

[JThompson]

I pull them from our range after I see someone shooting white box or the like. I reload them 8 times or so doing no real inspection. I do feel for easy/hard resize and primer seat. Other than that I do nothing and haven't had a problem. After 8 times or so I throw them in a box for lost brass matches and rotate to the next batch of once fired.

Edited December 10, 2007 by JThompson

[JThompson]

Chuck anything that has an obvious expansion ring near the base of the case

Can you tell me more about what an expansion ring is? Is it like a guppy-belly? (After going through the EGW die the brass looks more polished where the die touched it, does that have anything to do with it?)

The expansion ring is where the inside of an empty case meets the solid brass base and just above.

This piece of brass is ready for the bone yard... as you can see from the wide expansion area it has been resized many times. As the brass is resized over and over the ring will continue to get larger as it is resized.

Move exact

Edited December 10, 2007 by JThompson

[SA Friday]

If you inspect the outside of the brass just above the base and can see an obvious espansion that ends at distinct line (like a crease) below it, then you are probably dealing with a piece of brass shot at major pf levels. Essentially, it's been guppied to the case webbing and that's where the crease has come from.

Flick it into the brass scrap barrel.

[maineshootah]

Flick it into the brass scrap barrel.

My thoughts,

If when loading, the primer doesn't seat, toss in to scrap bin

If when loading the primer falls out, toss in to scrap bin

If the case has any nicks, toss in to scrap bin

if the case doesn't say (Win, Fed, R-P) toss it in the scrap bin

if I don't recognize the brand, toss it in the scrap bin

If the case has funny paint / marker marks on it, that you didn't put there (someone else's brass) toss it to the scrap bin

If the case lands in muddy conditions leave it

If the

If the case does not pass the case guage, pull the bullet, toss the case in the scrap bin

If the case lands in the snow, leave it until May.

[Harmon]

i toss any that are not normal manufacture(FC, R-P, winchester, Fiocchi, Geco)

any that are cracked or bulged go to the scrap brass bin to be sold.

Load them once and leave them.

Harmon

[coltgov]

I'm a pig!

I load everything unless the primer falls out, or the rim is deformed.

If it doesn't pass the case guage, I use it for the barney rd when I "load and make ready". If it doesn't chamber, then I toss it.

I'm very impressed with 9mm. It's real durable!

[Harmon]

untill you have one let go..and you will change your mind on that...

[warpspeed]

I used to buy once fired brass, roll size and reload to major 9 - shoot once and leave on the range.

I now do exactly the same except it gets picked up and put in the recycle bin. I took a 5 gal bucket of mixed brass to the recyclers and got $ 70.00 cash.

I'm sure that it could be reloaded a couple of times but the whole reason for 9 major was to not have to pick up brass to reload. If I was going to do that I'd stick 38 supercomp or 9 x 23.

And I would not pick up range brass in 9 x19 to reload at major PF.

[blkbrd]

I have blown a few 9mm cases in 9mm Major, and even a Win. white box in production gun.

Necks crack quite often while resizing range brass.

I have learned not to use once fired from an unknown source, got hold of a bunch of machine gun brass and blew a couple of cases like this.

Out of 7 or so case separations in my 9mm Open gun, a couple in my 40 Limited gun, and one in a 9mm Glock using new WWB. One blew so violently I jerked my head so hard my glasses came off and another blew the gun out of my hand, most have blown the mag out of the gun.

Knock on wood.....I have never damage to me or the gun, but I do look at the case head juncture. I have found a few once fired cases where the crack was already there just waiting for me.

I dont separate by brand, as I have found the "best" brand is the one that fails the most?

Edited March 23, 2008 by blkbrd

[warpspeed]

Nice pictures

I've blown a couple but none that bad. And none in major pf, always minor loads. Perhaps the fast powder has something to do with it.

[Harmon]

i had a gunshow reload that someone give me a box of let go. pulled the remaining bullets and it looks like they were loading 125 grain FMJ bullets with CLAYS powder.

the case that blew was marked LY92

Harmon

[Don_B]

I have blown a few 9mm cases in 9mm Major, and even a Win. white box in production gun.

Necks crack quite often while resizing range brass.

I have learned not to use once fired from an unknown source, got hold of a bunch of machine gun brass and blew a couple of cases like this.

Out of 7 or so case separations in my 9mm Open gun, a couple in my 40 Limited gun, and one in a 9mm Glock using new WWB. One blew so violently I jerked my head so hard my glasses came off and another blew the gun out of my hand, most have blown the mag out of the gun.

Knock on wood.....I have never damage to me or the gun, but I do look at the case head juncture. I have found a few once fired cases where the crack was already there just waiting for me.

I dont separate by brand, as I have found the "best" brand is the one that fails the most?

Just from looking at the photos of the seperated cases it appears that the cases may not be supported properly. May be something you want to check.

I have been shooting Major 9 for over 2 years and have not had anything like that.

[Harmon]

all my seperations(2 total) have been in fully supported STI barrels

one 40 caliber and one 9mm

never has a supercomp brass let go on me.

Harmon

[blkbrd]

Except for the Glock one with factory white box which I suspect may have been slightly out of battery, they have all been in a fully supported chamber. This out of over 35K in over 3 years.

My bet is most once fired brass is fired from Glocks in an unsupported chamber, when this is fired then resized it stresses the case juncture with the base. It almost looks like in each case the case is not fully secured to the base in the first place.

If you section a Winchester White box 9mm case you can see the separation line, almost looks like it is welded together not forged in one piece. Would love to see how they are actually made.

I have picked up Super brass that you could see the cracks just not as spectacular, better quality control, lower pressures and less flow from the original chambers?????

Just from looking at the photos of the seperated cases it appears that the cases may not be supported properly. May be something you want to check.

I have been shooting Major 9 for over 2 years and have not had anything like that.

Edited March 24, 2008 by blkbrd

[Don_B]

Except for the Glock one with factory white box which I suspect may have been slightly out of battery, they have all been in a fully supported chamber. This out of over 35K in over 3 years.

My bet is most once fired brass is fired from Glocks in an unsupported chamber, when this is fired then resized it stresses the case juncture with the base. It almost looks like in each case the case is not fully secured to the base in the first place.

" That could very well be the problem, from my experience I have found the Win brass to be on of the better ones."

If you section a Winchester White box 9mm case you can see the separation line, almost looks like it is welded together not forged in one piece. Would love to see how they are actually made.

I have picked up Super brass that you could see the cracks just not as spectacular, better quality control, lower pressures and less flow from the original chambers?????

Just from looking at the photos of the seperated cases it appears that the cases may not be supported properly. May be something you want to check.

I have been shooting Major 9 for over 2 years and have not had anything like that.

[HoMiE]

untill you have one let go..and you will change your mind on that...

Happened to me today! I usual sort my brass but a PMC case slipped into the mix.

[ALF]

The whole idea with 9 Major at least for me is that one never have to pick brass again. To reload cases that have been loaded to major is no problem.I think that one can reload the cases at least five times, without any problems. I just dont do it though. And I only use once fired brass.Also sort brass by the headstamp.For match use is Norma and Fiocchi my choice. The Norma cases seem to stand up to the pressure better than any other brand that I have tried with the Fiocchi a close second.

Edited May 3, 2008 by ALF

[safenate]

The whole idea with 9 Major at least for me is that one never have to pick brass again. To reload cases that have been loaded to major is no problem.I think that one can reload the cases at least five times, without any problems. I just dont do it though. And I only use once fired brass.Also sort brass by the headstamp.For match use is Norma and Fiocchi my choice. The Norma cases seem to stand up to the pressure better than any other brand that I have tried with the Fiocchi a close second.

HoMie,

That make ya pucker up a bit? Any firearm damage?

nate