2007 Florida State Championship

[L9X25]

The news claims that the fire is 100% contained, CR 630 has been reopened and residents are all returning to their homes. That is good news for us all. With any luck the only annoyance will be the constant smell.

[blkbrd]

Oh great, add asthma to the list of problems I am having this week.

[L9X25]

Oh great, add asthma to the list of problems I am having this week.

Your back and allergies may be the only way someone can beat you!

[blkbrd]

I just figured it all out,,,,,ITS ALL A GIANT CONSPIRACY.......

My big match results at Frostproof prove this.

[Big Guy]

Any volunteers for “Beer Friday”???

[zhunter]

I am totally ready.

I have been dry-firing my A$$ off for days trying to get ready.

Gonna shoot a match tonight as a warm up.

Can't wait for Sat. morning.

[L9X25]

Registration will be at the range from 2:00 PM to 5:00 PM on Friday, or Saturday morning from 6:30 AM to 8:00 AM.

Shooting starts at 8:00 AM on Saturday and Sunday.

Edited March 29, 2007 by L9X25

[Nemo]

Any volunteers for “Beer Friday”???

Hmmm... Beer... I'll be at the match hotel at around 6 or 7 tonight. Of course we can do beer!

[Big Guy]

Mr. Nemo,

I will be at the range around 3:30-4:00, should I pickup your registration package?

Edited March 30, 2007 by Big Guy

[Nemo]

Yes please, Mr. BG.

See ya' tonight.

[Nemo]

Back home after a fun match. Kudos to Manny, Wadette and all the other organizers. Stage were good, I believe a reminiscent of the FLOpen. I didn't stay for the awards but Congratulations to the winners and state champs. Shannon took limited and I believe Sharyn was top lady. Todd Marshall took single stack and Cliff Walsh did his usual thing with the roundgun.

The match reiterated something that I already knew: EMBEDDED RANGE OFFICERS SYSTEM DOES NOT WORK FOR MAJOR MATCHES! It is not consistent, it is not impartial, it creates unfair advantages to some. Sorry but I saw it today. If match organizers have to resort to this system just for financial reasons, I'll take a cheaper plaque or none at all but PLEASE don't do this.

Another lesson learned: If I'm not ready to shoot, don't get to the line, tell the RO "I'm not ready" (see revolver result for stage 4 )

'Til next year, unless they use embedded ro's again.

[L9X25]

The results are up: HERE

[Big Guy]

Note to self: Don’t ever shoot any other major match with embedded RO’s!!!!

[PaulW]

Squad 5 had NO problems with the embedded R/O's at all. understand where your problem lies, but being HONEST and FAIR should be the standard. I was personally the R/O on several close, questionable calls. What did I do? I pulled the target and let the range master make his money. And some of these calls went against some of my very good friends. But I did not let that effect my judement what-so-ever.

GREAT job Wadette, who really does not get nearly enough praise that she should. And of course to class act Manny who is always fun to be around. Fun stages, good weather and good friends.

[zhunter]

CONGRATS to PaulW for being the NEW Florida State Open Champion

CONGRATS to SmittyFL for winning his 4th consecutive Florida State Limited Crown!!

Maybe the Trophy should be named, the Shannon Smith Trophy now!! Not joking either!!

Hey, now I can say, I know that guy!!!

And to reiterate, Wadette is the backbone of the Florida Open and the Florida State Match!!

Thanks to everyone!!

Edited April 2, 2007 by zhunter

[Sandro]

CONGRATS to PaulW for being the NEW Florida State Open Champion

CONGRATS to SmittyFL for winning his 4th consecutive Florida State Limited Crown!!

Maybe the Trophy should be named, the Shannon Smith Trophy now!! Not joking either!!

Hey, now I can say, I know that guy!!!

And to reiterate, Wadette is the backbone of the Florida Open and the Florida State Match!!

Thanks to everyone!!

Congrats to Kevin Insco as well. He got HOA for production with his Glock.

+1 for Wadette, she did it again! Thanks Wadette!!!

Great match, the weather was perfect and the stages were good too.

Sandro

[BEDELLCUSTOM]

congratulations Paul on winning that big old Florida state trophy. Sorry I had to send my buddy John Guida down there to show you how much he likes his shorty open gun Sounds like you all had a good time and I hear it was a great match Edited April 2, 2007 by BEDELLCUSTOM

[Nemo]

Congratulations Paul and Kevin!

[Kevin Kline]

Thanks Sandro and Nemo. I shot a clean match and wasn't quite sure exactly where I'd be until I checked the scores at the end. I think I was almost as happy beating Ernie Langdon (a former National Champion) as I was winning Production.

Can't wait for Area 6. Congrats to Paul, Shannon, Cliff, Marshall, John Guida and Harry, and I can't forget Wadette, cause w/out her, this wouldn't have happened. The weather was perfect.

[baa]

Congrats to Paul, Smitty, and Kevin!

It was a fun weekend. The weather was great. I couldn't have wished for a better squad to spend a weekend shooting. Our embedded RO did a good job (thanks Eric) but I know other squads had issues and there was a lack of consistency on how some of the stages were run.

[AA-Wolf]

Congrats Paul.

This is where your streak begins!

Great match and good job to all the winners.

See everyone next year.

Edited April 2, 2007 by AA-Wolf

[Bwana Six-Gun]

Back home after a fun match. Kudos to Manny, Wadette and all the other organizers. Stage were good, I believe a reminiscent of the FLOpen. I didn't stay for the awards but Congratulations to the winners and state champs. Shannon took limited and I believe Sharyn was top lady. Todd Marshall took single stack and Cliff Walsh did his usual thing with the roundgun.

The match reiterated something that I already knew: EMBEDDED RANGE OFFICERS SYSTEM DOES NOT WORK FOR MAJOR MATCHES! It is not consistent, it is not impartial, it creates unfair advantages to some. Sorry but I saw it today. If match organizers have to resort to this system just for financial reasons, I'll take a cheaper plaque or none at all but PLEASE don't do this.

Another lesson learned: If I'm not ready to shoot, don't get to the line, tell the RO "I'm not ready" (see revolver result for stage 4 )

'Til next year, unless they use embedded ro's again.

By "Embedded RO's" I assume you mean RO's that travelled with each squad as opposed to dedicated RO's on each stage? That's great for local matches, but why would they use that system at a major match, and what was the problem? If this will open a can of worms, don't bother to answer that last question.

[Radical Precision Designs]

Back home after a fun match. Kudos to Manny, Wadette and all the other organizers. Stage were good, I believe a reminiscent of the FLOpen. I didn't stay for the awards but Congratulations to the winners and state champs. Shannon took limited and I believe Sharyn was top lady. Todd Marshall took single stack and Cliff Walsh did his usual thing with the roundgun.

The match reiterated something that I already knew: EMBEDDED RANGE OFFICERS SYSTEM DOES NOT WORK FOR MAJOR MATCHES! It is not consistent, it is not impartial, it creates unfair advantages to some. Sorry but I saw it today. If match organizers have to resort to this system just for financial reasons, I'll take a cheaper plaque or none at all but PLEASE don't do this.

Another lesson learned: If I'm not ready to shoot, don't get to the line, tell the RO "I'm not ready" (see revolver result for stage 4 )

'Til next year, unless they use embedded ro's again.

By "Embedded RO's" I assume you mean RO's that travelled with each squad as opposed to dedicated RO's on each stage? That's great for local matches, but why would they use that system at a major match, and what was the problem? If this will open a can of worms, don't bother to answer that last question.

Not a "can of worms" to be opened here. No sir.

The system could work, as opposed to "can" work...

The problem as noted is one of consistency, and familiarity. While some squads get along just fine with what they got others do not. Usually at most big matches there wil be an RO which for some reason or another will be disliked. Imagine if you got stuck with that one while other squads had their "sweet-hearts". The biggests problem seems to be that the stages get treated like "local/friendly matches" (nothing really wrong with that), but while there may be some leniency shown (which shouldn't) towards some, others may be picked upon. If the embedded RO would officiate every single shooter and held a rigid, authoritative outlook, commanding respect and not allowing variations in the scoring, it maight work. Such RO would shoot as the first shooter (and show everybody "how is done") and then be free to officiate over the rest of the shooter, perhaps switching the SO as needed to accomodate the shooting schedule. The situations I noticed in various squads was mostly related as to the times when the RO/SO duties were "farmed" to other "rotating" shooters in the squad. The consistency invariably was lost then. Many targets were pasted before either the RO or the shooter, or even the SO got to look at them while the scores were shouted (from afar) to the score-keeper.

I observed as a few people got entangled in the right side port with the resulting "leg trap" rope from the swinger activator in Stage #4. In more than one squad. I assumed it would be fixed eventually. It wasn't. I was one of the "stupid ones" who even though I knew of the possibility got entangled and almost had a real bad accident. It is almost as if that rope had a life of its own. I could swear that it actually went out of its way to wrap itself aorund my right foot with "two" turns around it, making virtually impossible for me to remove it as I was holding a gun in my right hand and a magazine (mag change) in my left and hanging on my left leg (the one with the "artificial knee") and looking frantly at the RO with a bewildered look, trying not to fall in my face. I though I had given it (the hanging rope) a wide berth, but I guess it was longer and farther reaching that I thought. I won't tell you of the final outcome as it is really irelevant, and it was our final stage. I almost got DQ'd for allowing my gun to point upwards a little too far while trying not to fall. Now, nothing here (in my "mad-cap") has much to do with the "embedded RO", but I wonder if a permanent RO in that stage would haave allowed that situation to endure the entire match.

At the Florida Sectional in Titusville, the embedded RO's set-up worked out fine (although there were a few complaints there too). But it seems to be that really for major matches it is NOT a great idea. I wonder how many "calls" were placed to the RM or MD to settle the fact that some shooters did not "respect" the RO's calls against them, versus the same with dedicated RO's ???

Not a can of worms to be opened here. Just some fair discussion of possibilities, strong points and weak points towards a practice that may be here with us in the future. After all we do not want to loose shooters attendance at major matches because of this trend. Is this the way of the future for RO'ing ??????

Moderator:

If you feel this response does not belong here, feel free to remove it or move it elsewhere.

[XRe]

Well, so here's the thing. Embedded ROs make certain things easier as far as scheduling ROs for the match. However, even if everything is done by the book by every RO, there's still going to be people who feel that either someone is given unfair advantage "by their buddy", or that someone got the bum steer, or got picked on, by someone who's not their buddy. With fixed ROs, you could get that stuff, too - but only for one stage of the match, instead of the whole match. You also tend to lose the consistency of stage operation, etc - and, if RDP's assertion of the RO not actually doing the scoring is also how it happened, well... you don't have a "professionally" run match.

Further - as RDP points out, you lose the consistency of one group of guys running each stage, and being able to handle the various issues that crop up w/ equipment, etc.

I totally respect why the decision was made to run embedded ROs, and it didn't affect me personally (cause I wasn't at the match) - it isn't the way I'd choose to run a match, personally, though, for those reasons....

[L9X25]

I observed as a few people got entangled in the right side port with the resulting "leg trap" rope from the swinger activator in Stage #4. In more than one squad. I assumed it would be fixed eventually. It wasn't. I was one of the "stupid ones" who even though I knew of the possibility got entangled and almost had a real bad accident. It is almost as if that rope had a life of its own. I could swear that it actually went out of its way to wrap itself aorund my right foot with "two" turns around it, making virtually impossible for me to remove it as I was holding a gun in my right hand and a magazine (mag change) in my left and hanging on my left leg (the one with the "artificial knee") and looking frantly at the RO with a bewildered look, trying not to fall in my face. I though I had given it (the hanging rope) a wide berth, but I guess it was longer and farther reaching that I thought. I won't tell you of the final outcome as it is really irelevant, and it was our final stage. I almost got DQ'd for allowing my gun to point upwards a little too far while trying not to fall. Now, nothing here (in my "mad-cap") has much to do with the "embedded RO", but I wonder if a permanent RO in that stage would haave allowed that situation to endure the entire match.

Venry,

The situation was examined, likely more than once, but the conclusion was that a significant change in the stage would either make the stage more unsafe or result in an advantage/disadvantage for folks that shot it afterward. Two folks on my squad became entangled in the rope. One was not aware until he was told (lost a magazine that he never needed anyway) and another had to drag the rope with him to the last position. It was a distraction but not earthshattering. Since pulling the rope safely was within the competitors control, subsequent shooters were advised to be careful of the direction that they chose to pull the rope to avoid entanglement and the situation was not significant (in my view) from that point on.