Scoring question - overall

[mpmo]

New shooter. I’ve shot a handful of local USPSA matches over the past couple months. I’m typically placing in the top 40% overall.

 

When I Look at the overall match on practiscore I’m not clear on how shooters are ranked. Is there a handicap added/subtracted for shooting certain divisions? Is HF calculated differently for different divisions?

 

I’ve played a bit with the what if function changing my division to another but don’t see much movement in my rankings when I do that. I’m just curious if I would be more competitive if I moved to another division. Obviously there are a lot of things to consider with this but I guess I wanted to understand how players are ranked overall as one data point.

[Explosiveo]

Overall is not a thing. Your only competing against your division.
You may place higher in the overall rank if you shoot a hicap division. It may even make you more compeditive. But really your compeditors are the people in your division and class. Look more at how you are finishing against them.

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[stick]

21 minutes ago, Explosiveo said:

Overall is not a thing. Your only competing against your division.
You may place higher in the overall rank if you shoot a hicap division. It may even make you more compeditive. But really your compeditors are the people in your division and class. Look more at how you are finishing against them.

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My thoughts exactly!  

[SGT_Schultz]

43 minutes ago, mpmo said:

 

New shooter. I’ve shot a handful of local USPSA matches over the past couple months. I’m typically placing in the top 40% overall.

 

When I Look at the overall match on practiscore I’m not clear on how shooters are ranked. Is there a handicap added/subtracted for shooting certain divisions? Is HF calculated differently for different divisions?

 

I’ve played a bit with the what if function changing my division to another but don’t see much movement in my rankings when I do that. I’m just curious if I would be more competitive if I moved to another division. Obviously there are a lot of things to consider with this but I guess I wanted to understand how players are ranked overall as one data point.

 

 

When PS calculates the overall rankings, the math is the same as it is for division rankings but it lumps ALL shooters together for each stage.

 

So, for example take "stage 1"....for overall, PS ranks all shooters, regardless of division, from highest hit factor to lowest.  The stage points are assigned in the normal manner.  Highest hit factor for that stage gets all the possible stage points.  All the other shooters get their % of max stage points based on their hit factor percentage.

 

That gets repeated for every stage.  Once all the stage points are awarded, all shooters are ranked from highest total number of stage points to lowest.

 

Switching divisions will likely not make you rank higher if you're fairly new or inexperienced.

 

Personally, IDGAF about overall rankings.  I shoot Carry Optics and that's the only ranking I concern myself with.

[MemphisMechanic]

If your accuracy is lousy you WOULD see a small bump in placement by switching to Major powerfactor in limited or open, if you currently shoot minor.

 

However for a novice shooting at 40% the problem isn’t equipment. It’s speed. The guys finishing at 80%+ in the overalls are probably shooting the match 30+ seconds faster than you with better accuracy.

 

Learn to do everything faster. ESPECIALLY move between positions like you’re an actual athelete in an actual sport. Have someone film you on a stage with movement. Compare what you see to someone at the top. I believe you’ll find much of your answer.

 

Edited August 9, 2020 by MemphisMechanic

[mpmo]

If your accuracy is lousy you WOULD see a small bump in placement by switching to Major powerfactor in limited or open, if you currently shoot minor.
 
However for a novice shooting at 40% the problem isn’t equipment. It’s speed. The guys finishing at 80%+ in the overalls are probably shooting the match 30+ seconds faster than you with better accuracy.
 
Learn to do everything faster. ESPECIALLY move between positions like you’re an actual athelete in an actual sport. Have someone film you on a stage with movement. Compare what you see to someone at the top. I believe you’ll find much of your answer.
 

That I makes sense. To clarify, I’m finishing in the top 40% in overall.

One of the reasons I was looking at overall was at the last match, there were only 3 shooters in my division out of 37 people which provided limited information on where I stood. That being said, there was still plenty of info there when looking at the time, hits and HF.

I finished 3 out of 3 in my division (Limited) but 14th out of 37 overall.

[-JCN-]

2 hours ago, Explosiveo said:

Overall is not a thing. Your only competing against your division.
You may place higher in the overall rank if you shoot a hicap division. It may even make you more compeditive. But really your compeditors are the people in your division and class. Look more at how you are finishing against them.

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Overall is still a thing. Ignoring data ignores data and a chance for learning. 
 

There is a lot to be able to tease out from relative rank in the overall, it just takes a little more assessment. 
 

If you were shooting CO and the other people in your division stank, but Production was strong in your region you could still get comparative data from looking at how you did against Production. If they beat you in speed or accuracy anywhere, you’re too slow and inaccurate. 
 

And if the players in Production are pretty stable in their progress, you could loosely compare against them as the season goes on for a sense of your progress. 

[rowdyb]

Not being pedantic but do you know and understand how you're scored on a stage and in a match generally?

 

And to think old bill Comstock came up with this scoring before personal calculators...

Edited August 9, 2020 by rowdyb

[mpmo]

Not being pedantic but do you know and understand how you're scored on a stage and in a match generally?
 
And to think old bill Comstock came up with this scoring before personal calculators...

Yes. I believe I have a pretty good understanding.

[Joe4d]

Not sure you do.
Overall is irrelevant. Your data is meaningless without a stage break down and division break down,
Far as stages round count and reload points can make a big difference or no difference between divisions.
14/37 for a Limited gun is great if match was full of CO, Open and other Limited shooters. 
Kinda blows if your match was full of production, SS and revolver shooters.
Use classifiers to track your progress and improvement. You are comparing apples to apples. World wide folks shooting same stage, same equipment rules.
Once again,,, overall is kinda meaningless.

[MemphisMechanic]

Also. Ae you shooting 9mm minor in Limited?

 

Then yes, In that case... A weapon/platform/division change could be to your advantage.

 

It’s one of the very few times when your gear is a legitimate (and heavy) handicap. A Major caliber weapon is pretty much required to be competitive in Limited.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 9, 2020 by MemphisMechanic

[rowdyb]

5 hours ago, mpmo said:

I’m t ypically placing in the top 40% overall.

 

When I Look at the overall match on practiscore I’m not clear on how shooters are ranked. Is there a handicap added/subtracted for shooting certain divisions? Is HF calculated differently for different divisions?

  40% overall. .Re your first point almost all people say that instead as "I was 60% of Joe Soandso", rather than "I was in the top 40%" As you're new, just helping you know what is conventional and what most people will understand/expect.

 

I’m not clear on how shooters are ranked  what exactly are you unclear on? there is a 1st place in order of finish down to last place.

 

When I Look at the overall match on practiscore  Do you have a link to the results of you match?

 

Is there a handicap added/subtracted for shooting certain divisions?  There is no handicap added or subtracted in the "overall" after the fact. Their is no "weighting" or "factor" when looking at all the divisions in a overall. There is no good/real way of saying, "well since i shot Production and it's slower and has more reloads and no major scoring then I can add 10% to my score and that's what'd Id be if I shot Open." It's not like Open is 1, PCC is 1.15, Limited is 1.20, CO is 1.25 and so on.

 

Is HF calculated differently for different divisions?   No, HF is only and exactly what the formula is, the points your earned divided by the time you spent getting them. Yes major and minor score differently but that happens before you do the calculation. How they were earned doesn't matter when you go to plug them in. Points are points and time is time.

 

As you're new, prior to practiscore most clubs didn't report an overall score so lots of shooters never really saw that kind of data before. This is why you're getting some push back about looking at overall as it was a non thing before p-score. It is an interesting oddity at local matches to many people and that's it. Why? Because the divisions are pretty different, an individuals skill level makes a huge difference in placing, and stage design can effect scores. This is why you are noticing so many people telling you to just look at the scores within your division, as it is really the only "same same" way to compare yourself.

 

I think you'd do well to watch a few videos on yt or read the older threads here to get a better understanding, especially before playing "what if" and trying to deduce a theoretical competitiveness for yourself.

[rowdyb]

 To read something and to watch something:

https://www.targetbarn.com/broad-side/uspsa-scoring/

 

 

 

[mpmo]

Thanks Rowdyb.  I have read that article a couple times.  That is my primary reference when you asked the question if i understood how scoring works.  Going to watch that video now.