Joeg26er Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 Dangerous Or Not? Slightly Short OAL Reloaded a batch of 124gr 9mm FMJ and after 200 rounds (I Know) I realized I had the OAL at the 115gr FMJ so these are slightly short. OAL 1.125 but should be 1.156 Chamber checks on the G17 shows some hesitate on extraction due to the case mouth hitting the rifling. Case mouth shows some slight knicks. Is this dangerous? Should I pull all 200 rounds and start over? Or relegate to non-competition rounds/plinking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superdude Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 1) What is your load data? 2) Not sure how the case mouth could hit the rifling because the rifling is way ahead of the end of the chamber. Are these cases crimped? What does your crimp measure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joeg26er Posted July 30, 2017 Author Share Posted July 30, 2017 3.6gr Bullseye RCBS carbide dies. that's the only explanation I have when I cycle the shorter rounds they get slight scoring around the case mouth and hesitate on extraction. The marks are in the exact same places around the case mouth on each round cycled. The longer rounds at 1.156 don't get any scoring when cycled through. The die does crimp as all pistol dies do? I will doublecheck the crimp as it could be slightly too much and cause the case mouth to enter a bit too far? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasley Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 1 minute ago, Joeg26er said: The die does crimp as all pistol dies do? Not unless you have the die properly set to crimp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superdude Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 Your load looks safe. Sierra's manual shows a 125 FMJ bullet seated at 1.090 with a range of Bullseye from 3.5 gr (starting load) to 4.4 gr (max load). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joeg26er Posted July 30, 2017 Author Share Posted July 30, 2017 I'm just worried about the strange cuts/scoring on the case mouth and hesitation on extraction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superdude Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 Measure the crimp and get back to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StratRider Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 I had this concern with some new 147 gr bullets I purchased too. Needed to seat them a full .1 shorter than recommended to be usable in my aftermarket barrel. Had discussions with the mfr. also but once I read this article, I didn't worry about it any longer. http://dailycaller.com/2013/03/05/battered-bullets-does-bullet-setback-matter/ You will be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noylj Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 Pictures. These stories are better with pictures. 1) Virtually any COL that feeds and chambers is "safe," provided you do your load work-up at that COL and re-work the load if you change COL. Now, if you take a load developed in ANOTHER gun that used a 1.200" COL and you needed a 1.000" COL and did NO load development but just dropped that powder charge in your gun, then, YES, you will have a problem. Most likely not a KB, but problems none the less. 2) Do a Plunk test: Take the barrel out of the gun. Drop rounds in until you find one that won't chamber. Take that round and "paint" the bullet and case black with Magic Marker or other marker. Drop round in barrel (or gage) and rotate it back-and-forth a few times. Remove and inspect the round: a) Scratches in the ink on bullet--COL is too long Scratches in the ink on edge of the case mouth--insufficient crimp c) Scratches in the ink just below the case mouth--too much crimp, you're crushing the case d) Scratches in the ink on case at base of bullet--bullet seated crooked due to insufficient case expansion (not case mouth flare) or improper seating stem fit e) Scratches in the ink on case just above extractor groove--case bulge not removed during sizing. May need a bulge buster. 3) If the case mouth was jammed into the throat (not the rifling), you would have very unsafe loads—but I'll bet you don't. 4) Your COL (Cartridge Overall Length) is determined by your barrel (chamber and throat dimensions) and your gun (feed ramp) and your magazine (COL that fits magazine and when the magazine lips release the round for feeding) and the PARTICULAR bullet you are using. What worked in a pressure barrel or the lab's gun or in my gun has very little to do with what will work best in your gun. Take the barrel out of the gun. Create two inert dummy rounds (no powder or primer) at max COL and remove enough case mouth flare for rounds to chamber (you can achieve this by using a sized case—expand-and-flare it, and remove the flare just until the case "plunks" in the barrel and lock the crimp or seater/crimp die body). Drop the inert rounds in and decrease the COL until they chamber completely. This will be your "max" effective COL. After this, place the inert rounds in the magazine and be sure they fit the magazine and feed and chamber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 2 hours ago, Joeg26er said: OAL 1.125 but should be 1.156 Chamber checks show some hesitation on extraction due to the case mouth hitting the rifling. I wouldn't be concerned about the small difference in OAL, especially with that powder load. But, as noylj mentioned, I'd run The Plunk Test - also check for bullet setback. And you have to make sure with Bullseye and fast powders that you don't miss a powder charge or double one - have to have good light source and LOOK into each case for Every Bullet, Before you seat the bullet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4n2t0 Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 (edited) Too much flare/bell and not enough crimp to take out the bell? What's the case mouth measurement of a finished round? Edited July 30, 2017 by 4n2t0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrench459 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 I've got to ask the case length 9x19,9x21 or 9x23? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4n2t0 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 2 hours ago, wrench459 said: I've got to ask the case length 9x19,9x21 or 9x23? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joeg26er Posted July 31, 2017 Author Share Posted July 31, 2017 9x19 since I'm using a G17. Not sure where I would get different brass... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4n2t0 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 11 hours ago, Joeg26er said: 9x19 since I'm using a G17. Not sure where I would get different brass... Don't worry about that question... How about some pictures and measurements? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MemphisMechanic Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 What powder and what charge weight? Your sticking cases are almost certainly going to be a combination of how much you flare, and over/under-crimping in combination with that. Show us some photos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrench459 Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 On 7/30/2017 at 11:10 PM, Joeg26er said: 9x19 since I'm using a G17. Not sure where I would get different brass... You can pick up 21mm range brass once in awhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDescribe Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 On 7/30/2017 at 10:13 AM, Joeg26er said: Chamber checks on the G17 shows some hesitate on extraction due to the case mouth hitting the rifling. Case mouth shows some slight knicks. Your case mouth doesn't get to your rifling. There is a headspacing step in the chamber that your case will headspace against and not pass. And even if you so over-crimped that it could get past the headspacing step, the extractor keeps the case pinned to the breech face, and case simply isn't long enough to get to the rifling. There's something else going on. Again, though, give people all the measurements asked for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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