wtturn Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 Therefore my point that if I and a non-member shoot exactly the same matches all year, I contribute more to support USPSA than the non-member by the amount of my dues. <snip> Thus my point the members are subsidizing the hobbies of non-members and that is not right. But the non-members aren't getting the value (classification and an awesome magazine and so forth) that members are getting. To some extent, non-members are subsidizing *my* hobby by coming to our matches and giving us money for entry fees and helping us set up and tear down. And typically they get bit by the bug and join up within a few months. This is how I see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimitz Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 as i said in the very beginning of this ... simply put into effect a tiered activity fee and clubs will charge more to non mebers so they don't have their revenue stream reduced and anyone who can do arithmetic and shoots more than a couple of matches a year will see its cheaper to be a member then not ... problem solved ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 (edited) as i said in the very beginning of this ... simply put into effect a tiered activity fee and clubs will charge more to non mebers so they don't have their revenue stream reduced and anyone who can do arithmetic and shoots more than a couple of matches a year will see its cheaper to be a member then not ... problem solved ..... what's wrong with the current system, where everyone pays every match, but people who get classified, ro training, a cool magazine, and can shoot L2 matches pay yearly dues too? what is broken about this system? Edited December 4, 2015 by motosapiens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beastly Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Recurring revenue is good. +$5 for non-members, perhaps paid 50-50 to the club and to HQ wouldn't break my heart. It would further encourage people to join. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimitz Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 as i said in the very beginning of this ... simply put into effect a tiered activity fee and clubs will charge more to non mebers so they don't have their revenue stream reduced and anyone who can do arithmetic and shoots more than a couple of matches a year will see its cheaper to be a member then not ... problem solved .....what's wrong with the current system, where everyone pays every match, but people who get classified, ro training, a cool magazine, and can shoot L2 matches pay yearly dues too? what is broken about this system? its a way to 'encourage' people to join if that's something important to do ... as I said before, I'm much more unhappy about clubs that are not affiliated but continue to steal USPSA intellectual property by advertising "USPSA-like" matches .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x45 Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 (edited) as I said before, I'm much more unhappy about clubs that are not affiliated but continue to steal USPSA intellectual property by advertising "USPSA-like" matches .... double ditto! if they want to play USPSA, they need to pay, so they can use our rules and targets. Otherwise call it "Bill and Ted's not excellent local action pistol match" You mean this is not a sanctioned USPSA match?? Edited December 4, 2015 by 9x45 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MHicks Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 How many clubs send in activity fees for all shooters, members or not, at their monthly matches? It would be a safe bet that those shooters who regularly compete in USPSA matches, but don't join, also have a lower percentage of NRA membership. If a club wants to hold "action pistol matches" they shouldn't mention USPSA or IDPA in their description of the match. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 How many clubs send in activity fees for all shooters, members or not, at their monthly matches? we certainly do. Not only would it be dishonest not to, but it would require us to delete the non-members from the results. that would be lame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gino_aki Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 The value of USPSA to me personally is being able keep my relatively low membership number and being able to walk around with an R.O. certification card in my pocket. The magazine rarely prints anything about my neck of the woods (probably something to do with all that Pacific Ocean in the way or lack of a pidgin english translator) and classification rarely matters except to the two or three club members who actually travel to the mainland for matches. People "win" their divisions at my club by virtue of being the only shooters in that division, members or not since the only "award" given is getting to hear that they "won." The only other "value" I can discern that USPSA provides us with is the stories that our traveling shooters bring home about meeting others who enjoy this sport the way we do. We also get the "value" of you USPSA members visiting our island every so often and bringing the wealth of your knowledge and camraderie to our matches. Now that I'm sort of retired, I may be able to do some traveling to some of your clubs to spread back some of that aloha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chills1994 Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 http://www.eagleeyeusa.net/idpa-outlaw-matches/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 Excellent topic. I suffered an injury that no longer allowed me to golf. I needed another hobby and literally jumped into USPSA overnight (well, 10 days to be precise ). Picked up a CZ, ordered all the gear from Amazon, and... purchased a USPSA membership; I thought I NEEDED it to shoot (not enough research on my part about shooting a match). My local club puts on 28 matches a year, of which, 4 are steel challenges. $35 non-member, $25 member. If I had it to do over again, I would have save my money and buy ammo to practice with, instead of a USPSA annual membership. What does my membership get me in a way that benefits me or provides me some sort of service other than seeing the same PractisSores my club uploads? My very first match, I shot with six other guys; three open, one SS, and two production. Only three had USPSA numbers and the others were just there to shoot - regulars, though. It seemed to me, in my observation/opinion, they only had classifications to "support the sport." The comradery was there, regardless. A couple of guys asked my experience and gave me some great advice/pointers heading into, and after stages. No one asked my classification or registration number (except at registration). I finished 26/48 overall, combined, and had a great time. I don't see how my experience would have been any different if I was a non-member. I think USPSA needs to find a legitimate reason for existence. Edit: I read a few comments about having a website to go to, rule download, etc. Here is a realistic fact of my generation; the only research we do (that's not journalistic citations), are YOUTUBE. We find gear, rules, FPS, etc... basically everything we need to know about USPSA. The only reason I went to the USPSA website was to get the phone number so I could get my reg. number the night before a match. You want to shoot USPSA Matches,using their rules, targets, and range officers trained by NROI, but regret spending $25 on a USPSA membership? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Whyte Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 How do the members find a report on where the money goes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Whyte Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 Maybe its me, but does anyone else think its strange that you have to pay to take a class to be a RO VOLUNTEER? IDPA also charges. ICORE does not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray_Z Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 I only compete on a local level now. I look at the scores I get on the classifiers and that tells me if I'm progressing in my abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 Pete, you don't really pay to take an RO class. The instructor gets 0 dollars for teaching the class. The money you pay is for expenses for the instructor, hotel, food, range fee, etc. There may be a small amount that goes to USPSA for rulebooks. But when I took mine it was 40 dollars and the instructor was flown in from out of state. I think USPSAs main value is a nationwide set of rules. I can go to any USPSA match and know exactly what the rules and equipment needed are. Try that with multigun, you generally need to read the rules for each match you go to, and then call the match director, then argue with ROs because they don't know the rules for their match, and there is no recourse (arbitration) when you think a rule has not been followed or applied evenly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 Maybe its me, but does anyone else think its strange that you have to pay to take a class to be a RO VOLUNTEER? IDPA also charges. ICORE does not. I took the R.O. class it was $25, it was to help cover the instructors expenses. Ray Hirst was the instructor, he lives on Illinois, so he flew in and after the second day of class his plane left. I don't think he gets paid so someone needs to pick up his expenses. Marc Weir and maybe the WAC subsidized the class so we only had to pay $25. To me $25 was worth it, some of the guys that took the class said they won't work matches, I help at matches because I want to help out. To become an NRA Range Officer the class is $250. I see your point though, it costs us time and money to volunteer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chills1994 Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 How do the members find a report on where the money goes? guidestar.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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