czechmate frame same as cts? smaller than ts?

[ano]

Hi, is the czechmate frame same as cts? meaning smaller than ts I've tried the stock cz ts and its just a tad to big for my likeing, but I heard the CTS has a smaller frame, sadly its not available in my country.

Im looking at a new gun, primaraly to shoot ipsc standard major and also trying a few open matches.

so my idea, buy a czechmate, buy a new .40 top for it. and som 40 mags? or can you use the same mags as well?

it should allow me to shoot

ipsc open major

ipsc standard major

ipsc standard minor

all useing same gun, grip, rig.

[alma]

I believe the Czechmate grip is the same size s the TS.

The CTS is also a TS frame but CZ Custom has removed the cast checkering.

You could always get a TS or Czeckmate and sand/file off the checkering and get some thinner grips if you don't mind the work.

[kneelingatlas]

ipsc open major

ipsc standard major

ipsc standard minor

all useing same gun, grip, rig.

This was my original plan, but I couldn't choke down the initial investment so I bought a TS then promptly started turning it into an Open gun, then one thing lead to another and now I have over two dozen CZ75 pattern pistols

[ano]

I believe the Czechmate grip is the same size s the TS.

The CTS is also a TS frame but CZ Custom has removed the cast checkering.

You could always get a TS or Czeckmate and sand/file off the checkering and get some thinner grips if you don't mind the work.

Its the same frame as basis, but you can see under trigger guard, top of grip, you see its cut into the checkering at least, wondering if more is done.

[z40acp]

I think the CTS LS-P and CTS LS-B are small frame guns but the mags will not hold as many rounds.

[bigdave24]

I also thought the CTS was the smaller 75 frame with a TS upper. The Czechmate frame is similar to the TS.

[z40acp]

I also thought the CTS was the smaller 75 frame with a TS upper. The Czechmate frame is similar to the TS.

I think it depends on which CTS you are getting.

[Avedis]

Here Angus goes over what it takes to make a CTS frame out of the TS frame.

Watch from 19:55 - 24:00
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDi0_VDAcQU

Edited August 30, 2014 by Avedis

[kneelingatlas]

There are a handful of CTS models, some based on the TS, some based on the 75SA, as a good rule of thumb, if it's less than $2K it's the 75SA and more than $2K is the TS:

[kneelingatlas]

The capacity is essentially the same in 9mm between the two, but in .40 the TS holds 21 vs 15 in a 140mm mag.

[EngineerEli]

My understanding is this the TS, Czechmate, and CTS are all start as the same frame. The Czechmate is a TS frame but with the undercut under the trigger guard and the beaver tail is cut higher. The CTS (no other letters or designation) starts as a TS frame, but the dust cover is cut to CZ75 length, the cast waffle checkering is removed and the front and back of the grip are thinned slightly, the under cuts under the trigger guard and beaver tail are also cut higher.

BTW: If you look at the dust cover, if the scallops towards the front are a ball style cut, that is the smaller, lower capacity, cz75 frame, the TS frame will have the more V shaped scallop cuts when looking form the front.

Edited August 30, 2014 by EngineerEli

[trgt]

There are two different CTS models from CZ Custom that confusingly use the same CTS moniker, but different frame. Both have TS upper. CTS is a hot rod Tactical Sport, CTS LS is TS upper on CZ75 lower.

CTS ... http://czcustom.com/cts9mmblueinv.aspx , http://czcustom.com/cts40sandwblueinv.aspx

' Our flag ship handgun, loosely based on the CZ 75 Tactical Sports '

CTS LS ... http://czcustom.com/search.aspx?find=cts+ls

LS=Long Slide - Tactical Sport top end on a CZ 75 SA Style Short Dust Cover, Swept Hi Rise Beaver tail Frame

The CTS LS is the smaller frame similar to the CA75, so better for smaller hands, uses CZ75 not TS mags, and not as much capacity as Kneeling Atlas said.

Edited August 30, 2014 by trgt

[CZinZA]

The OP doesn't have access to cz custom products. Those of us who live outside the us can't get all those cts variations.

In fact, it can be hard to get a decent cz at all

[ano]

The OP doesn't have access to cz custom products. Those of us who live outside the us can't get all those cts variations.

In fact, it can be hard to get a decent cz at all

Exactly!

I can get any factory CZ, but not any custom factory CZ

I looked at video with angus, seems czechmate has almost as large size as the TS. I went shooting with a few czechmate owners recently, got some mixed reviews, but I guess its like that for all guns.

I have SVI money, but I like CZ priceing, looks and reliability. like mentioned here some work with grinders and files might be a good solution I currently run a sphinx in minor and can count my failures this season on 1 hand, I've had 1 failed to ignite primer (bad round), and 2 failure to feed, both due to not inserting mags enough. I'd like to continue haveing little trouble when shooting major, but I constantly see people with STI's, paras, tanfoglios etc in .40S&W doing the good old Tap & racks way to often. sadly when th 40 guys have a clean match with no trouble they pull ahead.

Edited September 1, 2014 by ano

[CZinZA]

I love my TS. Very accurate. Excellent trigger. It's a great gun - it fits my hand size perfectly

[BeerBaron]

From what I've seen it goes like this from smallest to largest in the TS frame guns:

CZC CTS

czechmate

TS

The czechmate is a TS frame, with some reduction work and undercut done on it. the CTS on the other hand is a full on grip reduction and undercut job by CZC.

The czechmate with thin grips is a very manageable size. but if too big for you can easily be modified to be smaller both with thin grips or just by filing off the wallfe iron checkering and using skate tape instead.

your plan seems sound to me. an infact can shoot 4 categories if you want once you get that 40 top end.

standard major (40 top end)

standard minor (the 'limited' top end that comes with the czechmate in 9mm or load 40 minor with the 40 top end)

open minor (9mm open top end)

open major (9mm open top end)

From what I've seen the czechmate is a nice running gun out of the box (though that's been my experience with my tanfoglio eric too). I think yes a lot of custom built 2011's are built too tight as the owner demands sub 2 inch group at 50 meter performance not realising that that kind of bullseye performance means tight tolerances. get a bit sloppy on cleaning or ammo and you get jams. the CZ and the tanfoglio's are built a teeny bit looser to bring some reliability to the platform whilst still being plenty accurate enough for the action shooting sports they are built for. Not forgetting though that most of the malfs are actually ammo related (bulged case, high primer etc etc). That will cause jams regardless of the gun brand.

[KOBGT]

I've had both. They feel about the same to me (CTS and Czechmate)

[smoothdraw]

i had a TS, CZ75's, CTS LS and my friend has CZC CTS and checkmate. I also played with high end and stock 2011's.

The checkmate is a TS frame that has been re profiled and then checkered again in production . The CTS is also a TS frame with checkering removed so it is smaller than TS by CZCustom it seems. You could grip on the checkmate just a tid higher than CTS because there's extra cuts in checkmate under the beavertail and under trigger guard. Checkmate has front and rear checkering still while CTS is smooth. Checkmate in limited config is also a sight tracker design. The standard TS has bigger grip.

Now CTS LS is a 75 frame with a fitted CTS upper. There are some frame cuts and fitting needed in the standard lower to fit the CTS upper. I gave my 75 shadow to CZC and they fitted a CTS 9mm upper. It's my 3 gun pistol right now.

My buddy that uses the CTS can load 22+1 on his TS magazine. In the stock short mag that comes with checkmate we could load it only 20+1.

In my CTS LS, my standard 18rd with short CZC extended base, with CZC spring kit, i could load 23+1.

Peeps in CZC like eerw will be able to really explain everything of their products much clearer.

The beauty of CZC's are with reliability because 9mm mags are fitted. For 2011, you need and SVI or SVI mags for mag reliability. STI mags with spacers is $$.

Edited September 3, 2014 by smoothdraw

[ano]

Whats your honest feel of recoil of the TS vs SVI 2011 style? how is the grip size vs the 2011?

I've been in contact with a dealer with SVI in stock, but its $$$$$$$$$ almost 3 TS!

I've only shot TS in 9mm, and 2011 in .. pretty much everything but 40.. I actually own a long dustcover 6" 2011 10mm.. and recoil in that thing is virtually non existant with full 80s loads.

[smoothdraw]

recoil is same plus you could hold CZ higher. 2011 grip size smaller.. Yeah if you have $$$$$ go for SV. Else CZ works well too. i get less gun issues with CZ than 2011. plus if you use non sv mag in 9mm... it's expensive and problematic. CZ you can forget about your gun and focus on shooting.