Neomet Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Used to shoot with a club that mandated a certain number of hours spent working as a condition of being a member and getting to shoot. Don't let it be optional and you won't have a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Norman Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 I am continuously amazed at this being an issue. Really, I have invested a couple thousand dollars in equipment to shoot USPSA matches. I drive an hour minimum each way and I won't get off my ass to assist in putting a stage on the ground so I have a match to shoot!? Is setting up a day early a good or bad thing? If it is a major event then yes. If you have sufficient people to set up and shoot and those people will return the following day to RO so that the squads have dedicated vs embedded ROs then probably yes. We as a rule do not and cannot set up a day in advance, the range is open to the other members of the club. Also it means that only a few people will be there doing all the work as opposed to setting up 2 hours early on Sunday and giving more people the joy of helping out. As for mandatory work hours. we have them for club members, every member under 65 YO must contribute a minimum of 12 hours of useful work annually or be assessed a per hour fee. Some pay, some work. Honestly the members that work generally work way more then the required hours. Heck the MD gets 12 hours and probably fills them by the end of the second match! That said, we have many shooters that are not members that work just as much during setup as members do and they get nothing but a really great match to shoot. As I said earlier everyone tears down their stage and puts it up on the proper stage trailer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nghthwk1911 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Hay, I paid my $20. This is all I need to do, what I need to paste, ok fine... Wait what I need to reset Steel also... this is not what I paid for... Oh and now you want me to set up also... Man the govt. does not ask me to do this much to get my check why should you? So this is just my little rant, and yes this is a OVER exaggeration of the conversation. it matters not what organization your are in, there is always a core group that do a lions share of the work. This always true when it is done on a volunteer basis. Shooters feel ENTITLED to just shoot, "I want to focus on my shooting", or " I paid my $20", or one of my favorites "I have to go get my Kid from (insert activity) that just miraculously ended just now, I need to dash sorry I can help tear down".. The personal accountability in shooting and supporting any club, your own local, the club down the road or the club across the state is at an all time low. what is the fix, I don't know, all I know is that I down what I can, if I can I show up early and help, I show up for set up, sometimes missing another match to help another club, RO, Scorekeep, Tear down, put the props away, what ever it takes.. if each shooter just did some of this, it would all go so much faster... Many hand make the heaviest loads very lite. Just my 2 cents. Look for you check under the work boots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlchevy Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 I have the same problem here at whidpa as MD we have a weekly match , monthly match & 3 gun its just a few that will help set up & fewer to put up lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimitz Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 At our club if you don't stick around to help break down your stage at the end of the match you scoresheet seems to get lost and you have no results to look at. No one seems to leave our matches more than once without helping .... Setup is a little different as we seem to have the same small group of people all the time ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 At our club if you don't stick around to help break down your stage at the end of the match you scoresheet seems to get lost and you have no results to look at. No one seems to leave our matches more than once without helping .... Setup is a little different as we seem to have the same small group of people all the time ... What do you guys do when the competitor's response is, "Oh, no problem -- I took a picture of it, I'll send you a copy....." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKT1106 Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 At our club if you don't stick around to help break down your stage at the end of the match you scoresheet seems to get lost and you have no results to look at. No one seems to leave our matches more than once without helping .... Setup is a little different as we seem to have the same small group of people all the time ... Wow. That pretty shady. I understand the frustration of needing help and seeing people shoot and scoot, but that is a terrible thing to do out of spite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ST43130 Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 I never visited the clubs in question so this comment may not be relevant, but personally I think if the stages were more simply designed and didn't require hours to setup and teardown there would be much greater involvement. Just my $.02, but you don't need to use every piece of steel and prop for each match and the last thing I want to do after spending a few hours out in the hot sun is to drag steel and pull stakes. The same goes for setup, it is really difficult to have fun shooting when you spend the first two hours pounding stakes and dragging crap around. Also, call me old school, but I much prefer a lower round count with some semblance to reality than what I have been seeing the last few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 (edited) One club didn't get decent set up help. Match normally started at 10 I think. Things still got done on time but when start time came around the MD announced that since help was not there when needed the shooting would start an hour late. Reports are that this approach was effective. Edited July 6, 2014 by IHAVEGAS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Norman Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 For Set up and Tear down one BIG thing that has helped the two clubs I regularly work and shoot is this: We have one per stage and everything you need to build your stage is there. Teardown, all yo need to do is put the stuff back. We then stow the trailers in two Conex boxes. Shaved at least and hour off the build and as much off the teardown. Trailers are 6 wide and 8 long. upper deck holds the fences and braces, stands, sticks, steel and fault are all onboard as are spikes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WashingtonShooter Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 This thread is a good read... I can come at this from both sides of the coin... As a shooter, who regularly drives 2-3 hours to shoot a match.. Do I want to spend even an extra min setting up or tearing down? Hell no. After 50 dollars in gas , match fees and ammo costs, Im ready to spend 2 or 3 hours driving home to arrive at a decent hour ... So I can sympathize with people who have reasons for not wanting to help.. On the flip size, at a local match, I dont mind helping set up, tear down, RO, score, etc... I help run a local club , and we spend many hours before anyone else arrives starting set up, and many hours after the match tearing down, dealing with cash, scores, website , so having help is really nice... SO I guess it depends on what the situation is... Not every single person , at every match can help tear down, set up, etc.. But for the most part, we do need more helpers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WashingtonShooter Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 I never visited the clubs in question so this comment may not be relevant, but personally I think if the stages were more simply designed and didn't require hours to setup and teardown there would be much greater involvement. Just my $.02, but you don't need to use every piece of steel and prop for each match and the last thing I want to do after spending a few hours out in the hot sun is to drag steel and pull stakes. The same goes for setup, it is really difficult to have fun shooting when you spend the first two hours pounding stakes and dragging crap around. Also, call me old school, but I much prefer a lower round count with some semblance to reality than what I have been seeing the last few years. Then you end up with boring , box to box stages, that are not fun or challenging... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Norman Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 If 'Local' shooters all helped we'd be good. Local of course is a moving target, but an hour in most places is local so if you drive under an hour Help out. Many people drive 1-1/2 or more and still help. No one expects anyone to drive 4 hours work three building, shoot the match and then stay to tear down and then drive home 4 hours. Those people traveling LONG distance are not the problem. It is the guys that are 45 minutes away that show up just in time and then beat the echo off the range at the last shot that are the people we need to turn around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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