rhino Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 On my way to Terre Haute today, I had a great idea. It may not be original, but I don't remember anyone else talking about doing it. Precision rifle matches like the ITRC and MOR side matches in USPSA 3-Gun are becoming very popular. One of the complications is that it's not always easy (or possible) in some areas to find a place to shoot such a match, even if you have the gear. So ... what if we scale everything down so it can be done on ranges with 100 yards or less. Let's also say we do it with rimfire .22 and .17 rifles only. And we use suitably small targets. Now ... I understand that shooting smaller targets at close ranges does not scale properly with shooting standard targets at long range. I know that it won't take into account doping the wind, mirage, bullet drop, and all of the other interesting challenges presented by longer range rifle shootging. So I'm not trying to simulate anything here, just trying to find a fun thing to do with rifles that everyone has at ranges where just about everyone can go. Equipment ... as I mentioned, I think it's logical and fun to limit this to rimfire rifles, either .22 or .17, everything from .22 short up to .22WMR. If we need divisions, I'd start with either self-loaders vs. manually operated (bolt, lever, pump). We could also split it into iron sights vs. scopes. Hopefully we could do this as a "run what you brung" deal, but sometimes you need to help people feel better about themselves. Targets ... I think the 1/3 size IPSC targets would be perfect as one option. The options would only be limited by imagination, as it's really easy to find stuff that you can safely shoot with .22s. Small dueling trees, necco wafers, cookies, clay targets, small target dots (like shoot'n'see) ... you name it. We'd just have to assign a point value. Scoring ... I'd probably do some version of Comstock or fixed time. A time-plus system would be something to consider, but I don't really like those for a variety of reasons. The level of physical challenge accompanying the shooting challenges would obviously vary due to facilities and the persons running the matches. So ... in short, it would give us something fun and new to do with rifles that just about everyone owns or can acquire very inexpensively. Ammo is no problem, and finding a suitable range would be orders of magnitude easier than for a full-on MOR match. And just about anyone could play ... you won't have to be a tactical superman who can run for 10 miles, then slow your heat to 23BPM to shoot your .338LM at the eyes of needles at 900 m. Joe Bag O' Donut with a Ruger 77/22 and a Bushnell scope would be in like Flynn! What do you think? Does it sound like fun? Would you like to do it? I'm going to start doing it with some buddies informally to see how it works as soon I can! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted December 21, 2004 Author Share Posted December 21, 2004 Anyone? Anyone? Is this going to be just BigDave and me? No one else thinks it sounds like fun? Anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 I think it's a great idea Rhino. Our local club occasionally does .22 rf shoots in the winter so we don't freeze our fingers hunting brass. I've got a Ceiner conversion for my AR, yes it rocks......but quietly....like J.J. Cale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AikiDale Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 Okay, I'm in. Just dug through the gun closet and found a Ruger 10/22. The third Saturday and Sunday and the Fourth Saturday are booked until March, every other match (wimps) has ceased for the Winter. How about Sunday, Jan 9th? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 sounds very fun. I would go for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Perez Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 Rhino , I ran a "2 gun" IDPA-like match once that used the shooters pistol and any 22lr that they had. One stage had paintballs placed into cut-outs on a target at ~10 yards and each ball was it's own individual target - leave it untouched and it was a FTN , after which they tansitioned to the hg for some full size targets . MP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 It sounds like fun, but for me it would be just one more game too many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD45 Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 I've never shot 3-gun(no AR ), but I think that any kind of .22 match is super cool. I wish IDPA and USPSA would have some sort of regular .22 matches for stock guns, just to get people started. But don't stop there. Take the idea to the nationals too. How can you not love a cartridge that lets you forget about brass, never have to reload, and costs 18 dollars per thousand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Perez Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 The silohuete (spelling?) range at Ben Avery Range has the metallic chickens/rams/etc scaled down for 22lr at 100yds. Those things are micro-small - it's hard enough to see them with a spotting scope , much less hit them from standing.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Buff Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 Rhino, for your mini-sniper match, we have small plastic soldiers ±4-5com tall, which you guys should have over there as well. They sell in toy stores for many next to nothing. I used them for air-gun "sniping" up to ±50m (which gets real tricky). Put 'em on bricks at variable distances up to ±100m. Hit is 1 point a miss is zip, run it fixed time, say 2min for 10 targets...... Have fun..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Dunlop Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 I found this game a while ago and thought the idea was really cool, well worth a look http://www.snipershide.com/tacticalcompetitions.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted December 21, 2004 Author Share Posted December 21, 2004 Thanks for the feedback, guys! DB ... the little plastic army men are a great idea! Dale ... the 9th is probably the only USPSA pistol match that won't get cancelled up here in January (AtlantaCC). I see that we have a 5th weekend ... probably nothing going on ... the 29th and 30th. Do those look good? And where shall we do it? Maybe we should work out some stages and do an online match like we tried with pistolas this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Buff Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 Give us the CoF, rules, times, etc and we'll all play.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted December 21, 2004 Author Share Posted December 21, 2004 (edited) Okay ... I know I saved the 1/3 size IPSC target on my hard disk, but now I can't find it, nor where I downloaded it in the first place. Can anyone help? D'OH! Never mind ... I found it. I've also used PageMaker to make one that is about 1/6th scale (the size where I could get two of the 1/3 size on a standard sheet of paper). I'm going to cut them out and staple them to plain brown cardboard (perhaps standard IPSC targets) and see how they do for 50 and 100 yards. They might be a little small for iron sights at 100 yards, but maybe not. Now I have paper targets that I can score as per EZWinScore. Reactive targets will be some combination of: little green army men cookies (I'm thinking either Vanilla Wafers or Oreos) Shoot'n'See target dots or pasters Poker Chips AOL CD-ROMs Right now I am leaning to a stages that requires a minium of 20 rounds and allowing the shooter to have 30 rounds with them. Until I get an idea of what par times should be, we can do this comstock. Do we need divisions? Should we split by iron/scopes or by self-loader/manual, or both? Oh, I need a bipod now! Edited December 21, 2004 by rhino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrett Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 Not exactly the same, but they have indoor "quasi-IPSC" indoors in Northern Utah. They have a bunch of 10-round stages set up. I believe it's a time-plus scoring. They use a rimfire texas star, a pipe rack (like plate rack but with PVC pipe sections), full- and mini-sized IPSC targets. I think they do it twice a month on a weeknight. It started as an indoor winter activity, but the popularity kept it going through the year. They shoot Open & Limited. Appropriate guns would include Ruger MKIIs & Browning Buckmarks, as well as Glocks & 1911s with rimfire conversions. Some people have some pretty tricked out .22 open guns. It woudn't be too hard to adapt that to using rifles. After all, almost everyone has a .22 rifle. You could do the MOR/Tactical type thing. But you could also do the run 'n gun stuff as well, (like "regular" 3-gun rifle stages). Sounds like a lot of fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 Actually, mini-rifle is alive and well in the UK. I had to go to the UK for business for a few weeks in 2001. I found a link off the IPSC website that brought me to the following: Harlow Practical Club That club used to be a pistol club back when they used to be allowed to have pistols. Actually, this club was one of the ones that Angus used to shoot with. In any case, I made contact with some nice people there and managed to shoot a mini-rifle match. It seems that once upon a time, they tried to shoot a match with 10/22's and had a bit of fun. The next match, some of the guys had shortened the barrels, and such and the race was on. Now you have dots, comps, speed loaders, the whole "shooting match". Real fun. You may want to contact them for some lessons learned on mini-rifle! Happy Holidays, Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattBurkett Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 Check out: http://www.snipershide.com/tacticalcompetitions.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimberkid Posted December 28, 2004 Share Posted December 28, 2004 Rhino, I know I am about a week late with this, but you may have met one of the best .22 rifle shooters in the world and not even known it. He comes over with the British crew to Winimac every year and for the past 4 years has won their version of the Bianchi Cup. Only difference is they shooter lever action centerfire rifles, and semi auto .22 rifles. Jimmy B might be able to scan a target to show you, very very very small. Plus it is sickingly cool to see a sub 3 second plate rack with a lever gun. Ohh yea, same time limits on everything too, and go off your left shoulder on the practical. Very cool stuff to watch. I'd be down for some .22 sniper stuff, provided you do it on a saturday. Have 10/22, will travel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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