shoot GSSF unlimited with an M&P?

[steviesterno]

alright guys, I need a little help here.

I was going over the rules of GSSF because I would like to shoot an open glock in an upcoming match, but I don't have one. I DO have an open M&P on the way. when I was reading the new GSSF mag I read that for unlimited, you could change anything and everything about the glock, as long as it didn't have a metal frame or shoulder stock.

You can change the upper, slides, barrel, all internals, trigger, etc. You can also switch to an aftermarket frame, which by definition, is no longer a glock (but a lone wolf, etc) since it is the legal firearm aspect.

for the sake of argument, couldn't you replace the slide, barrel, upper, with m&p parts? Then also replace the block frame with a plastic after market, such as an M&P frame? One could argue that you have in fact replaced every single part on the gun with aftermarket stuff.

Now this may be arguing semantics, but how much of the original glock parts must be there to still shoot it in a gssf match? What about trading a glock for an M&P or similar, saying you did in fact replace every single part on the gun?

170.130 This division is open to all competitors, both Master and Amateur, who use a GLOCK fire- arm that has aftermarket components or modifica- tions that are not allowed in the “stock” divisions (see section 40.00). Competitors may also use the same stock GLOCK firearm they used in firing the Civilian, Guardian, Subcompact, Competition, Heavy Metal, or Master-Stock divisions. The only stock GLOCK model excluded from this division is the G36 (due to its relatively limited magazine ca- pacity). Shoulder-stock devices and similar “Car- bine Conversion Units” may not be used. All com- petitors compete equally and there are no special category awards.

Edited January 11, 2014 by steviesterno

[Avezorak]

There are no words.

[steviesterno]

it's a serious thought I had. not saying it was my best idea, but coming from a USPSA back ground, I'm a fan of gaming a little

[Avezorak]

I guess you could try. I doubt you will get anywhere with them. I think they would get a lot more participation if they had a division that allowed other striker fired pistols. Maybe make it where you just wouldnt be eligible to win a gun.

[hornetx40]

The first word in the competition is GLOCK. Maybe you should figure out which battles are really worth fighting. It is a GLOCK match. When one person say you're wrong...who knows...but when the whole world say you're wrong then your wrong. Read rule 20.40 Since you can't safely handle a Glock then you can not compete......Semantics go both way.....cheating is cheating no matter what name you call it.

[Pasley]

I'm going to shoot my first GSSF match soon and I was reading the rules this morning. They specifically say Glock frame for the unlimited category. Not saying it isn't there someplace but I did not see any mention of being able to use an aftermarket frame.

[Flexmoney]

GlockTalk has a dedicated GSSF forum. You might run this question by them: http://glocktalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=37

[Ming the Merciless]

Just for giggles I once brought an XD to a GSSF match to see if anyone noticed. They did and were NOT amused! Some folks just have no sense of humor.

[ede]

I had just got a new Limited 2011 and was shooting a GSSF match the next day so I took it to shoot for the first time on the practice plate rack. Got a lot of looks and comments, even a few wanting to shoot it. Didn't use it in the match.

[Chuck Anderson]

No, that is all.

[LilBunniFuFu]

Ship of Theseus come to mind but with Glocks.

To answer the original post, GLOCK sport shooting federation.

[steviesterno]

I was thinking the Ship of Theseus, but more as it applied to the longest broom award (same broom 20 years, only 17 shafts and 14 heads). What part of the gun must remain for it to still be considered a glock? Is it the frame? or is it something more intrinsic? Glock rules even say you can change the frame to aftermarket, which is what got me started thinking this line. We can change the frame, slide, barrel, and fire control. What's left?

[a.roberts]

I was thinking the Ship of Theseus, but more as it applied to the longest broom award (same broom 20 years, only 17 shafts and 14 heads). What part of the gun must remain for it to still be considered a glock? Is it the frame? or is it something more intrinsic? Glock rules even say you can change the frame to aftermarket, which is what got me started thinking this line. We can change the frame, slide, barrel, and fire control. What's left?

A Glock magazine.

[Kimbertarget]

alright guys, I need a little help here.

I was going over the rules of GSSF because I would like to shoot an open glock in an upcoming match, but I don't have one. I DO have an open M&P on the way. when I was reading the new GSSF mag I read that for unlimited, you could change anything and everything about the glock, as long as it didn't have a metal frame or shoulder stock.

You can change the upper, slides, barrel, all internals, trigger, etc. You can also switch to an aftermarket frame, which by definition, is no longer a glock (but a lone wolf, etc) since it is the legal firearm aspect.

for the sake of argument, couldn't you replace the slide, barrel, upper, with m&p parts? Then also replace the block frame with a plastic after market, such as an M&P frame? One could argue that you have in fact replaced every single part on the gun with aftermarket stuff.

Now this may be arguing semantics, but how much of the original glock parts must be there to still shoot it in a gssf match? What about trading a glock for an M&P or similar, saying you did in fact replace every single part on the gun?

170.130 This division is open to all competitors, both Master and Amateur, who use a GLOCK fire[/size]- [/size]arm that has aftermarket components or modifica[/size]- tions that are not allowed in the stock divisions [/size](see section 40.00). Competitors may also use the same stock GLOCK firearm they used in firing [/size]the Civilian, Guardian, Subcompact, Competition, Heavy Metal, or Master-Stock divisions. The only stock GLOCK model excluded from this division is [/size]the G36 (due to its relatively limited magazine ca[/size]- pacity). Shoulder-stock devices and similar Car- bine Conversion Units may not be used. All com- petitors compete equally and there are no special category awards. [/size]

The first question is what CLASS SHOOTER are you Now??

What divisions have you competed in so far?

Have you won a production,limited divison yet?

Alot of newbies try to jump from D-class to open division thinking its the pistol that makes those low times. Its the indian not the arrow. As far as M&P or any other parts,it would be wise to be proficient with a foundation before you build upon it.

being humble to allow people to respect you enough to where they will let you BORROW their open pistol to see what may and may not work for you.OPEN div is subjective and is nothing but trial and error. So it is best to talk to those who have been there and done that to save time on making mistakes.

listening to people who actually have an open div pistol and have competed would be a great start.

.

You can PM me if you have questions,yes i run a G34 as well as the 1911s you harass me about on all my threads.

Edited January 29, 2014 by Kimbertarget

[JackinSD]

I believe that Einstein said something to this effect, "Stupidity and Genius are very much alike. It's just that genius has it's limits."

[LilBunniFuFu]

I was thinking the Ship of Theseus, but more as it applied to the longest broom award (same broom 20 years, only 17 shafts and 14 heads). What part of the gun must remain for it to still be considered a glock? Is it the frame? or is it something more intrinsic? Glock rules even say you can change the frame to aftermarket, which is what got me started thinking this line. We can change the frame, slide, barrel, and fire control. What's left?

A Glock magazine.

Aftermarket mags...

[a.roberts]

I was thinking the Ship of Theseus, but more as it applied to the longest broom award (same broom 20 years, only 17 shafts and 14 heads). What part of the gun must remain for it to still be considered a glock? Is it the frame? or is it something more intrinsic? Glock rules even say you can change the frame to aftermarket, which is what got me started thinking this line. We can change the frame, slide, barrel, and fire control. What's left?

A Glock magazine.

Aftermarket mags...

Perhaps, "the ability to utilize factory Glock mags."

[racerba]

alright guys, I need a little help here.

Alright - you need a LOT of help!!!!!

for the sake of argument, couldn't you replace the slide, barrel, upper, with m&p parts? Then also replace the block frame with a plastic after market, such as an M&P frame? One could argue that you have in fact replaced every single part on the gun with aftermarket stuff.

M&P frame is not a Glock aftermarket frame, is it? If you're going to argue that, might as well replace it with an aftermarket "M16" frame or a remington 1100 frame while you're at it...

[wgj3]

No shoulder stocks would rule out 1100 and AR. I think Steve poses a great question. He is JUST posing questions. Something to think about. Don't everyone try to crucify him. Just think ab it. A line in the rules that required the firearm be able to accept some specific factory Glock part (mag, striker, end plate, safety, etc.) would quickly end this debate.