razor1911 Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 My open gun is shooting the first shot about 4 inches high and 2 inches left from about 15 yards on the first shot after loading. The rest of the bullets in the magazine will group nicely inside of a quarter or so (This was tested off a bench). The bullets are not tumbling and I can't see any obvious markings on the comp. I can only guess that it's not going fully into battery after being loaded but i can't see anything obviously wrong with it. Anyone seen anything similar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 I've hear of the "1st shot syndrome" - first espoused by a famed gunwriter - who uses this as an excuse to test firearms with five shot groups, and eliminating the one "flyer" caused by the "1st shot syndrome". This usually produces one - two inch groups at 25 yards:) that he reports in his magazine articles. But, I've never heard of first bullet being 6 inches off at 25 yards?? Wonder if you are loading the chamber too cautiously - I rack the slide back to the end, and release the slide a full measure - don't get very much (if any) dispersion with the first shot. But, just to be safe, if I'm testing ammo for groups - I fire the first shot into the berm and test the next 12- 18 shots as a "group". I shoot the Dot Torture Drill quite a bit, usually at 10 yards since I'm shooting Open, and my groups (including the first shot) usually are much less than three inches, even firing quickly - usually more like two inches. From the bench, inluding my first shot, groups at 25 yards are usually within two inches - I can't tell which is the "first shot". I'd load that first shot more vigorously, and try it again - see if that wide shot centers better for you . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandrooney Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 I think it has something to do with the way the powder sits in the case. So like Hi - Power Jack said rack the first round like you mean it. SR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cecil Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 when i use to shoot rifles a lot... i noticed the first shot was always not as accurate as the following shots... someone told me it was because oil in the barrel.. i kinda thought it was because the barrel was brought up to temprature. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a matt Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 All or those reasons are enlighten. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CocoBolo Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 I remember a similar problem about a year ago and the thread went on for a while and it ended up being "I can't remember", but I think it was to do with the feed ramp and magazine. You just need to search for it. But I'm sure it was a gun problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppa Bear Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 (edited) I think that might have been Mitch?? Pat Harrison-- http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=154947&hl=+flyer#entry1734999 Edited February 13, 2013 by Poppa Bear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Guy Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 (edited) Mine was the other way around. First two/three shots Ok, then drifting up and to the left. After a lot of time and ammo spent on figuring what was going on, I decided to get a new barrel and the problem was gone. Never could find out what was going on. Edited February 13, 2013 by Big Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Yup, still have that issue, changed the link to try to get more lock up, reduced the problem but groups overall seemed to open up. I'll check again when it warms up because it was fargin cold the day I was testing and I'm not sure if the bigger groups were just me or the gun. Talked to Matt McLearn at Area 2 about this and it boils down to barrel fit and how it seats when its locked up. The only real fixes are to try an oversize slide lock pin and ream the frame hole, or weld and refit, or fit a new barrel... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razor1911 Posted February 14, 2013 Author Share Posted February 14, 2013 Look like Pat's problem is exactly the same as mine... If i wasn't shooting off a bench my target would look just like the picture he posted in his thread. Pat, do you use a slide racker? I wonder if its because of how the slide gets torqued when racked as opposed to the release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 Nope. I have a slide racker but I tried with and with out, I tried using the slide lock to drop the slide, tried damn near everything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3gungeezer Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 I have always heard that it is caused by improper barrel fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razor1911 Posted February 18, 2013 Author Share Posted February 18, 2013 Found a new crack in the slide at todays match, so that may the what's causing the flyer. I'll post a pic when I get home. The gun is a very used Bedell Custom. Anyone know what replacing the slide (and probably barrel) runs? I think the frame is solid, but given the round count (~100k) and multiple slide cracks would it be better to replace the whole gun? I wouldn't want to spend a ton on a new upper just to have the frame crack... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razor1911 Posted February 18, 2013 Author Share Posted February 18, 2013 Here's a pic of the crack. Given how noticeable it is, I'm assuming that it happened very recently and not over a long period of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoonJeong Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 Did you ever find the issue? I have one of my guns with that problem. First shit is 2 inches high at 25 yards and next 4 shots group nicely I'm 1/2 inch. Crazy thing is that if I group the gun in single shot, it shoots 1/2 inch also, just 2 inches high! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olemiss Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 I used to have that problem. I had a single stack Kimber .40 and put the top end on a PT frame. The barrel was the stock Kimber .40 barrel and shot well in the single stack gun. However, on the PT frame, the first shot was always 5 inches low at 25 yards. I tried all the ways of loading the first round, but it would always shoot 5 inches low; then the gun would then group into about 2 inches after that. I had a new barrel fit to that gun and the problem disappeared. I believe it is a symptom of barrel misfit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipscjoe Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 (edited) I recently had this exact problem with my gun that had been 100% for years. It was the extractor. EXTREMLY agrivating but then became almost comical. I would aim two inches high and two inches left and drill the paster dead center , then aim normally and shoot one ragged hole. I would lock the slide back and try to move the extractor forward and back in the the slide. Here are multiple groups that I had all flyers were the first shot out if the gun. Edited April 29, 2015 by ipscjoe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoonJeong Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 I changed the springs on my after extractor and check later tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipscjoe Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 It wasn't tension (springs) it was the extractor itself moving forward and back in the channel. My firing pin retainer plate was cracked as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoonJeong Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 Thanks. Like you said, it wasn't the spring tension. But it did help. Flyer is 2 inches high at 30 yards, the rest cluster in half an inch. This isn't that bad, so after the South Carolina I'll have to take care of it. Thanks for the follow up! It wasn't tension (springs) it was the extractor itself moving forward and back in the channel. My firing pin retainer plate was cracked as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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