Bobbing Hammer Spur

[moose64]

Was curious if bobbing the hammer spur and lightening the hammer on a S&W 625-8 is worth the effort? Does it make a enough of a difference in reducing light strikes to make it worth doing?

[Bubber]

I believe you want to look at this topic http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=156858&hl=+bobbed%20+hammer#entry1754491 It has been discussed at length on many different posts. Hope it helps. later rdd

[alecmc]

I am not a gunsmith, but if I recall correctly, the guy who worked on my revolvers, both a 625 and 327, said that he believes a key factor in a nice light trigger is a lightened hammer. He bobbed the hammer on my 625, and installed an apex on my 327. Both have an amazing double action trigger. The 625 is set at about 4.5lbs double action. Though, they do need well seated federal primers.

From the little I understand about it, all that E=MC2 nonsense, lighter trigger will travel faster.

Personally, I think the work done for a quality trigger job is worth every penny.

[Toolguy]

A lighter hammer will travel faster than a lighter trigger too! A bobbed or lighter hammer works well on centerfire, not good on rimfire.

Edited November 28, 2012 by Toolguy

[moose64]

Thanks for the info, I'll get to work on the ole hammer spur, I am just looking for about 7# DA pull that will light off any primer I run through the gun. I just shoot the Revo Div. For pure fun and challenge maybe 2-3 time a year. If I could reload it better and remember how to count to 6, might shoot it more often....

[Patrick1981]

Bubberize it !!

And take a good extended firing pin, reduced firing pin spring, lighter trigger rebound spring, polish well in right places and set the tension of the mainspring to have 100% ingition with Federal primers. (well seated)

Good job

[practical_man]

Was curious if bobbing the hammer spur and lightening the hammer on a S&W 625-8 is worth the effort? Does it make a enough of a difference in reducing light strikes to make it worth doing?

As others have said, absolutely. I have do e it to a couple of my k frames with good result, along with 11 pound Wolff rebound slide springs and bending the hammer spring. I did mine with a Dremel cutoff wheel and sanding disks. Worked fine and looks good.

Polishing rebound slide and knocking tool marks off the internals won't hurt either.

Warren also did a couple of revolvers for me. He also drilled some holes in the hammer to remove weight and did his magic on all the small things that matter. His work is superb. One day I hope to be able to achieve the same results.

-john

[toothguy]

Was curious if bobbing the hammer spur and lightening the hammer on a S&W 625-8 is worth the effort? Does it make a enough of a difference in reducing light strikes to make it worth doing?

As others have said, absolutely. I have do e it to a couple of my k frames with good result, along with 11 pound Wolff rebound slide springs and bending the hammer spring. I did mine with a Dremel cutoff wheel and sanding disks. Worked fine and looks good.

Polishing rebound slide and knocking tool marks off the internals won't hurt either.

Warren also did a couple of revolvers for me. He also drilled some holes in the hammer to remove weight and did his magic on all the small things that matter. His work is superb. One day I hope to be able to achieve the same results.

-john

I asked Warren how he got so good at tuning the revolvers and he said he learned out of necessity when he competed with them. To get the trigger just the way he wanted it, he learned to do it himself. Now multiply that by hundreds of guns and you get pretty damn good. When I get the chance I watch him work and pick up what I can. He's a good teacher, lots of patience.

Edited December 1, 2012 by toothguy

[toothguy]

Bubberize it !!

And take a good extended firing pin, reduced firing pin spring, lighter trigger rebound spring, polish well in right places and set the tension of the mainspring to have 100% ingition with Federal primers. (well seated)

Good job

+1, I like a bobbed (Carmonized) hammer not just for the lighter trigger pull but also it lets you get a high grip without hammer bite.

Edited December 1, 2012 by toothguy

[Carmoney]

Bubberize it !!

(WTF?)

Bubberizing is something you do to a speedloader. Not a hammer!

[Toolguy]

I think he meant Carmonize it!

[BlueOvalBandit]

I think he meant Carmonize™ it!

There I fixed it.... he is a lawyer after all. jk

Edited December 1, 2012 by BlueOvalBandit

[Patrick1981]

Bubberize it !!

(WTF?)

Bubberizing is something you do to a speedloader. Not a hammer!

Exactly ! ahah sorry but I'm Italian, now for me every thing bubberized is cut !

Carmonized

[Jaxshooter]

I can reply to this as I am the owner of 7 Carmonized S&W revolvers that have double action trigger pulls between 4 1/2 and 5 lbs. They all light off Federal primers loaded on my Dillon 1050.

[moose64]

Well I bobbed the ole spur off and did some more grinding to lighten it more, polished it up and looked pretty good, 8# trigger on it, took it out today and ran 75 rnds with Winchester primers and popped every round off. Federal primers are not always available for me, I prefer having a gun that will work no matter what primer I happen to have at the time. Thanks again for the Info

[snertley]

Bubberize it !!

(WTF?)

Bubberizing is something you do to a speedloader. Not a hammer!

Confusing Carmoney and Bubber? Not sure what to say without offending someone.

[ben b.]

What I don't get is that in 1911s a lighter firing pin is less likely to set off a primer in drop tests, and is associated with light strikes if the mainspring weight is not increased. I don't get why light & faster is supposed to work with primers in revolvers and can cause light strikes in 1911s.

[dcloudy777]

What I don't get is that in 1911s a lighter firing pin is less likely to set off a primer in drop tests, and is associated with light strikes if the mainspring weight is not increased. I don't get why light & faster is supposed to work with primers in revolvers and can cause light strikes in 1911s.

A 1911 (without a firing pin safety), dropped muzzle first, is prone to discharge because of inertia. When the gun hits the floor, it stops, but the firing pin keeps going. The heavier the pin, the greater the inertia, (since a heavy pin falls just as fast as a light one) and the greater the likelihood of a discharge. The firing pin spring in a 1911 slows the firing pin, it doesn't accelerate it. A revolver, on the other hand, hammer isn't being propelled by gravity, but by a spring, so the lighter the hammer the faster it will travel. Hope that helped.

DanO

[ben b.]

Thank you. The mainspring force is also constant unless the spring is changed, so a lighter hammer will have higher velocity but less momentum than a stock hammer, correct? And revo lighteners generally lighten the mainsprings, also reducing velocity and momentum relative to stock mainspring? So with a lighter mainspring, a lighter hammer will travel faster than a light spring and heavy hammer. Is there a sweet spot at which a fast, lighter impact ignites primers better than a slower, harder impact?

[MrBorland]

Is there a sweet spot at which a fast, lighter impact ignites primers better than a slower, harder impact?

I think there is, but first, let's get some basics understood:

Energy: It ain't what sets off primers. It's supplied by the spring, independent of hammer mass.

Momentum: It ain't what sets off primers, either. It's good at moving things, like seating a high-ish for a 2nd strike, or the muzzle, upon hammer strike. But it ain't good for denting things, such as a primer.

Power: This is what sets off primers. It's energy delivered per unit time. Power is great for denting primers. And it's lousy at moving things. A fast hammer is a powerful hammer because it delivers it's energy quickly. A fast and light hammer is a win/win, then - sets off primers without jarring the muzzle. Check out my avatar and the demo vid, using my Carmonized gun:

So, whack it off (the hammer spur, that is ), and stick it back in the gun so hammer mass is the only thing that changes, and hammer speed and power (and therefore reliability) increase. Drop the spring tension some, and you'll can return to factory reliability with less pull weight and hammer jar.

How far you can drop the spring tension (the sweet spot) depends on your situation (e.g. reloading with Federal primers?), how light the hammer is, where the mass was removed, and how smooth your action is. The latter point is important, since a lighter hammer, with less momentum, is more susceptible to friction, so at some point, hammer speed plateaus, and if the gun is in need of internal smoothing, that point comes even quicker. Just as a reference, though, the 686 in the vid below has a DA pull of 7.5-8lbs - kinda heavy by gamer standards - but it's dead nuts reliable and has shot everything I've put through it. And it's plenty accurate to boot.

Tom

[ben b.]

Thank you, that helps.