ogiebb Posted July 26, 2004 Share Posted July 26, 2004 anybody here played around with a really light open Shorty 9mm? iam gathering up some parts for an open gun and i was thinking to have it really light (non bull barrel ,Ti comp, and a lot of cuts to the slide and frame..is having a light blaster gonna bite me when i shoot it ? will the recoil be to unmanagable? thanks.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted July 26, 2004 Share Posted July 26, 2004 Totally depends on your shooting style. I run a Rusty Kidd 5" Pit Viper and it weighs 39 oz. without skeletonizing the gun. Just some cool stuff that Rusty does to the gun to make it light. The longer gun seems to be less violent during recoil, but again, that's a personal preference. Shoot a couple of the wiz bang guns and see whatcha like. I've shot the Brazos Sx and it's pretty sweet. There's the STI Stinger and go on from there. Compare too a 5" gun with a hybrid barrel and a 5" gun with no ports. Try 'em all and go from there. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riden Posted July 27, 2004 Share Posted July 27, 2004 Test drive a Bedell Shorty if you can. Just got one in 38 Super & pretty pleased so far. Dan makes a quality gun for the $$$$. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted July 27, 2004 Share Posted July 27, 2004 I am in the process of building a super light open gun right now. I will post updates as my experiment goes on. It is an STI frame lightened some, Comander slide lightened, Tribrid II aet barrel, Jpoint sight. Shooting to be less than 30oz overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogiebb Posted July 27, 2004 Author Share Posted July 27, 2004 the set up i had in mind was a caspian commander frame lighthened. with standard nowlin barrel with popple hole in it..im just wondering if its gonna kick a lot.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted July 27, 2004 Share Posted July 27, 2004 I have shot a couple like that and they are not bad at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogiebb Posted July 28, 2004 Author Share Posted July 28, 2004 my gunsmith really does not recommend a commander slide now and bull barrel he wants me to go to a regular slide cut 1/2 an inch with a regular barrel and a short comp...should i go a different way or should i just follow the" Doctor knows best "routine? any comment greatly appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted July 28, 2004 Share Posted July 28, 2004 Cutting a regular slide can have benefits in overall slide stroke. A bull barrel on a short gun doesn't make a lot of sense (unless it's a Trubor-style)-- you'll add 1/2" length threading the comp on. If you want the weight, there are some long cones available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Meek Posted July 28, 2004 Share Posted July 28, 2004 Ogiebb, My current open gun is a Caspian Hi-cap w/commander slide lightened to 9.5 oz std barrel with Ti comp. I just received my newest addition which is a Caspain Ti HiCap and will be identically set up to the match the former. I feel the big question comes down to if you are shooting a 38Super or 9mm Major. If you are shooting a 38Super I would go with a 5" slide and cut it down so you have maximum stroke. If you build it in 9mm I would use commander slide which reduces your stroke. I feel the longer stroke that you get with a 5" slide it is not needed for the shorter case ofa 9mm. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted July 28, 2004 Share Posted July 28, 2004 ...I would use commander slide which reduces your stroke. The length of stroke is the same regardless of slide length. The distance from the frame to the back of the slide swoop (technical term for where the reverse plug is) is the same. It's at the muzzle where the difference in slide dimensions lie. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RKooi Posted July 28, 2004 Share Posted July 28, 2004 Rich, my friend, in a word....wrong. A true commander slide is not just a govt. model slide with a little hacked off the muzzle end. A true commander slide on a true govt model 2011 frame will produce a shorter stroke (something like 30 % shorter if I read Bob Londrigan's article correctly.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted July 28, 2004 Share Posted July 28, 2004 Hi Roger, I'll take your word for it. Where is the distance taken out of? Obviously a large portion is taken out of the reverse plug area, but I guess the rest must be taken out of the area in front of the lugs. Hmmm....gotta do some checkin' now. Thanks for clarifying. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Meek Posted July 28, 2004 Share Posted July 28, 2004 (edited) Rich, Measure from the back of the slide to the Recoil spring tunnel, a commander slide has a shorter distance (in the area of a 1/10 of an inch if I remember correctly) I need to measure mine again so I won't forget. A true commander frame will also have a shorter dust cover than a full size government. Alan Quote from Bob Londrigan post on 9mm Commander Post "The slide dimensions are the same from the breechface back but the front end is different (along with the slide stop detent cut and removal slot.) The guide rod plug tunnel is further back on the commander, this is what gives a different stroke length (shorter ) if you combine a commander top with a govt. bottom. You can get back to the original stroke by cutting the rails and the plug tunnel but I think it is easier just to shorten the govt. model and keep the original stroke. It is not so much an ejection/extraction problem with shortening the stroke as it is a cycle time issue. If you shorten the stroke 0.160 it does not sound like much but it is a significant percent of the feed time stroke (the amount of time that the next round has to come up into position." (and the size of the piggy bank is all relative to what you want/get) Edited July 28, 2004 by 9Major-Caspian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogiebb Posted July 28, 2004 Author Share Posted July 28, 2004 alan, its for a 9mm open blaster.. i asked my gunsmith and he said that if i were to use a commander slide he would need to do some cutting ..really lot of great and interesting points here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny hill Posted July 28, 2004 Share Posted July 28, 2004 Do not use a com. slide, just cut .500 off a 5" slide. You will have the long stroke you want w/ the short gun feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Meek Posted July 28, 2004 Share Posted July 28, 2004 ogiebb I would be interested in seeing where the cutting would take place. I'll do some measuring and post here later. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RKooi Posted July 29, 2004 Share Posted July 29, 2004 Rich, What 9M-C said that Bob said...I am just the driver of my short Hardy Custom 9, I let the boys at the engine shop take care of the details (I really wanted to be a NASCAR driver ) I wouldn't want to oppose Mr. Hill but some people want the shorter stroke with the shorter case of the 9x19. And some don't like the reverse plug all naked out there either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogiebb Posted July 29, 2004 Author Share Posted July 29, 2004 ogiebbI would be interested in seeing where the cutting would take place. I'll do some measuring and post here later. Alan he was saying at the frame ..uhh i think.. ill post some pics and everything once its done.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Meek Posted July 29, 2004 Share Posted July 29, 2004 Stroke Measurement 5" Govt Model Slide ~2.130" Commander Slide on Full Size Frame ~1.795 What does this mean? Who knows. My quest for the holy grail is to get the reciprocating mass down as low as possible. Right now my commander slides on my Major 9's weigh-in right around 9.5 ozs. By having a slide that starts out 3/4" shorter gives me a good start in lowering the slide weight. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling White Posted July 29, 2004 Share Posted July 29, 2004 Nuttin like a little HACK-FU! Bet they are well represented at the Nat's this year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoNsTeR Posted July 29, 2004 Share Posted July 29, 2004 Just curious, could you cut 0.75" off a government slide and use a commander-length bull barrel? Y'know, if you wanted to for some bizarre reason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julien Boit Posted July 29, 2004 Share Posted July 29, 2004 I recently build a shorty, based on the minigun stroker design but chambered for 38 super. Its features are : SPS short frame with STI grip and aluminium magwell, STI gov't slide cut to commander length and lightened,KKM bull barrel, Brian Hawley / EMI Ti comp, Recoil master and Cmore Serependity. The gun weighs less than both my Eagle 5.0 and Executive pistols. It had a V4 hybrid system, it handles pretty well. Of course, its loud and hard kicking in the hand, but it shot pretty flat. I like it lot more than my previous Open pistol with a big 9 port EGW steel comp and a 5" slide and barrel. My next will be Trubor competitor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Meek Posted July 29, 2004 Share Posted July 29, 2004 Monster, You should be able do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rush Posted July 30, 2004 Share Posted July 30, 2004 Just curious, could you cut 0.75" off a government slide and use a commander-length bull barrel? Y'know, if you wanted to for some bizarre reason You could. I understand Dan Bedells Shorty Gun is based on a commander bull barrel with a gov't slide cut to fit that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Scientist Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 Cut the slides all ya want but be aware that a slide that is to light will let the gun unlock quicker posibly causing the lugs to roll off. I belive the formula for a 1911 is 9oz or more . that all depends on how much the comp weighs and how much the barrell weights . I personaly like to keep the weight up in the slide. cutting down the comp or using a Titanium one. Also Fluting a bull barrel takes some weight out of the front of the gun.Keep in mind that mass is the Main thing a round has to over come to unlock the action. By the way I keep a digital scale by the mill and weight often while cuting slides. Food for thought. Johnnie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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