Sarge Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I am looking for some opinions on the reasoning behind my findings. I'm glad I like reloading and a certain amount of experimenting. Here are some results I got on the chrono yesterday. 9MAJOR. Gun is a 5" no holes with a Briley Barrel. I got some Auto Comp, Silhouette and 3N37 to try with my 121 IFP's. All loaded to 1.165 with SPP and same headstamp brass. My builder recommended 7.8 3N37 w/121's at 1.165. I only got 163 PF out of that load. I went to 8.1 and only made 166 with primers starting to get pretty flat and the case being pretty full. I'm not sure I can get where I want(172) with this combo. Oddly, others have said this load works great for them in similar setups. I tried Silhouette as well. Lots of recommendations on here and elsewhere for this powder. I went all the way to 8.15 and only managed 167 and again the case is getting maxed out. BUT, I had read enough about Auto Comp that I just had to try it. I took the most recommended starting load of 7.2 for 124's and loaded it with my 121's. Made 171 right out of the gate with no pressure signs at all and the dot seemed to track better for me than with the other loads. I fully understand that all guns are different and shoot identical loads diferently than other guns will. But I'm a little baffled how my gun could under perform so badly with two loads and actually perform better than expected with a third load. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A63111 Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 My gun behaves much like yours. Auto Comp shows no pressure signs. Silhoutte and HS6 both show very flat primers. Haven't tried 3N37. Auto Comp seems dirty, leaves lots of flakes in the slide, but seems to be the best load for this gun. STI TruBor 5" no popple holes and T1 comp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gng4life Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I had some similar results with N350. I heard others on here making major with it and I couldn't even get close without the primers looking pretty bad and it felt pretty rough. I do love the VV powders but that was not a good choice for what I was doing in my pistol. Funny you mention WAC, I just picked up a pound today to do some experimenting. I'll try the load you listed (but working my way up) to see what happens with my pistol. I want to try Comp also before I decide on my favorite load. Thanks for the post Kevin! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggerJJ Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 you may want to give HS6 a go, I find it softer and flatter than Autocomp with no pressure signs at 175pf, and its not a compressed load so no powder slinging on the press...its worth a try anyway... (my impression of Autocomp was its "violent") With 3N37 and Sil I also "peaked" like you did. YMMV jj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLM Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 I tried Silhouette as well. Lots of recommendations on here and elsewhere for this powder. I went all the way to 8.15 and only managed 167 and again the case is getting maxed out. So you know I am not, repeat NOT being anything but 100% serious... Are you SURE you had the Silhouette in the press? I ask because I've shot cases upon cases of MG 115's over Sil and the 121 is nothing more than the 115 with the nose filled in. I load a tiny bit longer, 1.170" but that only .005". I'm burning 8.6 to 8.8 grains under the 115's and it's no where near to being compressed, let alone a full case. I'm REALLY surprised to read that the case is maxed out at less than 8.2 grains. That just doesn't make sense Kevin. I just did some checking and with 8.6 grains of Silhouette in the case a 121 slides down to about 1.150" until it sits on the powder so there's no way, with Silhouette, your case was maxed out with 8.2. Be Safe Kevin and enjoy the new blaster! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted June 6, 2011 Author Share Posted June 6, 2011 I tried Silhouette as well. Lots of recommendations on here and elsewhere for this powder. I went all the way to 8.15 and only managed 167 and again the case is getting maxed out. So you know I am not, repeat NOT being anything but 100% serious... Are you SURE you had the Silhouette in the press? I ask because I've shot cases upon cases of MG 115's over Sil and the 121 is nothing more than the 115 with the nose filled in. I load a tiny bit longer, 1.170" but that only .005". I'm burning 8.6 to 8.8 grains under the 115's and it's no where near to being compressed, let alone a full case. I'm REALLY surprised to read that the case is maxed out at less than 8.2 grains. That just doesn't make sense Kevin. I just did some checking and with 8.6 grains of Silhouette in the case a 121 slides down to about 1.150" until it sits on the powder so there's no way, with Silhouette, your case was maxed out with 8.2. Be Safe Kevin and enjoy the new blaster! 100% sure. Brand new unopened jug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted June 6, 2011 Author Share Posted June 6, 2011 you may want to give HS6 a go, I find it softer and flatter than Autocomp with no pressure signs at 175pf, and its not a compressed load so no powder slinging on the press...its worth a try anyway... (my impression of Autocomp was its "violent") With 3N37 and Sil I also "peaked" like you did. YMMV jj Glad to hear I'm not alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOne Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 I tried Silhouette as well. Lots of recommendations on here and elsewhere for this powder. I went all the way to 8.15 and only managed 167 and again the case is getting maxed out. So you know I am not, repeat NOT being anything but 100% serious... Are you SURE you had the Silhouette in the press? I ask because I've shot cases upon cases of MG 115's over Sil and the 121 is nothing more than the 115 with the nose filled in. I load a tiny bit longer, 1.170" but that only .005". I'm burning 8.6 to 8.8 grains under the 115's and it's no where near to being compressed, let alone a full case. I'm REALLY surprised to read that the case is maxed out at less than 8.2 grains. That just doesn't make sense Kevin. I just did some checking and with 8.6 grains of Silhouette in the case a 121 slides down to about 1.150" until it sits on the powder so there's no way, with Silhouette, your case was maxed out with 8.2. Be Safe Kevin and enjoy the new blaster! 100% sure. Brand new unopened jug. Are you 100% sure it wasn't a 380 case? I know you are, but had to ask.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted June 6, 2011 Author Share Posted June 6, 2011 I tried Silhouette as well. Lots of recommendations on here and elsewhere for this powder. I went all the way to 8.15 and only managed 167 and again the case is getting maxed out. So you know I am not, repeat NOT being anything but 100% serious... Are you SURE you had the Silhouette in the press? I ask because I've shot cases upon cases of MG 115's over Sil and the 121 is nothing more than the 115 with the nose filled in. I load a tiny bit longer, 1.170" but that only .005". I'm burning 8.6 to 8.8 grains under the 115's and it's no where near to being compressed, let alone a full case. I'm REALLY surprised to read that the case is maxed out at less than 8.2 grains. That just doesn't make sense Kevin. I just did some checking and with 8.6 grains of Silhouette in the case a 121 slides down to about 1.150" until it sits on the powder so there's no way, with Silhouette, your case was maxed out with 8.2. Be Safe Kevin and enjoy the new blaster! 100% sure. Brand new unopened jug. Are you 100% sure it wasn't a 380 case? I know you are, but had to ask.... Come on!! I loaded 50 of them. Pretty sure they were 9mm. FC to be exact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOne Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 I tried Silhouette as well. Lots of recommendations on here and elsewhere for this powder. I went all the way to 8.15 and only managed 167 and again the case is getting maxed out. So you know I am not, repeat NOT being anything but 100% serious... Are you SURE you had the Silhouette in the press? I ask because I've shot cases upon cases of MG 115's over Sil and the 121 is nothing more than the 115 with the nose filled in. I load a tiny bit longer, 1.170" but that only .005". I'm burning 8.6 to 8.8 grains under the 115's and it's no where near to being compressed, let alone a full case. I'm REALLY surprised to read that the case is maxed out at less than 8.2 grains. That just doesn't make sense Kevin. I just did some checking and with 8.6 grains of Silhouette in the case a 121 slides down to about 1.150" until it sits on the powder so there's no way, with Silhouette, your case was maxed out with 8.2. Be Safe Kevin and enjoy the new blaster! 100% sure. Brand new unopened jug. Are you 100% sure it wasn't a 380 case? I know you are, but had to ask.... Come on!! I loaded 50 of them. Pretty sure they were 9mm. FC to be exact. Sarge, I wasn't being facetious....Sometimes the obvious is what gets overlooked the most. As far as filling up the case, I wonder if maybe the jug you have is "Fluffier" than normal, or maybe theirs is "Denser" than normal...Or, maybe the case inside dimensions are different on the brass you are using. Have you tried different headstamp brass to see how much it fills up the case? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gng4life Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 Besides, a. 380 case will pop out of a 9mm shellplate when you try to seat the primer. Can you both take pics and post them, this is really getting my curiosity up? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OpenDot Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 I am looking for some opinions on the reasoning behind my findings. I'm glad I like reloading and a certain amount of experimenting. Here are some results I got on the chrono yesterday. 9MAJOR. Gun is a 5" no holes with a Briley Barrel. I got some Auto Comp, Silhouette and 3N37 to try with my 121 IFP's. All loaded to 1.165 with SPP and same headstamp brass. My builder recommended 7.8 3N37 w/121's at 1.165. I only got 163 PF out of that load. I went to 8.1 and only made 166 with primers starting to get pretty flat and the case being pretty full. I'm not sure I can get where I want(172) with this combo. Oddly, others have said this load works great for them in similar setups. I tried Silhouette as well. Lots of recommendations on here and elsewhere for this powder. I went all the way to 8.15 and only managed 167 and again the case is getting maxed out. BUT, I had read enough about Auto Comp that I just had to try it. I took the most recommended starting load of 7.2 for 124's and loaded it with my 121's. Made 171 right out of the gate with no pressure signs at all and the dot seemed to track better for me than with the other loads. I fully understand that all guns are different and shoot identical loads diferently than other guns will. But I'm a little baffled how my gun could under perform so badly with two loads and actually perform better than expected with a third load. Any thoughts? I went up to 7.4gr AC, it pushes a little more gas through the comp. I also went out to 1.175 OAL from 1.165 and now all my Feed issue are gone. I also use WSRP as insurance. When I did my last chrono session with this loadout I used federal SPP and still had no pressure signs. WSRP are like a $1.00 more per 1000 so for a buck added insurance. 174 PF. it's a little louder though lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxbat Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 Besides, a. 380 case will pop out of a 9mm shellplate when you try to seat the primer. Not necessarily. I have a small pile of primed .380 cases next to my 9mm presses - they do get through! Another one that I sometimes see in mixed brass batches is the 9mm Makarow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcs Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 Kevin, First I would try SRP. Some use SPP in open, but not many. Second. Like SLM I have loaded thousands of 115 with Silhouette. (I even had popple holes) With that much Sil in the case you should be at 190PF. Something is wrong with that barrel. It does happen. I shot out a brand new barrel in less than 5K rounds. I have a 9 Major with an almost new STI barrel. If you want, we can compare some of my Sil loads in my gun and then your gun over my chrono. Let's get some backup data for the builder as he is the one to go back on the barrel manufacturer if the barrel is bad. I know my chrono is on the money. Let me know and we could meet at MSC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gng4life Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 Besides, a. 380 case will pop out of a 9mm shellplate when you try to seat the primer. Not necessarily. I have a small pile of primed .380 cases next to my 9mm presses - they do get through! Another one that I sometimes see in mixed brass batches is the 9mm Makarow Really? Okay, I'll qualify that statement a little bit. If are using a Dillon 550 with a #5 shellplate to load 9mm and you put a .380 standard case with a case head diameter of about .374 (vs. about .392 of a 9mm), it SHOULD be pushed out of the shellplate when you attempt to seat the primer. The .380 case uses a #3 shellplate from Dillon. I have tons of .380 that slipped through my sorting and got into my case bin. In fact, had a few on Saturday night. However, I don't think this is the issue at hand, there is a big difference between the .380 and 9mm case and easily distinguishable if you have both cases to compare. I'm going with the powder lots or internal case dimension theories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted June 6, 2011 Author Share Posted June 6, 2011 I might set it back up with sil and take a picture. Larry I might take you up on the offer to get together and check this out. Still, what gets me is that AC is right on the money according to what others are shooting as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usmc1974 Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 I have tryed HS6 power pistol blue dot with spmp and standard primers. AutoComp is by far the best it is not compressed or very very lightly at best. 10 rounds 7 grains Autocomp MG 124JHP 1.160 AV 1376 pf 170.62 no pressure signs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 (edited) Try #4756, way back when I shot 9 Major with it in a Glock 17L and never had any problems. Back when PF was 175 before 9 Major was banned and before Jerry started the red dot usage in USPSA. Edited June 6, 2011 by Steve RA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bansheex Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 I have been reading this thread and would like to ask you guys a question. I have been loading mine with 6.5grs of autocomp at 1.14oal I tried 7.0grs at the same oal and am seeing a little bit of pressure on the primers I just tried a dummy round at 1.16 oal and if fits the barrel.( I did not know my Bar-Sto barrel would let me go that long ) So my question is, loading at an oal of 1.16 with 7.2grs of powder lessen the pressure? I'm still getting a little muzzle flip, and would like to get it as flat as possible. Gun is a Springfield XDM with a Bar-Sto barrel and a 3 port comp. Thanks Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THM7 Posted June 11, 2011 Share Posted June 11, 2011 (edited) Kevin,First I would try SRP. Some use SPP in open, but not many. I tried SRP and ended up with breech erosion.....they did not seal the primer pocket. No issues with Win SPP. Edited June 11, 2011 by THM7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted June 12, 2011 Author Share Posted June 12, 2011 I have been reading this thread and would like to ask you guys a question. I have been loading mine with 6.5grs of autocomp at 1.14oal I tried 7.0grs at the same oal and am seeing a little bit of pressure on the primers I just tried a dummy round at 1.16 oal and if fits the barrel.( I did not know my Bar-Sto barrel would let me go that long ) So my question is, loading at an oal of 1.16 with 7.2grs of powder lessen the pressure? I'm still getting a little muzzle flip, and would like to get it as flat as possible. Gun is a Springfield XDM with a Bar-Sto barrel and a 3 port comp. Thanks Don I'm sure there is a magic formula but I don't know it. BUT it would stand to reason that a given amount of powder at a given oal will be mirrored at some point by a larger amount of powder with a longer oal. Longer oals simply leave more room in the case. No way of knowing if going to 1.16 with 7.2 will lower or raise pressure. Make sure 1.16 will work in your mags though. They should. If 1.14 is working perfectly and is accurate and is making pf, why not just leave it alone? The longer oal is just going to use more powder. BUT if the longer oal provides an improvement in accuracy or function then by all means try it out. I think with 9MAJOR primers are going to look at least a little flat no matter what. My primers with 7.2 WAC look the most like minor load primers but they are a tiny bit flat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted June 12, 2011 Author Share Posted June 12, 2011 OK . Went back to the chrono. I'm glad I enjoy this aspect of shooting, otherwise it might be very aggravating. As I last said 7.2 WAC @1.165 with 121 IFP has become a front runner due to the ease with which it makes PF, dot tracking, etc. But on some advice I have gotten here I loaded some 7.4's to see if more gas would make the dot more stable. Did not turn out to be the case, at least for me and one other experienced Open shooter. In a blind test we both picked the 7.2 load. On to Silohuette. I think based on the temp sensitivity I am not too keen on this powder but I was willing to see what all the hype was about. As last posted I was getting nothing out of the powder PF wise as compared to other shooters. I had loaded 8.15 and gotten 167 pf. Knowing it is a relatively safe powder I went to 8.4. WOW! Went to 178 PF. Velocity jumped from upper 1300's to 1465 and flattened the bejeezul out of the poor primers. To cap the day off the other Open shooter gave me some of his loads with 3N37 to try. He told me not to give up on it just yet. I got 169 and change out of them and they felt pretty good so I guess the jury is still out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOne Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 OK . Went back to the chrono. I'm glad I enjoy this aspect of shooting, otherwise it might be very aggravating. As I last said 7.2 WAC @1.165 with 121 IFP has become a front runner due to the ease with which it makes PF, dot tracking, etc. But on some advice I have gotten here I loaded some 7.4's to see if more gas would make the dot more stable. Did not turn out to be the case, at least for me and one other experienced Open shooter. In a blind test we both picked the 7.2 load. On to Silohuette. I think based on the temp sensitivity I am not too keen on this powder but I was willing to see what all the hype was about. As last posted I was getting nothing out of the powder PF wise as compared to other shooters. I had loaded 8.15 and gotten 167 pf. Knowing it is a relatively safe powder I went to 8.4. WOW! Went to 178 PF. Velocity jumped from upper 1300's to 1465 and flattened the bejeezul out of the poor primers. To cap the day off the other Open shooter gave me some of his loads with 3N37 to try. He told me not to give up on it just yet. I got 169 and change out of them and they felt pretty good so I guess the jury is still out. Everyone of us have a little bit of the "Mad Scientist" in us...And this is a very good way to let him/her/it out...I'm like you, Sarge...It's fun setting up a new load, figuring out what will happen if I just change this little part... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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