lndshrk Posted February 7, 2004 Share Posted February 7, 2004 Shooting in my first IDPA qualifier shortly. Have watched several videos that refer to IDPA rule regarding wearing shooting vest to simulate concealed carry situation. However, do not see anything in rule book that mandates wearing of vest while shooting. Will I be able to shoot the qualifier without it or is it time to order one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cpty1 Posted February 7, 2004 Share Posted February 7, 2004 The qualifier is shot without the vest. At most IDPA matches I've attended, the course of fire will specify whether concealment (vest) is needed or not. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayonaise Posted February 7, 2004 Share Posted February 7, 2004 To add to what Chris said. The classifier is a "standard" marksmanship exercise. Any COF that has a limited Vickers round count may be shot w/out a concealment garment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gun Geek Posted February 7, 2004 Share Posted February 7, 2004 Dittos on the classifier - no cover garment needed. A particular type of garment (i.e. vest) is not mandated. The garment can be a shirt, a jacket, etc, Many guys use vests for several reasons: -The vests are being made with stiffiners in the lower flank. This makes the draw easier and quicker. -The pockets make it easier to manage all the little stuff. -Vests leave the arms uncovered once the gun is drawn - fewer things to get in the way -Vests look cool! Geek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 (edited) Is concealment actually mandatory (except for what is listed in previous messages), or is it at the discretion/whim of the match director? I know most clubs do almost everything from concealment, but I don't recall a rule requiring it. And of course I'm too lazy to look it up. Okay ... I just searched the rule book online for "concealment" and from what I could find (references to penalties IF concealment is required, etc.), I inferred that concealment garments are not literally required by the rules. Edited February 8, 2004 by rhino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 Rhino, It's usually spelled out in the stage description.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRG65 Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 Actually rhino, it really depends on the MD. The clubs I shoot most (probably 6/10)of the stages are shot w/o concealment. This is eastern Ohio, Northern WV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vluc Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 Western PA...no concealment save once a season a match is shot that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Perez Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 All of our sanctioned matches have a majority of stages that require a concealment garment. During the summer , local matches are concealment optional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincent Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 One of the big things about IDPA is "simulating a potential real life self-defense scenario". Since most civilians carrying a gun and spare magazines would be carrying concealed it is logical that concealment would be part of many courses of fire in IDPA. I'm sure this is a lot clearer to clubs being run in "shall issue" concealed carry permit states. Here in Houston just about every stage is shot from concealment, except the classifier. This is good practice because just about every stage at the Nationals is shot from concealment. The most popular vests in this area are the Competitive Concealment vest from http://www.tacticaltrainers.com and the Royal Robbins 511 vest. I like the Competitive Concealment vest because I use grip tape which eats holes in the cotton vests pretty quick (usually less than one season). The Cordura vest from Competitive Concealment is much more abrasion resistant. Mine is several years old and still in great shape. Some folks who like the looks of the cotton vests have had Cordura sewn where the grip rubs for added abrasion resistance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gun Geek Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 Our club is in Kentucky which is a shall issue state. At other clubs in the state, a stage is from concealment unless it is a standard or a drill type. This is in keeping with what Vincent said about "simulating a potential real life self-defense scenario". Our new club (first shoot is today!) will hold to this philosophy. There are a few exceptions (you're in bed and and have jump up, get your iron and go to it). Again, this is determined by the scenario. Look at it this way - if you don't have concealment and don't have a scenario, what do you have? IPSC lite! Geek President (El Presidente?) Central Kentucky Sport Shooters www.ckss.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 There are those that do it 95% of the time and those that do it 5% of the time. Practice the things which are shot in your local club. Those are the things which will help you place higher locally and then if you have aspirations of going to a Natl's or something on a grander scale than a local club match, be prepared to see concealment on 9 of 10 stages. Don't just assume that since you can do a tac load for the classifier you can do it with concealment too. Way different dealing with outter clothing especially accessing mags and stowing them etc. You don't have to buy a "concealment vest" from some manufacturer, I use an oversize jeans jacket with the sleeves removed. The thing you have to be aware of is how well it covers your gear when standing relaxed hands down. If it does not cover, you will not be allowed to use it in a big match. You don't have to spend 50 bucks for a garment. Any jacket is better than any shirt due to the heavier nature of the jacket material, but there is no rule that I am aware of that says the concealment garment cannot allow the pistol to Print, so a shirt is OK in that regard. However, I would not try to convince a LEO that a shirt constitutes real concealment in Tx for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southpaw dan Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 With Alabama being an issue state, most all of the stages that I've shot required concealment. I shoot the standard stages with concealment anyway because I've practiced my draw & reloads from it so much. Several of the shooters in this area really carry what they compete with so there's a real "defense/tactical" sense to most all the scenarios. TL's right, you don't have to use some expensive "LOOK AT ME" vest. A simple windbreaker or flannel shirt does just fine. Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sludge Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 Well, at the clubs I visit here in NC we shoot with concealment almost all the time. Not in classifiers etc but in senario stages its usually required unless it is extremely hot. I think that above 95 degrees we shed the concealment if I remember right. Something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincent Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 At local matches you can often get away with just about any cover garment, especially when you are a beginner. If you start getting more interested in the competitive side of the game then you will gravitate toward what is faster. When they check your concealment at Nationals, the SO's have you stand with your arms UP and out to your sides like you're a kid playing airplane. The SO's then check that you can't see your gun/holster sticking out of the bottom of the concealment as well as make sure that the gun/holster and magazine carriers are not visible from the front. It's pretty easy to find a garment that meets these requirements, especially with short barreled guns. It's a bit harder to find one that doesn't slow you down too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 For years the local IDPA club hasn't required concealment. Just recently they decided to change that policy and and make concealment mandatory for everything, including the classifier. Oh well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Just another instance of the clubs not following the LGB, and the rules not being enforced. This is why the sport if getting a bad name... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lndshrk Posted February 11, 2004 Author Share Posted February 11, 2004 There is no mention of mandatory wearing of a vest in the IDPA rulebook, however there is this one line about, "Not drawing from concealment as required". I assume this is the reason why vests are recommended? Procedural Errors (3 second penalty) 1. First "finger in trigger guard" violation, as long as it wasn’t dangerous. 2. Not using cover properly (50% of torso/head must be behind cover) 3. Not reloading as required 4. Not shooting while moving as required 5. Not drawing from concealment as required 6. Not following other COF rules as required Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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