Uspsa Classifications

[Alan Meek]

As we all look to the start of the 2004 shooting season I thought I would put on the table as to what everyone thinks the purpose of the USPSA Classifications are.

Alan

[Ron Ankeny]

That's easy...to separate shooters by approximate ability level.

[Jake Di Vita]

Seems pretty cut and dry. Were you trying to get into something deeper?

[Alan Meek]

Jake,

Actually am looking deeeper as to what the community at large thinks. Yes at the surface it does seem pretty cut and dry. But, why do we have classifications and what purpose do they serve and what would be the best use of the classifications.

Alan

[L9X25]

Alan,

In old days folks showed up to shoot and there was one winner (HOA) and the rest were losers. Due to various factors (age, skill level, handicaps, physical fitness) it was not possible for some to win. The people that were not capable of being HOA accepted shooting for the enjoyment alone or quit.

Creating the classes give the people at all the levels the opportunity to "win" and makes the sport appealing to a larger population of shooters.

Is this what you are looking for?

[Alan Meek]

L9X25

Yes that is a good start.

Alan

[Ron Ankeny]

The intent of the system is to group shooters of similar ability just as divisions group similar equipment. The intent is just that simple. Whether or not the system meets that intent has been debated to death.

[warpspeed]

From my point of view, it gives you a very accurate measuremnt of your skills.

If the TGO or TJ or KC or MV shoot a stage with a 9.0 hf and I shoot it at a 6.0 hf, it tells me exactly how far I have to go or not

[BritinUSA]

In my opinion the USPSA Classification system exists primarily as a revenue-generating tool for USPSA.

Anyone who checks out the scores at Area and Nationals matches will see that a person's classification bears little or no resemblance to final placing for the majority of shooters.

The classification stages are unlike any that are ever found in major USPSA matches. Add to that the fact that it is possible to shoot the same stage over and over again until a good score is made violates the principle that each stage should be shot only once.

We are now entering the 6th year with the same classification stages and just about every stage has been done by just about everyone at least more than once. The absence of field courses severely limits the credibility of the classification database.

There are bragging rights to be gained by those that reshoot the stages over and over again to attain the hallowed GM card but then attend a nationals and barely scrape in at around 60% .

A person's classification could be an accurate respresentation of their shooting ability at a major match but chances are the classification of a shooter is artificially high. If the classification is not accurate then it's value is degraded.

The main beneficiary of the classification system is the USPSA bank balance.

Just my 2 cents

[kimel]

I look at the classification system as a series of goals which one can work toward. Many of "us" are goal oriented/driven and this is what we need as a challenge.

This also serves as an individual benchmark. At the end of a shooting season I might think I shot better and maybe I started placing near the top in some stages. I might be lead to believe then, that I had improved but without any real evidence I wouldn't "know" this. Classification gives the evidence that we need to see how we have progressed over time. This is especially true when we reshoot the same classifiers later on.

Does it also serve to support USPSA. Yeah, sure it does. But they are also the ones that are administering this "giant postal match" and they sure can't do it for free. And classifier fees are one helluva lot cheaper than Greens Fees at the golf course. Shoot, I spend more in gas getting to the match and back home than the classifier fee costs.

[Vince Pinto]

Hi guys,

The most important thing to remember is that obtaining a classification is entirely optional for each competitor, at least when it comes to the USPSA and in respect of the "ICS" (International Classification System) operated by IPSC, and I'm not personally aware of any Region where obtaining a classification is mandatory.

If you're not interested, don't get one. Simple really. If you want to gauge or measure your progress and/or qualify for a trophy or prize which may be available for different classes at some matches, knock yourself out.

However even if you don't go through the motions, you can still gauge your class by examining your results at major matches. If you finish in the X-Y% percentile of a big match, then clearly you shot that particular match as an "X-Y" class.

[vluc]

I think Vince tagged it, at least for me. I look at where I placed overall and that shows me how I shot. If I'm in the "B" percentage at the end of the day, how I shot the classifier matters little. It is only one stage of perhaps 5 in a local match.

Now not everyone is fortunate enough to shoot a classifier every week like we do or as many of you may or may not. Took my shooting partner and I a half-season or so to get out of the mind set of having to ace that classifier so we could be a certain letter.

Heck, when I was "D" class I was still placing up higher than that in the matches. Now I'm a lick away from "B" but I no longer worry about it. The classifiers system is a nice ballpark approximation of our ability, but when folks can repeatedly practice a handful of classifiers and get a letter, it does cheapen it a tad. They measure our ability to shoot the classifier, not necessarily our overall shooting ability. Some of the folks I shoot with, open and limited A-M shooters, are now shooting production classifiers. I've yet to see them run a COF solely as Production and production is not run first!

Our game is not just el presidente and bill drills, it has field courses, et al and perhaps the time has come for more of those, but some clubs just don't have the bay space to put those together.

[Duane Thomas]

The classification stages are unlike any that are ever found in major USPSA matches.

Not quite. I'll buy off on usually see at major matches, but after shooting the El Presidente at the 2002 Factory Gun Nationals, I can't say we never see such stages.

We are now entering the 6th year with the same classification stages and just about every stage has been done by just about everyone at least more than once.

Not really. If you examine the records of various USPSA clubs that post their match results to the Internet - and I have - you'll see about a third of the classifiers are, essentially, never used. These are the ones that require siginficant movement, thus a wide bay to set up. Most match directors would rather use their larger bays for a field course of their own design. That's the priority, giving people something new and fun, and affording MDs an opportunity to exercise their creativity. By contrast, the classifier is seen as something "extra," not a priority. And it's a helluva lot easier to set up three targets one yard apart and run an El Prez in a narrow bay that's not good for much else than to set up one of the complex "movement" classifiers.

The absence of field courses severely limits the credibility of the classification database.

True, if you're looking at the classification as a predictor of match performance. But realistically that's not going to change, for reasons discussed above. OTOH, as a measurement of general gunhandling skill, it's excellent.

[Rob Boudrie]

In my opinion the USPSA Classification system exists primarily as a revenue-generating tool for USPSA.

Anyone who checks out the scores at Area and Nationals matches will see that a person's classification bears little or no resemblance to final placing for the majority of shooters.

(1) Revenue generation is an important component of the classification program - without it, the options would be to cut back on programs, spend our net worth into oblivion, or increase dues drastically.

(2) Although one's classification percentage is often higher than how one shoots at a really big match (most A's shoot under 75% at the nationals, etc.), it's also worth looking at the results from any National Championship or Area and notice how closly classificaiton is correlated with order of placement. Although there are always fliers, the correlation is really pretty good.

[L9X25]

I agree with Rob that classification is a good indicator of order of match finish even if the percentages are off. The main reason is that classification % are different than match % is that classifications are ususally comprised of your best classifiers and not your average. In a big match we have good stages and bad stages. Our classification does not usually reflect stages which we crash.

Leo

[mattjoe]

"Anyone who checks out the scores at Area and Nationals matches will see that a person's classification bears little or no resemblance to final placing for the majority of shooters."

I think that is an absolutely unfounded statement. I know at every major match I have shot in the last 4 years I have finished within + or - 10% of my actual classification %. And that directly translates into where I finish in standings.

If one examines the results closely you will always see the majority of the same class of shooter finish around each other. The classification system does work. It is not up to the system to police abuse of the system, that is up to individuals and the clubs the classifiers are being shot at. The system itself cannot maintain the integrity of the shooters. Blaming the existence of the classification system for the abuse of the system through numerous reshoots by certain individuals makes about as much sense as blaming handguns for shootings.

If someone goes and gets themselves overclassed artifically high, so be it. Serves them right when they go become a Master and go out and get spanked by a bunch of B shooters at the Nationals. I am not at all bothered by that, it is poetic justice.

[Turtle]

In a way, the classification system is what you want it to be. If you love to be on the range, shooting a match, with other people who love to be on the range, then the classification system helps to promote competition. That usually serves to help us better ourselves as shooters. If shooters were always 'losing' to the top guys, they might get too discouraged. It's not perfect but it serves its purpose (several, actually). God, I love this sport.....