Duane Thomas Posted March 21, 2010 Share Posted March 21, 2010 On the home page it has a quote saying that the edge helped someone shave 20 seconds off a classifier time in IDPA. Oh yeah, that sounds likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted March 21, 2010 Share Posted March 21, 2010 Nik, Charlie no longer creates triggers that include moving the location of the trigger pin, however one of his kits involves a slight trimming of the trigger safely. So you are the best kind of correct. You are technically correct. I'd hate for someone to get bumped to open..... ....and there are used Vanek's out there..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McGlock Posted March 22, 2010 Share Posted March 22, 2010 Nik, Charlie no longer creates triggers that include moving the location of the trigger pin, however one of his kits involves a slight trimming of the trigger safely. So you are the best kind of correct. You are technically correct. Not to drift off subject... but what does moving the location of the trigger pin do?? Is this the pin that holds the bar to the trigger pad or drilling a new hole for the large trigger pad pin to go through?? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micah Posted March 22, 2010 Share Posted March 22, 2010 It is a relocation of the trigger shoe on the trigger bar. In effect, it changes the geometry of the trigger's fulcrum and requires less force to pull the trigger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shooter32 Posted March 22, 2010 Author Share Posted March 22, 2010 (edited) Mr. Thomas to answer your aquestion i like the re-set alot better and the trigger feels crisper on the break . As far as posting pics of the two triggers together i can do that , you can not tell alot of difference just by looking . Glocktriggers make three diff models so if you are concerned about the Edge being legal you can use the Challenger , i have not used the Challenger so i cant speak for it . And i shoot mostly IDPA in SSP and ESP. Edited March 22, 2010 by Shooter32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoNsTeR Posted March 22, 2010 Share Posted March 22, 2010 What's the final pull weight like? I've never cared much about trigger feel on a Glock, it's gonna be squishy no matter what and to an extent that's a feature not a bug. I love my Vanek triggers for the 2# pull weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
openrange Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 Tested them both and wanted to give my 2c. I own a range and had the opportunity to shoot a G17 with vanek and with Glocktriggers one after the other. I'm not sure the exact model numbers/names of each one but I noticed the following: The vanek seemed to have manipulated (shaved) the trigger bar assembly where it hits the firing pin safety. The metal comes to a point that made me a little uncomfortable that the safety would actually engage/disengage at the correct time. The drop safety channel was obstructed by a set screw seemingly disabled the drop safety as well although I'm not an expert on that and maybe he figured a work around, yet I couldn't figure it out. In my non-pro Glock armorer mind this could lead to slamfiring or other maladies although I didn't experience any. The Glocktriggers kept the same form as stock which seemed a safer alternative to me. The reset on the Glocktriggers was definitely crisper than the Vanek. When I mean crisp I mean the reset is fairly forceful with a definite click where the vanek was a little mushy. Less positive would be fair. Was it unacceptable? No. Was the Glocktrigger more crisp? Yes. The pre travel was almost non existent in the Glocktriggers and as a bonus the trigger itself sat closer to the rear of the gun so if you had small hands it was easier to engage. I don't have small hands and appreciated the noticeable lack of pre-travel. I would say the vanek was good yet not as cleanly done. The "pull" was not metered at the test. My finger couldn't tell the difference in release weight between the two. I would give them a draw and both were nice. In conclusion: I felt that both the Glocktriggers and the Vanek were vast improvements over stock. I would give the Glocktriggers a thumbs up for their design that seemed safer in comparison to the vanek which seemed to disable the drop safety and manipulated the firing pin safety, for the crisper reset and for the take up in pre-travel. I'm not sure of the price difference at this writing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micah Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 As far as posting pics of the two triggers together i can do that , you can not tell alot of difference just by looking . Great! I can't wait to see the pix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jman Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 (edited) vanek which seemed to disable the drop safety. Hello mods. I love y'all...you know that right. Any possibility of deleting a post such as the one I've quoted? It would lead a new reader to believe the Mr. Vaneks triggers defeat safties. When we all know that mouth breathing knuckle dragger's like me who install them wrong are defeating the safeties. Just askin' Thanks! Jim Edited March 23, 2010 by Jman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 Jim, I think the audience here is aware that the Vanek is a known entity, and can recognize some speculation (as acknowledged by the poster). Hopefully the thread can continue on with members sharing their experiences as best they can...without too much bias to their favorites. (Please communicate all future Moderating issues/question through PM's) - Admin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McGlock Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 It is a relocation of the trigger shoe on the trigger bar. In effect, it changes the geometry of the trigger's fulcrum and requires less force to pull the trigger. Any pictures of the mod??? Ryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric nielsen Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 (edited) If a person has been on this forum for any length of time, they are likely familiar with the clinical, BORING, unemotional tone of almost every post I've ever made. That continues below - same thing. Unemotional. In case you might "read" something else. Charlie Vanek has gone to extraordinary lengths to ensure that the triggers he installed himself [like mine, serial #47] work as safe or safer than the intention of Gaston Glock. If a part is recontoured, such as the narrow safety trigger or the working face of the drop-safety plunger, it makes it LESS not more likely that the gun will fire at the wrong time or an unintended time. He continues this with every trigger he sells for you to install. He leaves considerably more room for operator error & "creativity" in a trigger he doesn't fit than in one he does fit. It might take time, educating yourself on Glock function, a flashlight looking up the magwell, and the patience to swap parts a few times but basically any Vanek trigger owner will eventually see what I mean. If there is a set screw in a gun that holds or pushes the DS plunger out of the way, other than at Mr. Glock's intended timing, it wasn't installed or sold by Charlie Vanek. Comparisons are usually fine, even if they are not always 100% factually correct. A product that is good on its own merits usually does well. Edited March 23, 2010 by eric nielsen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 On the home page it has a quote saying that the edge helped someone shave 20 seconds off a classifier time in IDPA. Oh yeah, that sounds likely. I thought that sounded...dubious...as well. But, when I looked at the website I see the quote was taken out of context. It merely says: "This trigger helped me shave 20 seconds of my IDPA Classifier time in only one season." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyclone336 Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 The pre travel was almost non existent in the Glocktriggers and as a bonus the trigger itself sat closer to the rear of the gun so if you had small hands it was easier to engage. Am I thinking about this too hard, or does this implicate the USPSA Production rule against externally visible modifications? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micah Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 No. Pretravel slack can be eliminated by internal measures, just not external. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McGlock Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 It is a relocation of the trigger shoe on the trigger bar. In effect, it changes the geometry of the trigger's fulcrum and requires less force to pull the trigger. Pharaoh, Any pics of that mod??? Or maybe an explanation of where to relocate... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBP55 Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 After reading this thread I just ordered another Vanek trigger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric nielsen Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 McGlock More like the blue. I was inexact, on purpose. If you assume your time is worth say $14/hour [my laughable intern pay at the moment] and trigger bars [pre-trash] are also $14 each, you would save many $$ and cuss words by just paying someone like Charlie to do it for you, even with 2-way shipping. Chance of getting it right with a working gun, with no experience, is very very low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayouSlide Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 (edited) The vanek seemed to have manipulated (shaved) the trigger bar assembly where it hits the firing pin safety. The metal comes to a point that made me a little uncomfortable that the safety would actually engage/disengage at the correct time. The drop safety channel was obstructed by a set screw seemingly disabled the drop safety as well although I'm not an expert on that and maybe he figured a work around, yet I couldn't figure it out. In my non-pro Glock armorer mind this could lead to slamfiring or other maladies although I didn't experience any....<snip> I would give the Glocktriggers a thumbs up for their design that seemed safer in comparison to the vanek which seemed to disable the drop safety and manipulated the firing pin safety, for the crisper reset and for the take up in pre-travel. I'm not sure of the price difference at this writing. I think you might be a bit confused. As a longtime Vanek user, I'm familiar with his triggers. The set screw you're describing is a common way (Lone Wolf sells trigger housings with a similar mod) of reducing overtravel. Nothing unsafe about it: all safeties function exactly as intended. Never a problem for me in almost 40,000 rounds on two Vanek triggers in two different Glocks. As always, YMMV. Curtis Edited March 24, 2010 by BayouSlide Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyclone336 Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 No. Pretravel slack can be eliminated by internal measures, just not external. I agree, but if the trigger really has all the slack taken out of it, then it will rest farther back when it is cocked than a stock trigger would. I don't always like splitting hairs like this, but my question is if the altered trigger position is a violation of the no visible modifications rule or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micah Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 cyclone, my Production trigger has some slack taken out, and still remains legal. What cannot be performed (in Production) are external mods like the mentioned trigger shoe relocation or deactivation of the trigger safety. Any chrono guy worth their salt at a match will check for these two things. And I'm still waiting on the pix from this new trigger. New products are exciting, and being a Glocker I am very curious to see what this new product has to offer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 No. Pretravel slack can be eliminated by internal measures, just not external. I agree, but if the trigger really has all the slack taken out of it, then it will rest farther back when it is cocked than a stock trigger would. I don't always like splitting hairs like this, but my question is if the altered trigger position is a violation of the no visible modifications rule or not. I know what you are asking. No, I don't think anybody has ever considered it an external modification. What would be a mod is if the trigger safety had to be altered so that it would properly function with the forward travel of the trigger limited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murkish Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 In reviewing the glocktriggers.com home page, it clearly states: Use the "CHALLENGER" for IDPA / SSP or USPSA / Production Division. This implies to me that the "EDGE" trigger which has the pre-travel removed is believed by them to be illegal in USPSA Production Division. This makes sense to me as the same is true for the Vanek Super trigger kit that has the pre-travel removed. I use the Vanek Classic in my production gun and the Vanek Super in my Limited gun. There is no doubt in my mind that all of the safeties are functional in both versions. I am going to order the "CHALLENGER" and give it a go in my back-up production gun. I will report back when I have a chance to try them out. Cheers, Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyclone336 Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 Thanks for the ruling everybody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 In reviewing the glocktriggers.com home page, it clearly states: Use the "CHALLENGER" for IDPA / SSP or USPSA / Production Division. This implies to me that the "EDGE" trigger which has the pre-travel removed is believed by them to be illegal in USPSA Production Division. This makes sense to me as the same is true for the Vanek Super trigger kit that has the pre-travel removed. I use the Vanek Classic in my production gun and the Vanek Super in my Limited gun. There is no doubt in my mind that all of the safeties are functional in both versions. I am going to order the "CHALLENGER" and give it a go in my back-up production gun. I will report back when I have a chance to try them out. Cheers, Jack Thank You As a guy who has 2 of Charlie`s " Classic Triggers " in G19`s, I would be very interested in an objective report. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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