Strong Mount: Yes or No?

[Eric Scher]

Background: I will be buying a nice 650 with all the bells and whistles for my birthday (Buying in March or, more likely, April), and I am trying to hammer out all the final details.

Up until a few days ago I wouldn't even have asked this question as the answer was an unqualified yes. But then, while I was describing my plans to a buddy, I realized something.

I have attached a picture of my bar; that if this forum software works the way I THINK it does, you can download and look at. If not....

My bar is made of wood. The "customer drinking area is a wood plank that is 10.5" wide, 91" long and 1.5" thick.

The dividing area between the "customer drinking surface" and the 8" drop-off to the tiled "bartender's" area is another wood plank that whose surface is 1.5" higher than the "customer" area's surface.

.

Going back to the "customer's" area, it appears to my eye, as I'm sure it would to anyone's, that this area is a 2x12 plank that is just over seven and one half feet long. If you looked underneat, you'd see that there is a setback of 1.5" to another plank, this one a 2x4 (3.5" wide of course) that is mounted with it's wide surface facing the customer.

Now, I will NOT be drilling lag bolts into the bar surface. I'll buy and mount (with "C" clamps) another 2x12 wood plank, which would bring the "customer" surface up to and even with the "dividing" surface.

NOW...

Here's the problem:

If I want to mount a strong mount, I would need two more wood planks so that the "dividing" surface is also protected. Then, unless I want a seam that will catch every single tiny bit of everything that happens to fall on it, I would need to at LEAST cover this entire area with 1/8 or 1/4 inch underlayment (For those never in the building trades, it's a very thin piece of plywood.)

My concern here is that only the front legs of the Strong Mount would be mountable into the first protective plank. The rear legs would be right on top of the bars finished surface, and since it would need at a minimum the 1.5" thickness of a 2x10 inch covering plank to "bite" into, I have now raised everything another inch and a half before even raising it all another 6" for the "650 Only" mount or 8" for the what...? SDB I think it's called?

BTW, the "Drinking Surface" is 44" above the floor BEFORE I add protective wood planks to the bar.

So OK, I can forget the strong mount altogether and mount the machine directly to the working area surface. Even if I need to drill a few extra small holes in the base of the machine to add more wood screws and give it a very solid mounting, that's basically the easy part. I have no doubt that i could mount the machine SOLIDLY without using a strong mount.

But now there is the issue of the handle. Not the end that I grab, I mean the OTHER end. How much clearance does that need, and in what direction?

In fact, let me highlight that....

How much clearance does the machine end of the handle need as the handle moves through it's cycle, and in what directions (Up, Down, Forwards, Backwards, etc) is that clearance needed?

[mildot1]

I cant look at mine since I'm out of town but it is mounted to a bench almost identical to yours. I am not using a strong mount.

I am 6'1" and I run it setting on a bar stool or standing.

[CocoBolo]

At the height of your bar unless its designed for very short people a strong mount will put your arms at a height that will quickly cause fatigue. I find that my loader set at kitchen counter height witout a strong mount is perfect. I use a bar stool height kitchen utility chair with built in step ladder that helps getting into the case feeder. I'm 6'.

I also don't use the roller handle because I sit on the left side of the loader where I can see and its easier to stuff bullets. The ball works better the roller puts too much angle in the wrist to grasp it fully.

[Hairtrigger]

When I wanted to raise my press up from the top of my bench due to a taller bar stool I went to my local welding shop and found a 10 or 12" long piece of 8" I beam. I drilled 3 holes on the top to mount my press on it and 3 or 4 holes in the bottom for mounting the I beam to my reloading bench. This cost me less than the shipping would have been on a strong mount.

[BMartens]

Do you have enough overhead clearance? The chart lists 38.5" with a casefeeder and NO strong mount and 45" with strong mount. With your bar at 44" now you'll be getting pretty tall. CocoBolo is right about it getting pretty uncomfortable to pull the handle when you get to high.

[SteveU]

I am 5'10, my bench is 35" high and the strong mount is perfect.

At your bench height, you probably don't need it.

[ChuckS]

I have the bench top at 42" above the floor. Being 6'4" I like to set things up to a "normal" height This height allows me to easily see into the case after the powder drop for a visual check. Vertical clearance was also an issue so I shortened the case feeder mast.

Later,

Chuck

[twodownzero]

I vote no strong mount. I prefer to sit and load, and a normal desk with the press bolted to it works perfectly.

[GrumpyOne]

At the height of your bar unless its designed for very short people a strong mount will put your arms at a height that will quickly cause fatigue. I find that my loader set at kitchen counter height witout a strong mount is perfect. I use a bar stool height kitchen utility chair with built in step ladder that helps getting into the case feeder. I'm 6'.

I also don't use the roller handle because I sit on the left side of the loader where I can see and its easier to stuff bullets. The ball works better the roller puts too much angle in the wrist to grasp it fully.

I do the same thing!

[GrumpyOne]

When I built my bench, I made it from pressure treated 2x6's (top, legs and sides). When I first started loading, I noticed my bullets kept getting shorter and shorter. Finally figured it out. The nut at the bottom of the handle was hitting the 2x6 side on the down stroke, and I had adjusted the dies at the point. With every downstroke, the nut/rod would dig into the pine 2x6 a bit more, causing the stroke to be just a tiniest bit longer each time, thus making the bullets shorter. So, instead of building a new bench (as this one is the perfect height for me to sit in the chair, see the powder, etc), I took a 1 1/2" spade bit and drilled a hole where the nut/rod of the handle hit the side of the bench. So, if your bar has sides straight down from the edge, I suggest mounting some sort of board over the edge at least 2" before mounting the press to that, that way you can avoid the weirdness I ran into.

[Eric Scher]

OK then, my instincts were actually correct for once.

I'm going to be at my area Dillon dealer's store tomorrow (They have indoor ranges and an "all day" price of about 20 bucks.), and I'll be able to take some direct measurements.

I think though that probably the easiest thing would be to buy a 2x16, assuming I can find one. If not, I can rip a good quality piece of 1/2 or 3/4 plywood into 3rds. That'll give me plenty of undercarriage clearance.

Overhead is probably fine. measuring off my best guess of the vertical centerline of the machine, I have 6.5 inches of horizontal clearance and 31.5" of vertical clearance. And that's measuring off the existing bar edge. If I artificially move the machines further out, I lose a bit of vertical, but gain horizontal, which means that I am expecting to miss the overhead bar protion entirely. If it becomes an issue, I can simply move everything to the other side of the bar. Measuring from the "innermost" point on the bar surface I have over five and a half feet of vertical clearance, and it's a vaulted ceiling, so it only gets better as I move away from the wall. And frankly, if I mount my machines there, I'd have room for FOUR reloaders, instead of just 3.

[Flexmoney]

Eric,

You lost me at "bar".

However, there are lots of posts on the strong mount, bench height, and just about any other thing you can think of. You can find some great info with that search page.

[MemphisMechanic]

My bench is 41" tall.

I am 6'0"

I load on a 650 with a strong mount. If my bench were 2" shorter, it would be perfect. But it's not bad enough to modify. Just need to lean to see into the case if using a small charge (like titegroup under a 147).

At 44", I would be skipping the strong mount for certain.

[GrumpyOne]

OK then, my instincts were actually correct for once.

I'm going to be at my area Dillon dealer's store tomorrow (They have indoor ranges and an "all day" price of about 20 bucks.), and I'll be able to take some direct measurements.

I think though that probably the easiest thing would be to buy a 2x16, assuming I can find one. If not, I can rip a good quality piece of 1/2 or 3/4 plywood into 3rds. That'll give me plenty of undercarriage clearance.

Overhead is probably fine. measuring off my best guess of the vertical centerline of the machine, I have 6.5 inches of horizontal clearance and 31.5" of vertical clearance. And that's measuring off the existing bar edge. If I artificially move the machines further out, I lose a bit of vertical, but gain horizontal, which means that I am expecting to miss the overhead bar protion entirely. If it becomes an issue, I can simply move everything to the other side of the bar. Measuring from the "innermost" point on the bar surface I have over five and a half feet of vertical clearance, and it's a vaulted ceiling, so it only gets better as I move away from the wall. And frankly, if I mount my machines there, I'd have room for FOUR reloaders, instead of just 3.

Again, why do you need 4 presses? Seems like a lot of wasted money that could have been spent on guns or ammo. One maybe two presses is all you really need (unless you are just trying to impress a girl or something, then half a dozen would be better! ) Seriously, a 550 will do all handgun and the majority of rifle, while the 650 is essentially the same with auto indexing and an extra crimp/seat station. By the time you spend all that money on 4 presses, you could have bought 5,000 bullets, 20,000 primers and 16lbs of powder.

Edited February 24, 2010 by GrumpyOne

[Eric Scher]

...why do you need 4 presses?

I don't. I just like knowing that I have the room.

I DO see a use for 3 presses though.

1st Press: The 650 I'm buying soon, so that I can install any caliber conversion that I happen to choose at that time and crank out a large volume of them. I actually considered a 1050 for this, but after talking to Brian, he seemed to feel that a 650 was the better fit for the way I described my needs.

2nd Press: An SL900. (Self Explanatory)

3rd Press: Eventually, I'm going to want to do some experimenting with different rifle loads in small batches. I'm also not going to want to mess with the 650 for that, I'll want something friendlier to small batches. A stripped down 550 would work well for that.

4th press? Well, maybe not a press, but the case cleaner will need some counter space, right?