Alan550

Ian, Glad to see you're gonna make it back this year. The BBQ might be a good time for the get-together you mentioned. Kevin & I will be there, and I think you've yet to meet our new sidekick, Leroy, who's on here as well. He should be there too, unless something major comes up. See ya there!! Alan~^~

After shooting at 7 Cups so far, I have a question that probably should be addressed to the range officials or whomever makes up the specific rules that govern the Cup. They require us to show up at each stage with 100 rds, supposedly in case of a reshoot. That's good as far as it goes. But then they take 6 of those away from us for the chrono, leaving 94. After shooting 48, if a re-shoot is needed, you're only left with 46! Does somebody need to learn to count, or is it just me?!!? Alan~^~

Add to all the lists so far some rain gear. I use a plastic poncho that folds to a small package to take up less space. I also agree on the "ammo X 2 + 10%" for the match. Nothing would be worse than a re-shoot and run out of ammo. At the Bianchi Cup, they require you to show up at each stage with at least 100 rds and only 48 are required to shoot a stage. Alan~^~

Kay Miculek had an unfortunate incident when she took someone else's word on "What kind of snake is that?" They told her it was harmless, so she picked it up.........it was a rattlesnake! Alan~^~

RePete, Posts # 8 & 10 respectively mentioned Action Pistol as a clarification to the original question. That's the Cup. Alan~^~

RePete, Read the thread! This isn't about PPC shooting, but the Barricade event at Bianchi Cup. There is NO post, only a true barricade that is 2 feet wide and 6 feet tall made of steel and plywood. I admire that you're a PPC Instructor and the knowledge that you have in that discipline, but your "post" technique doesn't apply here, since there is no post. Alan~^~

Big Dave should have clarified that he's asking the question in regards to the new Action Pistol rules change allowing Metallic Sight shooters to use the barricade, not for IDPA or a true PPC match. So "cover & support" aren't an issue here. Alan~^~

JAX, The Stick-Shift is made by Warren Moore (913) 422-8966 in Lenexa, KS. He also makes a killer prone pad for 1911s, if you shoot one of those. Alan~^~

Dave's right about the Stick-Shift.......move the lever to the side that the target is coming from. The mover is always a back-up for shooters, since more than one can shoot on most ranges for the other 3 events at the same time. We don't squad shooters at our club and we have between 20 and 25 shooters at a match. They just shoot in any order they prefer, but as Martin said, most don't want to start on the mover or plates since "there's no 8s on plates"! Keep up the good work promoting the sport out there! We need all the participation we can get. Alan~^~

The major changes left from the "old rules" are: 1. All safeties must function, i.e. grip safeties can't be pinned. 2. Minimum 2# trigger pull. The Open Modified class was added to supposedly attract IPSC/USPSA shooters, then they added the safety & trigger pull rules that pretty much eliminated those shooters. Mike Voigt said it himself, that the trigger pull rule was the wrong thing to do if they wanted more IPSC/USPSA shooters to come to the sport, and most of those shooters have pinned grip safeties too. FWIW. Alan~^~

One of the guys in our club ordered one last week and was told 6-8 weeks. Alan~^~

The Marvel is definitely the most accurate of the bunch, and Colt Ace mags from Brownells work great at a much smaller cost than the ones from Marvel. FWIW. Alan~^~

Finally!! cking got around to answering the original question instead of condemning the questioner's proposal! I started out in Action Pistol (granted, light loads and light recoil) with a 1.75# trigger, and over the last few years have worked my way down to a nice 15+ oz. trigger that I wouldn't trade for any of those "crisp 2.5#" triggers you talk about. BTDT and hate anything over about 1.25# for accuracy work like AP. just my $.02 Alan~^~

How about both? I shoot a GLOCK 27 that's been converted to .357 SIG and has a +1 grip extension and night-sights in the matches and carry it too. IDPA considers it a BUG, but I've won a few locals with it in the CDP class. My "truck gun" is a Rossi 6 shot, 3" .357 that I sometimes shoot in matches, so I'm not sure how to answer the poll. Alan~^~

Flex, The GLOCK mod you mentioned might not pass muster, since the barrel swap would be obvious from the outside. Changing the barrel isn't listed in the allowed mods, so it's prohibited. The Springer would work as you described it, i.e. tuned to the max (min. 2# trigger) and still be a Production gun. Alan~^~

Flex, The Springfield could be shot in either Metallic Sight or Production. The Caspian would have to be Metallic Sight since they don't make "guns". Production usually has the smallest number of shooters, since it's basically a sub-class of Metallic Sight. Any "factory" gun without ports or a comp can be shot in either class. I know it's confusing, but hope this answers some of what you wanted. Alan~^~

Flex, Below is the exact wording in the most recently published rule book. I only copied Metallic & Production, since the Open Modified class came out after the book. That's covered on the web site you saw. 3.2 Metallic Sight Firearm - Minimum caliber is 9x19mm (9mm); a semi-automatic firearm with no more than a 6 1/4 inch barrel length. The front sight not to extend past the front of the slide and the rear sight not past the rear of the slide by a 1/4 inch. A revolver’s barrel will not exceed 8 5/8 inches in length; the front sight not to extend past the front of the barrel and the rear sight will not extend past the rear of the frame. All standard safety features of guns must operate properly. The following items are prohibited: (a) Wings. ( Peep, ghost, optical or electronic sights. © Orthopedic grips - no part of the grip may encircle the hand. (d) Thumb rests. (e) Compensators or ported barrels. 3.2.1 Production Firearm - A semi-automatic handgun or revolver which is or has been a catalogue item readily available to the general public equipped with metallic sights. Custom-shop pistols are not allowed. All standard safety features of guns must operate properly. The firearm shall have no visible external modifications except as follows: (a) Replacement or modification of grips to fit competitors hand or facilitate loading. No part of the grip may encircle the hand. Thumb rests are prohibited. ( Wide "target" style hammers and triggers. © Checkering and stippling are allowed. (d) Replacement of factory metallic sights with those of another manufacturer. (e) External finishes, either protective or decorative, or other non-functional embellishments such as engraving, inlays, or inscriptions. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The above is an exact quote from the 2004 printed rules. Changes have been made since then, as noted on the NRA web site, such as the 2# minimum trigger pull. That's pretty much it so far as equipment rules go. The other changes involved firing positions that were different for each class of firearm, which have pretty much been made the same for all now, with the exception of how the barricade may be used in the different classes of guns. The rules are much too complicated (and convoluted!) to sit here and type them all out. Too bad the NRA doesn't see fit to post them on the web, but they want the money they get by only making them available in printed form with S/H added, of course. If you could be more specific in your questions, Flex, I can answer them, but a general overall question like you asked is really tough to answer in a short post on here. And THANKS for your interest in AP!!! Alan~^~

I'm with Grant on this one. Doesn't the Ghost require drilling a hole in the trigger guard? Just my $.02, but the 012 is what most Cup shooters use, and I agree with the muzzle support part of that. Alan~^~

For the last couple of matches at our club, I cut the center out of a target and used it as a template to spray-paint the center dots on all the targets. Feedback from the shooters was very positive. General consensus seemed to be that the longer distance shooting was enhanced by having something to aim at. Negative feedback included that hits are harder to see if there's no back-lighting. Most shooters had been accustomed to being able to see holes in the target to aim at from the longer distances, and with the black centers, the previous shots in the X-ring just seem to disappear. As you said, it does make things more even for differing lighting conditions, and I see that as a positive thing. AP was the only NRA discipline with no aiming point on the target, which, since it's an accuracy game, didn't make sense anyway......IMHO Alan~^~

If they run the top 16 in the shoot-off, Kevin made it!! He was in tied for 14th according to the final stats. Alan~^~

Eric, The $5K has very little attached to it! Ask NRA for a Grant Request form. The only strings attached to the few thousand we got was that we presented a proposal for how the money would be spent (Plate racks, mover equipment, barricades, etc.) and provide photos of the finished project within a year. Simple, and we used all their money and more. The plan is to go back for more next year for our Skeet field, along with some more equipment on the AP ranges. I know this sounds too good to be true, but it IS! The $5k figure is an annual cap, with that amount available every year if you prove you used it in the manner you proposed, and they approved of it. Alan~^~

Eric, You're right in your observations about how the NRA sets up the rule book, and the 'tude from them also. I have been running the largest monthly AP matches east of the Mississippi (20-30 shooters) for a couple of years now, and gave up the "NRA Approved" label this year because of the politics and expense involved. The rule book is so screwed because the NRA wanted it to conform to all the other disciplines' rule books, right down to the section numbers for each rule. That's why so many of the rules seem redundant, or just plain crazy! Also, they don't put the rules online so they can sell more books! They've been changing the rules on an annual basis for the last few years (part of the reason I gave up the approved label on our shoots) and made it difficult if not impossible for a shooter to have a new gun built for the Cup. With the lead time on building a gun, and new rules being issued in January of each year, it becomes almost impossible to have one finished in time to have any practice time before the Cup, so they can't expect to attract new shooters. Why bother having a new gun built if they're gonna make it illegal the next shooting season? They added the Open Modified class to attract IPSC/USPSA shooters, and immediately slammed the door on them by requiring that grip safeties be functional. It's been a while now, but I think I remember pinned grip safeties being the norm instead of the exception at IPSC/USPSA matches that I shot..........go figure! You mentioned the plates as being fun for your shooters, you may want to try something we do here for some of our weekly shoots.......rimfire rifle plates! We shoot from 20, 30, 40 and 50 yards from low-ready with times of 8, 10, 12 and 15 seconds. The plates are set light enough for a .22 to take 'em down out of a rifle. Fun stuff! FWIW, Alan~^~

Eric, I'm with Grant on this one. If I tried to run an IPSC or IDPA match with only the rule book as a guide, never having seen a match being run, I'd be as confused as you seem to be about AP. So it's not just the NRA on that count. You'll find that the things Grant puts on here come out a little rough sometimes, but he's really a nice guy, just hasn't adapted to US thinking and phraseology, being that he's from NZ! We AP shooters will be more than glad to explain the arcane stuff that the rule book only seems to muddy worse than is necessary. It's really pretty simple, once you've either seen or organized a match of this type. Hope you can get some interest stirred up in the NW, maybe from all those USPSA shooters that your area seems to be teeming with! Alan~^~

Gum? Nope, but I do work on a toothpick, and it has the same effect mentioned earlier of relaxing me, and I seem to shoot better. I never connected the two until I ran across this thread, but it's true! Alan~^~

Speedwell has them too. Alan~^~