Wheeljack

Ghost: Oh boy! I guess my slow powder is headed for the grave yard, when I run out of it. Next to find a faster powder and one that pours well. I liked HP-38 but I also like trying different powders. One thing leads to another. I thought plated were a compromise between lead and jacketed. What do you like in bullets?? I liked lead but felt I was not seating them well. I use an M die now and think it would work well with lead.

It seems that a slower powder yields a faster bullet at maximum pressure. My slow powder charge fills less than half the shell and a double charge is just below the rim, but it's not a maximum charge. The slower powders should work best with the longer barreled guns. I think the same is true for heavier bullets.

I guess I was asking, given that I load 147gr bullets, plated, in my 9mm, what is the difference, advantage, warnings, between a fast power and a slow one. Like, what is the advantage of using Alliant Red Dot vs Alliant Blue Dot? With either one, say I was loading for a minimal Powder Factor, 125.

Well I'm one of those guys that can't seem to feel the difference between powders or just can't make up my mind. I load 147gr plated bullets in my 9mm. It seems I have a choice of over 50 powders. I would like to know your feelings about the difference between fast and slow powders. What can I expect from, say Alliant Red Dot vs Alliant Blue Dot. I'm not asking about brands so much as burn rates. Are there things to look out for in fast and slow powders. Slower powder with heavier bullets?? I'm not looking into the bulk of the powder or pouring issues right now. I have been loading to a range of high 880's or low 900's fps.. Can I load faster and safer, using a slow powder?

I'm with him. I have sizing dies in .356/357/358. I use an M die to expand the case mouth.

I like to experiment. But also, when I do something wrong, I learn a lot from you guys. Well, I have some 572 to burn up and then I think I'll be looking into something like Unique or Power Pistol. Thanks.

And I was told the Win 231 I was using was to fast burning. Do you ever get the feeling you can never win? But, thanks.

With my 147gr Xtreme plated bullets, in my Glock 26 with a 3.42" barrel, an OAL of 1.150.... Win 572 at 3.8gr gave me an average fps of 843; 4.0gr 858 and 4.2gr 872fps. The maximum fps with 4.2gr was 894.

At this point, I was just interest in why the Hodgdon maximum load seemed a little light. So I guess you could say I'm looking for the safe maximum load for 572 powder, and not the +P load. Then I will back off and start looking for the most accurate load.

I just got some Win 572 powder and I'm looking for load information. I looked into the SAAMI manual and Hodgdon data. Hodgdon gives info for the XTP bullet with a 4" barrel. What confuses me (it's not hard to do) is why the max load shows velocity under SAAMI max and pressure under SAAMI max. I will use a chrono and stay under SAAMI maximum fps. I'll run a few different loads and look for the one with the tightest group. It's not that I want to use the maximum loads, it's that I am trying to understand them. I'm sure the powder manufacturers could give us more information, if it wasn't for their lawyers.

SAAMI lists the 9mm round with a 147gr bullet. The old standards (1993) listed a Jacketed 9mm but the new 2015 standards do not mention bullets type. Lead, plated, jacketed or what ever. What they do list is a velocity and pressure. Actually 3 pressures, but I'll stick to the MAP or maximum average pressure. For a 147gr bullet they list a velocity of 985fps and a pressure of 35,000psi. Now it seems from that, I could work up a load for my 147gr bullet, whatever kind, to a maximum of 985fps and 35,000psi. Hodgdon data list a 147gr XTP, loaded with 4.1gr of 572, with a velocity of 954 and a pressure of 32,200psi and calls this a maximum load. Wouldn't you think that you could up the powder charge a little to get to the 985fps level for a maximum load? There are obviously other factors to consider, but what are they and is there any place to find that information.

What size is your barrel? Have you slugged the barrel? Bullet size plus thickness of shell at mouth, times 2 should give you a crimp size. Push the bullet to make sure have enough crimp. Have you checked COL. Does the bullet fit the mag without binding? With a bullet in the chamber, can you spin it? Does it drop out of the chamber if you point the barrel up? I have never understood a case gauge. I make my bullets fit my barrels not a generic gauge.

Can only tell you of my experience. I called CCI and they said I should seat deeper. I gave the press a more firm push to get deeper seating and it worked.

Update: Although I think the polish job helped, I have settled on the polishing of the firing pin where it meets the trigger bar, as the most effective choice to get a smoother trigger pull.

That sounds good, buy why not polish the spring too? Possibly do the inside of the spring with a Q-tip and the spacer sleeve too.

Well I did the 25 cent job, twice. Better but still that rubbing at the end of trigger pull. Looking around I found a site that sells the trigger parts and they mentioned that they polish the springs! I had always suspected that the rubbing feeling was possibly due to the firing pin rubbing on the spacer sleeve. I pulled the firing pin assembly out of the slide and took it apart. Very fine sand paper... sanded the firing pin, sanded inside the spacer sleeve and then sanded the spring, inside and out. Rolled the sand paper around a tooth pic to do inside of the spring. I was not trying to remove or thin the spring, just polish. Next lubed. I had some Teflon spray so I used that as it drys to a powder like coating. I haven't been to the range to do a true test, but, I think it does feel better. Has anyone done this to their firing pin assembly?

Does your new spring require a "Gen 4 Conversion Recoil Insert"?

I load .357 plated bullets. I use the FCD. I use it to remove the flare to .3765. It depends on the shell thickness. The FCD can remove the bulge in the shell, if you have one. My settings can or cannot swag the bullet. To experiment... turn the crimp adjuster all the way in on the die, then adjust the die to crimp the mouth of the shell to your setting. The FCD, except for the crimp, will not even touch the shell. I like to get rid of any bulge I have in the shells, so sometimes I swag the bullet .0005 more than if I didn't use it. I love how we talk in ten thousands or even thousands when it depends at what place on the shell we measure since the shell is not perfectly round. So, all measurements are an average. The FCD is adjustable.

Thanks. First, patience. Grip extension due in today. Then maybe a 14-15 pound spring to test. I am looking at my 147gr loads to be slower, softer and Glock is apparently sprung for more powerful loads. I bought some 115gr commercial rounds and they worked fine. I'll do some more shooting before I try something else

I reload. Went out to try my new Glock with a few different loads. I load 147gr plated bullets @ .357 dia. HP-38 powder. Hard to find data but I was using higher loads. Only the higher loads had no FTE, although the highest load did not eject the last round. I looking to use lighter loads but this looks like I will have to use my maximum loads. My chronograph was showing higher speeds than I got with my other guns too. From what I could find, I may need a softer recoil spring. The Glockshop has a 14 and 16 pound spring assembly and LoneWolf has lighter firing pin springs. I'm not sure what I need or which parts. Is it the firing pin spring that I need with a lighter recoil spring? 14 or 16 pounds? The shells do pass my ears and only go about 4 to 5 feet our. I'm new to all this.

It's close but still hard to pin down with all the different bullets and COAL's. But in the ballpark. Hodgdon has data for the 572 on line. If Winchester Ball (spherical) powder is round, then why does the 231 (HP-38) look flat like flake powder? Corporations lie.

I am always amazed by how the powder industry works so hard to confuse the buyer. Ball powder is a trademark of Winchester. Win 231 is ball powder. Hodgdon HP-38 is spherical. They are the same powder. Nowhere on the Hodgdon container does the word spherical appear. If you search you can find that Hodgdon does call it spherical. Why does my HP-38 look like flake powder? The new Winchester 572 is out. It's a ball powder. Hard to find any information on Sport Pistol powder, but what little I have seen, it reminds me of Win 572. I won't even go into how books like Lee's Modern Reloading tables show how hard manufactures work to prevent us from being able to compare powders to each other. I don't know if I should get mad or enjoy the challenge. Don't you wish we could buy 1 oz test size packages of powders? Enjoy.

I found the WIN primers much thinner than the CCI.

57K, I think we have covered the subject pretty well. I learned a lot and my next batch of cartridges will be my best. They may not be match quality, but I know how to do so if I want. Thanks for all the insight into what can be a confusing discipline and a rewarding hobby.

I found that out. What is needed is a set of figures for median sizes. Your figures are great, accurate but only for a particular shell. Now, it's only an idea, but, because of all the variations in sizes we have, maybe this would help. The first thing we would need is shells as similar as we can. Using the same brand is the start. Measure shell thickness not of one shell, but a number of shells and use the average thickness. Measure the length of 10 or 20 shells. Throw out the shortest and longest shells and then figure the average length of the rest. Find the shell that has both the average length and mouth thickness. Work up your dimensions with this average shell. Seating the bullet is no problem but the taper crimp might be. Adjust your die to the correct crimp for this average shell. Use this die setting for all the cartridges. The crimp will differ from possibly too much crimp for the longer shell and too little for the shorter shell. I don't think I can measure the difference as well as you can, so if you feel there is some merit in this plan, maybe you could let me/us get an idea of the variation. I'm hoping the taper crimp range is +/- .0005 from perfect.