HOGRIDER
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Posts posted by HOGRIDER
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On 8/9/2022 at 11:40 AM, nitrohuck said:
It's been the better part of a decade since I've loaded 9mm, however I'm about to make the switch from Limited to CO, and the time is upon me...
I've read a lottt of discouraging posts about the accuracy of the P320 Max unless you begin to push bullets fast enough (most of the frustration seemed to be with 147gr bullets). But with that extra speed, it looks like guys are pushing 140pf. I'm hoping to keep things in the 132pf range.
This has lead me to look at 124gr Black Bullets (used their 180gr religiously in my .40 Lim gun with no issues, but that's apples to oranges). I am simply looking for "good enough" accuracy, 3" at 25m is better than I'll ever shoot while at a match.
I'll be pushing the bullets with Promo powder and Ginex primers... bc that's what I've got...
Anyone have horrid accuracy issues running the 124gr Black Bullets @ .356"? Or do you have other (economical) recomendations?
IMO, I don't think the MAX is capable of 3" at 25m! Many threads on the accuracy of the X5 Legion/MAX and the stock barrels simply want faster velocities to achieve reasonable accuracy; especially with the 124/125g bullets. And this is usually referenced to using a JHP bullet. An example of my best results with the stock barrel:
And where I'm at right now with a match grade KKM barrel:
HTHs!
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47 minutes ago, Boomstick303 said:
Is this for the KKM barrel?
I intend to actually back down my PF with the Barstow barrels I have just installed in my Legion and AXG. In initial off hand testing the accuracy seems to be the same with slow 147 gr bullets at a PF of about 130 and faster 125 gr bullets at a PF of about 135-138.
Something I found super interesting is I did not get a big POI vs POA impact between the 147 gr and 125 gr bullets at 10 yds I use to see with the Sig barrels. POI seems to be the same for both loads.
I intend to slow down 125 gr a little bit and test accuracy. You might want to test at some lower PF and see what happens.
I intend to get into some pretty detailed testing with the new barrels in regards to accuracy with my current loaded ammo. I will report back in what I find with off the bench testing.
Yes, this is definitely with the KKM.
My initial testing was 4.4, 4.6, 4.8, and 5.0g. Per KKM's recommendations I was looking for that sweet spot of 1050-1100fps. 4.6g and 4.8g showed some definite promise and I did have earlier chrono numbers but only for the 4.8 and 5.0 loads. The 4.8g was averaging 141PF/1138fps.
During this latest RR tests session, I tested 4.6, 4.7, & 4.8. My results above were at 4.7g! So again I'm guessing the chrono will result in ~137-138PF.
In all honesty, the groups I've seen at anywhere from 4.5 to 4.8g would be satisfactory for many shooters. But I also want to see how the Zero 125s react to the KKM. When I have time.................
Definitely looking forward to your results with the Bar-Sto! Keep me in the loop!
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9 minutes ago, B585 said:
If that’s at 25 yards, I didn’t think that was possible out of this gun. Very impressive!!!
This friends RR shooting area has some limitations, so it's 20 or 50 yds. I am at 20 when testing there.
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27 minutes ago, HesedTech said:
Once you join the dark side of dot shooting, you too will realize "back up" irons are pointless.
Enjoy!
As a new convert to the "dot" I totally agree with @HesedTech!
And for my transition, not having BUIS makes it much easier to remain "target focused" vs allowing my eyes to focus on the dot or front sight........
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On 6/4/2022 at 9:51 PM, B585 said:
Nice. I am looking forward to range report!!!
On 6/5/2022 at 1:44 PM, fireman1776 said:My kkm was drop in and very very snug. There is zero play between barrel and slide.
let us know what load you find best.
On 6/6/2022 at 4:41 PM, Boomstick303 said:What velocities are we talking about?
While I'm still on the road to recovery, the wx cooled off a bit and I felt good enough to at least get out and do some serious testing!
IMO, persistence with precise ladder loads will eventually yield much better results; especially with a Match Grade KKM barrel. I still haven't got to test the two versions of Zero 125g JHPs on hand; but these 124 Precision Deltas are definitely not lacking in performance!
I have not been to the Range for chrono testing of this particular load yet; but based on previous testing of very similar powder weights, I feel confident they will be in the 137-138PF range.
Sorry it's taken so long to report back with some encouraging results............
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On 8/26/2022 at 4:47 PM, Haalck said:
I’m looking for loading recipes for N320 and coated 9mm Bullets of different weights(125, 135 & 147). What grains are you using and what velocities are you getting. Using 4 grains over a 125 gr Rn Blue bullet I’m averaging 1096 fps (137pf) out of a 5” 2011.
Original STI Stac P 2011, 4" bbl.........
N320= 3.2g
Blue Bullets 147FP sized.356”
OAL = 1.120”
Power Factor Average: 132
Power Factor Low: 131
Power Factor High: 133
Number of Shots: 10
Minimum: 893
Maximum: 909
Spread: 16
Average: 902
Standard Deviation: 5
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4 hours ago, oddjob said:
I have the the Sig Armorer trigger in my Legion. Its not a kit, but I had him install his trigger when he did the trigger job. Great work by the way!!
Had TSA do his competition trigger job on my MAX and extremely pleased with the results. He posted on FB that his triggers are now available in kit form. So call him if interested!
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17 minutes ago, slick001 said:
Thanks for the replies
I figured shadow 2 was the one, but I wasn't sure about the AO1-LD if it was a closer fit or not.
Also wasn't sure if the Orange version of the shadow 2 was really worth it or not... and the Orange version doesn't come in an Optics Ready version...
As the owner of an awesome S2 Orange, if I were going for an OR version of the Shadow 2, this would be my choice. A lot of bang for the buck:
https://czcustom.com/new-firearms/cz-pistols-custom/cz-shadow-2-accu-optic-rds.html
And, there is a version of the Orange OR:
https://czcustom.com/new-firearms/cz-pistols-custom/cz-shadow-2-orange-optic-rds.html
HTHs!
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On 8/9/2022 at 6:06 AM, tim_w said:
A gunsmith fit barrel allows you to fit that lug and the hood. This locks the barrel in a repeatable position on in battery lockup. If it has a loose hood and very worse the lug is not sitting flush on the block you will get variation in lockup and as you pull thru the trigger. Bullets go shotgun or shift with fliers
Supplied with the Bar-Sto GS Fit barrel:
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21 hours ago, midatlantic said:
well,,,,actually do keep the machine pretty clean! Tho, I did do a thorough cleaning again, etc etc and even called Dillon. Turned out the issue was bullet size, tho what I can't figure out is why it suddenly couldn't handle .358 Ibeji heads but works fine with .356 Ibeji as well as other plated bullets. Still can't get the .358. to work anymore....but its more likely something to do with the particular bullet.
IMO, if your experiencing issues when switching to the larger OD bullets, then you need to consider switching to a larger expanding powder funnel:
https://www.photoescapeinc.com/products/9htc-ptu.html
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AXG trigger
in Sig
Robert posted this on his FB page two days ago:
QuoteThis is finally happening folks.After what seems like a decade of hard work we are finally ready to debut our over the counter P320 Competition AND Carry kits this coming week!https://www.thesigarmorer.com/
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I'm another 110% satisfied user of Kenneth's fully processed brass!
I've always contacted him by email and he is very quick to respond!
Highly recommended!
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4 hours ago, mrvip27 said:
Now I am getting myself confused...
Open end towards muzzle? Closed sitting on guide rod face (breech)?
@mrvip27Yes, I think that is the consensus even though the Sig springs are normally installed with the "open" end towards the rear/breech face, ISMI recommends on their packaging to install with the "closed end towards the rear of the gun", which is as you noted above the "breech face end".
FWIW, I got the opportunity to shoot a plate rack with some friends today; and the Max never experienced a hiccup shooting 124 AA Elite, 124 Federal Syntech, or my 147g Match CZ reloads! This is with a new ISMI 12# Sig length spring installed with the closed end towards the breech face/rear of the guide rod.
HTHs
PS: Pic is from back of ISMI packaging............
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10 minutes ago, echotango said:
All stock barrels.
I install all my springs open end fwd. The open end of the spring sort of starts to go over the rear of the springer tungsten gr and don't want to take any chances of it jamming.
Good point! I do the same with mine as ISMI states the springs will "grow" during compression.
Thanks for your reply!
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3 hours ago, ddc said:
How many rounds do you have through the Max/KKM combo?
@ddcI've got right at 200 rounds so far..............sad, but to be honest my recovery from the procedure is taking a bit longer than I expected. Few days after, I went to the range to check some rounds across the chrono. With the extreme heat E. KY has been experiencing, I knew quickly I was pushing myself way too soon. Luckily I got everything torn down, loaded up, and back in the cool of my GMC. A bit unsettling to be at the range by yourself with no cell service.............
But I did get some good velocity numbers.........
Coupe of weeks ago, I loaded some more slightly reduced power loads to run across the Ransom Rest, and after getting several FTEs and weak lockup, I found out I had left my sample 1911 and Sig factory springs home. Looking at the target I was seeing cloverleafs, 2 touching an 1&1/2" away, then random flyers 2-3" away. IMHO, the 14# 1911 spring was weak in lockup and too strong for my reduced power reloads. Was not a successful test session........
Sorry for the long-winded reply, but I am much improved and hope to be back at the Ransom Rest next week for some final testing. I do feel the KKM is going to produce some excellent results once I find the right combo!
Hope you are doing well!
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One thing I'd like to add to the discussion...............
Many questions have been asked by newer P320 X5 platform shooters about the "direction" the recoil spring should be in; especially when using the longer Sig style springs. With the 1911/2011 springs we've always been used to putting the closed/painted end on the rear/breechface end of the guide rod.
After a very informative conversation with IMSI tech support, it seems that "IF" we have/use a constant diameter style guide rod:
https://shop.springerprecision.com/sig-p320-x5-tungsten-guide-rod-1911-springs-share/
Then the longer Sig style factory or ISMI/Springer style springs can actually be used with either end towards the rear. Sig does ship there P320X5 pistols, AFAIK, with the open end of the recoil spring towards the rear.
If the guide rod your using has the "step" just in front of the guide rod "head" such as this one:
https://shop.springerprecision.com/copy-of-sig-p320-tungsten-guide-rod-1911-springs/
Then ISMI definitely recommends and notes on their packaging the recoil spring should be installed with the closed end to the rear towards the breechface!
HTHs
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1 hour ago, mrvip27 said:
do you have the part number by chance?
https://www.shootersconnectionstore.com/Wolff-19112011-Variable-Recoil-Springs-P3490.aspx
Or:
https://shop.1911parts.com/Wolff-Recoil-Calibration-Pak-Reduced-Power-Pak-RP-Variable-13115.htm
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2 hours ago, echotango said:
I used to use a 12# 1911 spring and was cracking the glass on the optics(3 legions, 3 Max's). Gun ran fine. Switched to a wolff 13# variable and like it much better and the optic issue went away.
@echotangoThanks for your reply!!
Wondering if you have any of your pistols fitted with KKM or BarSto barrels; which usually provide tighter lockup?
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Wondering if any users/competitors have used the 1911 recoil springs; then switched back to the longer length Sig factory style springs?
Was doing some testing couple days ago (Ransom Rest) and was having numerous FTEs along with weak lock up/return to battery. My MAX does have the KKM match barrel.
Discussed it with TSA, and he recommends using the longer Sig length springs. Of course I have the 14# and 12# factory springs. Also ordered some ISMI 13# and 12# long length springs this morning.
I'm thinking my FTEs were due to a too heavy (1911 style) 14# spring; while I think the weak lock-up was due to the short OAL of the 1911 springs in general.
Appreciate any feedback!
Thanks!
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This information was given to me by one of our industry's true innovators!
QuoteAs you know, the case mouths must be slightly expanded to assure that the projectiles stay in position when the press is indexed.
There are a few factors that can aggravate the "tugging" when the funnel/expander is removed from a case.
From my point of view, I think the first thing I would suggest is to use a good case lube. Some folks don't like to use a case lube on handgun cases, but I recommend it. It makes the whole stroke smoother and you'll need less overall force to complete the stroke. I like Hornady One Shot in the original aerosol can. I usually spread out the cases so they lay down on an old cookie sheet and then spray one side. When the brass is mixing in the casefeeder, the lube will spread all over the cases. Some lube will migrate into the case mouths and aid in reducing tugging. I've attached a file that also shows how to make your own lube that will work quite well.
When the funnel/expander is new... you may reduce some of the tugging (during break-in) by occasionally wiping a little lanolin on the expander area of the funnel with your fingertip.
It's also possible that your funnel was poorly machined / or slightly oversize. The expander step should be something around .3575" or .3580" maximum for the 9-38 funnel.
I'm also sold on the Hornady One Shot for lubing my wet cleaned brass. And similar to using some lanolin, I take a Q-tip with One Shot sprayed on and swab the funnel expander prior to a reloading session.
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27 minutes ago, yekcoh said:
I own three Sig P320s. I shoot 20-30k a year. I shoot 132pf 147gr bullets. These springs always fail on me so it's a design flaw.
@yekcohThanks for the feedback! I did buy a spare as I like to keep extras just in case. But I don't have enough time/experience with the MAX to know of it's weak points.
Any aftermarket suppliers that you know of that's offering a better replacement?
X5 MAX Upgraded: The adventure continues!
in Sig
Posted
Yes...........they were referencing the Hornady 124g XTP, but I think it's also applicable for a 125JHP.............