Thinking about a Square Deal

[C.I.Shooter]

Well, as much as I want a 550/650 finances are dictating that I go a cheaper route. I am looking at a SDB with two caliber conversions for $225. Unfortunately, I still need to get the 9mm conversion so the total will be closer to $300. I understand the limitations with the SDB but I still have my Turret press for loading other calibers that I shoot less often. I just want to speed up my 9mm production (loading volume on the Turret is killing me). The SDB is an older model bought when they first came out (mid 80's?). Any issues with buying an older model? Any significant changes over the years? Do you think its a reasonable price? Thanks for the input.

[Jay6]

Well, as much as I want a 550/650 finances are dictating that I go a cheaper route. I am looking at a SDB with two caliber conversions for $225. Unfortunately, I still need to get the 9mm conversion so the total will be closer to $300. I understand the limitations with the SDB but I still have my Turret press for loading other calibers that I shoot less often. I just want to speed up my 9mm production (loading volume on the Turret is killing me). The SDB is an older model bought when they first came out (mid 80's?). Any issues with buying an older model? Any significant changes over the years? Do you think its a reasonable price? Thanks for the input.

I am not sure about the older models but I do not think they have changed that much. I do think the price might be a bit high though. I picked up a couple year old model for like $250 not long ago.

[adweisbe]

I have an SDB from some time in the mid to early 80s. Maybe it had umpteen thousand rounds through it when I bought it. The only thing I know of that has changed is the primer punch and this is where I had issues. The primer punch did not protrude high enough above the shell plate because it had worn into the primer slide. They changed the design of the primer punch so that it's position is set with a set screw in newer models, in the older models the punch bears directly on the aluminum primer slide and can wear into it.

Other than that I haven't noticed a difference between mine and what I see in the latest manual.

If you are interested in having multiple presses dedicated to different calibers then the limitations of the SDB are not that significant. They are cheap and easy to collect and are quite fast despite the lack of case feeder. Certainly light years ahead of a turret press.

Edited July 24, 2008 by adweisbe

[Johann the Horrible]

I cannot remark on the price(I live in South Africa and $1=R7.55) but the Square Deal that I bought second hand is working perfectly. It is missing several parts and other parts are broken, it works. Some of the other guys in the club have 550`s and 650`s and one even a 1050 and these are fine machines indeed but I will not swap, especially for the 550. If you are just going to load handgun the SDB is, in my opinion, by far the best deal.(no pun intended)

[G+16]

buy it, much faster than turret, dillon's warrenty should cover the older models, and if it's not right you can always have it rebuilt by dillon, you'll like it

[Jeff686]

Yea, I just sent my old 80's vintage SDB to Dillon for a repair. They did their ususal rework and it came back looking almost new.

One major difference between the new models and the older (I have both) is the powder measuring system. The old system was case activated, with a couple of springs wrapped around the powder measure bar for return force. The newer style uses a rod style affair in a similar fashion. I believe that the rod does two things, first prevents a 'double charge' since it acts as a safety interlock, second is it gives a more positive and consistent return of the powder bar to it's resting place.

I've used both systems, side by side, for a couple of years. Both work fine most of the time. The only trouble I had with the older spring system was with SP01 powder. It was fine enough to work it's way into the power bar mechanism and cause increased friction. After a while, the springs were not able to overcome the friciton, and the bar would stick. I've used several other powders without problems (Clays, Titegroup, 7625, longshot).

I would not hesitate to purchase either model.

I don't know anything about the primer problem listed above, but I do switch primer feed parts between my two presses without problem, so if you did have the problem, you could get a few new parts and fix it.

[MrClean]

Well, as much as I want a 550/650 finances are dictating that I go a cheaper route. I am looking at a SDB with two caliber conversions for $225. Unfortunately, I still need to get the 9mm conversion so the total will be closer to $300. I understand the limitations with the SDB but I still have my Turret press for loading other calibers that I shoot less often. I just want to speed up my 9mm production (loading volume on the Turret is killing me). The SDB is an older model bought when they first came out (mid 80's?). Any issues with buying an older model? Any significant changes over the years? Do you think its a reasonable price? Thanks for the input.

You can send the whole thing back to Dillon and they will go through it and make it like new, with the new primer catch system and all. My dad got one at a garage sale one time!! That thing was nasty! Rusty, etc. He sent it back and when it returned it honestly looked like they said "Screw It" and just sent him a new one. HA

I bought a SD second hand, got on the phone with Dillon and he took me through checking all parts and sent them to me! No charge.

[JimmyZip]

I bought a square deal second hand in '89. It sat in my garage for 18 years and I decided that I would finally get to using it. I sent it to Dillon to be rebuilt. They said that it would cost 30 bucks or so, but was returned to me in PERFECT LIKE NEW condition with extra small parts AT NO COST! It has run like a top this whole season so far. I have run about 5000 rounds through it and have only broken one decapping pin. (You need to watch out for berdan primed Izraeli ammo!) They sent me out a new one even though that was MY fault.(again FREE of charge)

I have been very happy with this little press and will probably buy a used 650 when one comes up for sale and the financial gods and planets are aligned. 'Til then, I will load happily with my sdb.

JZ

[D. Manley]

I stumbled onto an older SD some time back and knew it had a few missing parts but being unfamiliar with it, didn't know exactly what the missing parts were. Sent it back to Dillon and for the price of return shipping, they went through and pretty well rebuilt it to like-new complete with, the new powder assembly. After a little tweaking out, its been flawless.

[JD45]

There is one spring issue I'm aware of because mine just broke recently. It was the tiny spring that works the primer slide. Mine broke, I called Dillon and they sent 4 free of charge. They were 100% too long.

I called back and asked about getting the correct length. The rep says," you've got an old one don't you"....."that spring is no longer made....you will have to cut and bend the ones we sent to you."

It ain't easy, but I made it work.

[G-ManBart]

There is one spring issue I'm aware of because mine just broke recently. It was the tiny spring that works the primer slide. Mine broke, I called Dillon and they sent 4 free of charge. They were 100% too long.

I called back and asked about getting the correct length. The rep says," you've got an old one don't you"....."that spring is no longer made....you will have to cut and bend the ones we sent to you."

It ain't easy, but I made it work.

I had that happen and after having a couple of the cut and bent springs break in short order, I called them back. They sent me a new primer feed assembly that uses the new springs....problem solved.

[GENE S]

I got my SD at a flee market, for $ 100.00 back in 83

and have been using it ever since. Made some minor

repairs, but works great. Love to get a 650. Some day

maybe.......

[C.I.Shooter]

Thanks for all the great replies. I think the SDB may meet my needs of wanting to really crank out one caliber. However, I think I may wait and see if I can get a better deal. By the tie I buy the caliber conversion and pay to ship the press I will be around $340. I keep trying to convince myself to be patient and that a good used 550 deal will come around. Or, I think I should be able get a better deal on an SDB already set up for 9mm at a cheaper price. Thanks again for all the info.

[D. Manley]

There is one spring issue I'm aware of because mine just broke recently. It was the tiny spring that works the primer slide. Mine broke, I called Dillon and they sent 4 free of charge. They were 100% too long.

I called back and asked about getting the correct length. The rep says," you've got an old one don't you"....."that spring is no longer made....you will have to cut and bend the ones we sent to you."

It ain't easy, but I made it work.

I had that happen and after having a couple of the cut and bent springs break in short order, I called them back. They sent me a new primer feed assembly that uses the new springs....problem solved.

Exactly my experience. When mine was refurbished the original primer assembly was working fine so it was not replaced. The old (shorter version) spring broke in short order and when I found out the new spring was too long, called Dillon and they shipped the whole new assembly @ no charge. I'm continually amazed at how good their customer service really is.

[Jeff686]

Thanks for all the great replies. I think the SDB may meet my needs of wanting to really crank out one caliber. However, I think I may wait and see if I can get a better deal. By the tie I buy the caliber conversion and pay to ship the press I will be around $340. I keep trying to convince myself to be patient and that a good used 550 deal will come around. Or, I think I should be able get a better deal on an SDB already set up for 9mm at a cheaper price. Thanks again for all the info.

If you are not going to load rifle cartridges, or are not going to add the case feeder, I think the SDB is better.

Remember, the SDB uses only Dillon dies, but has auto indexing.

The 550b can use any standard dies, but does not have auto indexing.

I LOVE AUTO INDEXING.

[aedavis]

I bought a second hand SDB a couple years ago and haven't had any problems with it. It is an older model set up in 9mm. The only thing I get is an occasional flipped or sideways primer, but that seems to be inherent in progressive presses.

[mpeltier]

I also would rather have a SDB than a 550 for pistol calibers. I have both and the SDB gets 90% of the bench time reloading. To answer your question there have been a number of improvements. Yesterday as a matter of fact I recieved mine back from Dillon after bieng overhauled by them. At first I thought it was a new one as there were very few original parts left to it. On my older machine there were a number of things that started breaking (Dillon as always sent new parts at no charge). But the frame finally broke and they asked for it back. The frame and handle both are redesigned with reinfocement webs that are positioned exactly where mine broke. Problem solved. The primer spring issue was resolved as mentioned in an earlier post. And a new powder measure assembly has an improved lever attachment that I am certain has cured my occasional malfunction I had with the old one. Having said all that it is a great machine and has been "riden hard and put up wet" as they say and the amount of reloading I do would probably be considered above average. For an old model machine $250.00 may be high but Dillon will always stand behind it.

Edited July 30, 2008 by mpeltier

[C.I.Shooter]

I just helped a friend set up a 650 and all I can say is wow. My question is, without a casefeeder is auto indexing really all that? It just doesn't seam like a big deal to rotate the shell plate while I place a bullet and case. I have never tried a 550 however.

[Flexmoney]

The "big deal" happens if/when you get distracted and fail to rotate it. Double charge a case...and ka-boom.

[G-ManBart]

I just helped a friend set up a 650 and all I can say is wow. My question is, without a casefeeder is auto indexing really all that? It just doesn't seam like a big deal to rotate the shell plate while I place a bullet and case. I have never tried a 550 however.

Aside from the double charge possibility that Flex mentioned there is one other thing.

With auto-indexing (SDB) you can have a handful of bullets in one hand, a handful of cases in the other so you don't have to grab for both each time. Without it, you have to keep one hand empty to index the shellplate or you wind up dropping stuff, making a mess and slowing yourself down even more. Not a huge deal though. R,

[Jeff686]

I just helped a friend set up a 650 and all I can say is wow. My question is, without a casefeeder is auto indexing really all that? It just doesn't seam like a big deal to rotate the shell plate while I place a bullet and case. I have never tried a 550 however.

Aside from the double charge possibility that Flex mentioned there is one other thing.

With auto-indexing (SDB) you can have a handful of bullets in one hand, a handful of cases in the other so you don't have to grab for both each time. Without it, you have to keep one hand empty to index the shellplate or you wind up dropping stuff, making a mess and slowing yourself down even more. Not a huge deal though. R,

If you've got one hand full of bullets and one hand full of cases, how do you pull the lever?

I always thought that a foot petal would be a great mod, but the primer seats on the up-stroke.

[steveknapp]

The "big deal" happens if/when you get distracted and fail to rotate it. Double charge a case...and ka-boom.

You would also remove a live primer in stage 1, another KB possibility.

I know it seems like a safety issue, but I've not found it to be so bad. If I know I need to pause, I just quit putting cases in and run the machine dry, then walk away. If something can't wait, I always just check the first three stages when I come back. Is there a new primer in #1, Powder in #2, and a seated bullet in #3? It's a quick look to verify the state of everything, and the seated bullet is a huge give-away.

It is something you need to be aware of. But I don't know if I would trust an auto-index more. I'd still look the thing over before resuming reloading. I'm paranoid like that.

[High Lord Gomer]

When I need to stop in mid-stream with my 550, I walk away with the handle pulled down all the way. That way there is never any confusion about exactly where I left off.

[Sparky]

I loaded 29 years on a single stage press. Went to a SDB in 2000 for a few years and liked it fine.

Then I bought a package deal including a 550 and sold the sdb. I've been loading on the 550 now

for about 4-5 years and I like the hand indexing of the 550.

[UW Mitch]

Loaded on a SDB for about 4 years. When I got into limited, I "needed" the flexibility of a variety of dies (specifically the U-die). If not for that need, I was perfectly happy with my SDB. Am I glad I got a 650? YES! Am I selling my SDB? NO! It's a hell of a value for what you get. If it'll suit your purposes, get it and don't look back.

~Mitch