least expensive equipment

[bigbrowndog]

All this talk about 2000.00 to 3000.00 dollar rifles with 1000.00 to 1800.00 glass on, and people talking about how expensive the sport is got me to thinking about just exactly what does it take to get good solid performing, reliable equipment.

granted, entry fees and travel expenses are high but we all pay the same for those, pretty much......and you can share some of them if you travel together.

Personally I think a lot of the money spent on "gee Whiz" gear is not NEEDED, much of it is done because that person either WANTS the item or like some many other things in life today, they want to be the FIRST on the block with the latest and greatest. I have made purchases not because I needed the equipment, but simply because I WANTED it. I could easily have purchased a suitable rifle for 1000.00 less than what I paid for what I wanted, and as far as I'm concerned there is no better reason to buy something than because you WANT it. I would not suggest to another shooter that they should do the same, however, nor would I snub that shooter because they chose budget over "glitter". I am personally aware of a TOP LEVEL shooter that as a relative "newbie" has kicked a$$, with a reasonable priced optic on his rifle, and now has an astronomically priced optic on his rifle????????????????????????????? Does he NEED it to win,..........................I think not!!!!!!!!

A basic, AR flat top, can be purchased for as little as 800.00 to 1000.00, ( a coworker just bought one for 650.00)and made reliable and accurate "enough" for as little as elbow grease and 200.00.

You can put Iron sights on the gun for 100.00 to 150.00 and shoot, or a decent scope for 200.00, plus mounts for 50.00, nobody will "ooooo and aaahhh" over it but it will do the job that needs to be done.

so for anywhere between 1100.00 to 1450.00ish, a shooter can get a suitable rifle and start in this sport.

magazines NEEDED, 2- 20round, 4- 30 round, with 2 mag pouches and that should be it, we do not NEED "beta's", or 40-45 round mags.

My first competitive AR cost me 600.00 and a mini 14, I still have it and use it, it is MY IRON gun. I have others now, but it is still my go to Iron gun.

All this to say, what is the cheapest, reliable 3 gun rifle you've built or bought? This sport does not NEED to be as expensive as we make it.

Trapr

[uscbigdawg]

Trapr,

Just did this for a friend. Bought a used and abused, but still a good barrel'ed rifle for $700. He put a Simmons on it and used basic rings. Nothing fancy at all (I think they were Weaver) but they work and thus far haven't shown any issues. He's got 6-30 round mags (acquired through various deployments) and bought a Miculek comp for it. The trigger was tuned up by me to a nice 4# with the stock parts. A dremel opened up the magwell a smidge for easier reloading. As for pouches, he says, "I've got a back pocket," since there's rarely an instance where you need to reload (quickly) for the rifle.

He's in it for less than $1k. Oh...he bought a DPMS free float tube from me for dinner at Texas Road House one night. I installed it and we cut down the front sight to make it just a gas block.

Pretty sweet rifle actually.

Rich

ETA: Trapr - I'll try and get a picture

Edited May 20, 2008 by uscbigdawg

[kurtm]

I,ll play. The rifle I take overseas for IPSC rifle matches is a Bushmaster 20" rifle w/ a fluted barrel. I bought the gun used for $750 4 years ago, I bought a Y.H. flip up front sight from Bushmaster ( the kind designed to go around a cut off G.I. sight ) for $ 75 dollars and got a J.P. trigger for $125, got Benny to special make a brake with a shoulder @ .750 for $100, to mount the sight at the end of the barrel. Thats it, and it has won quite a few matches over the years, to include DPMS, Texas State 3-gun a few times and the Nordic Rifle Championships fror $1050, Oh yea and a few cans of model spray paint to cammo it for Coyotes, his rifle is almost always in the truck! KurtM

[bigbrowndog]

here is a pic of mine at I believe my second big 3 gun match, the JP globe replaced the original DPMS removeable front sight and then the DPMS was returned and it currently is in use.Very nice Rich. have you got a pic,

I think too many shooters feel that they have to have "cool" guns in order to shoot this sport, reliable, cheap and ugly is just as good as reliable, expensive and "cool" .

Trapr

Edited May 20, 2008 by bigbrowndog

[jobob]

This thread was needed! Too many shooters just starting in this sport are told they "have" to have this or that top-end product. Just isn't true. My 16" DPMS can be fairly competitive (if someone else shoots it). It started as a plain M4gery flattop. I cut off the front sight tower and bayonet lug (hated to do that, just because Nancy, Barack, and Hillary don't think I should have it) and installed a full length DPMS handguard. Weaver 1-3x in an Armalite one piece mount. The Magpul CTR stock is nice, but really not needed. Miculek comp. That's it. It shoots, and is as accurate and reliable as any of my ARs. I haven't added up the total, but it can't amount to much over a grand.

I also have a very versatile 20" Bushmaster flattop (V-Match). With a big scope it's accurate enough for the long range event at Ironman. With flip ups it's a decent iron shooter. And with a low power variable its just fine for tactical. You could do the same with nearly any flattop AR.

[NC Shooter]

I hope you'll be impressed with my frugality on this one. I am a long time Highpower shooter and I decided that I wanted to try 3 gun just for the hoot factor (and I love it). I bought a 16 inch Bushmaster V Match upper from a friend for $300.00 put a riser block and a Lupold 3X9 scope on it that has been in my safe for years. Mated this up with a Rock River Arms lower with a match trigger that I bought for $250.00. My shotgun is a Police turn in Remington 870 bought for $150.00 and added a 3 round mag tube extension for $35.00 more. My pistol is another Police turn in Beretta Mod. 96 in .40 cal. $300.00 and I use uncle Mikes double mag holders with a Blackhawk holster. on a last ditch guide belt. I know some of you guys are laughing your a$$e$ off at me but at 56 years old I never hoped to do anything more than enjoy myself nevermind win anything at the prize table.

Rifle ________________________________________$550.00

Shotgun _____________________________________$185.00

Pistol _______________________________________$300.00

Accessories __________________________________$100.00

Having the most fun possible with your clothes on ___Priceless

Still looking for the deal of the century on a 3 wheel jogging stroller for a cart.

Ken

Edited May 20, 2008 by NC Shooter

[bigbrowndog]

Ken, I have a 3 gun stroller/cart that is rarely used, and in excellent shape, what is a deal of the century for you?

BTW, my AR is a cobbled up gun as well, the barrel is from a prize table, the upper was put together by Benny Hill in trade for the Mini 14, which was going to be used for 3 gun until Benny said he wanted it, the Lower is a RR, with a JP trigger kit. As I've said earlier, it is still my #1 Iron gun.

just think of the ammo you can buy, by starting out cheap!!!!!

Trapr

[AikiDale]

I feel so ashamed.

I sold my Mini-14 and Remmy 1100 to a friend and replaced them with a rifle from Benny and a Benelli from Benny.

[Larry White]

I feel so ashamed.

I sold my Mini-14 and Remmy 1100 to a friend and replaced them with a rifle from Benny and a Benelli from Benny.

Makes you the winner.-----------Larry

[Merlin Orr]

I hope you'll be impressed with my frugality on this one. I am a long time Highpower shooter and I decided that I wanted to try 3 gun just for the hoot factor (and I love it). I bought a 16 inch Bushmaster V Match upper from a friend for $300.00 put a riser block and a Lupold 3X9 scope on it that has been in my safe for years. Mated this up with a Rock River Arms lower with a match trigger that I bought for $250.00. My shotgun is a Police turn in Remington 870 bought for $150.00 and added a 3 round mag tube extension for $35.00 more. My pistol is another Police turn in Beretta Mod. 96 in .40 cal. $300.00 and I use uncle Mikes double mag holders with a Blackhawk holster. on a last ditch guide belt. I know some of you guys are laughing your a$$e$ off at me but at 56 years old I never hoped to do anything more than enjoy myself nevermind win anything at the prize table.

Rifle ________________________________________$550.00

Shotgun _____________________________________$185.00

Pistol _______________________________________$300.00

Accessories __________________________________$100.00

Having the most fun possible with your clothes on ___Priceless

Still looking for the deal of the century on a 3 wheel jogging stroller for a cart.

Ken

Why Hell, Ken. I've got probably $8,500.00 in all my crap and I too am 56 and will never win anything at the prize table. Does this say anything about our relative levels of intellegence....?

Don't answer that.

[mike.45]

Oh yea and a few cans of model spray paint to cammo it for Coyotes

Yep, That has to be the prettiest man....... I mean RIFLE.... I ever saw.........

Edited May 20, 2008 by mike.45

[bigbrowndog]

Mike.45, like you can talk smack , you've entrusted him with your possessions.

Trapr

[NC Shooter]

Merlin,

You'll be pleased to know it has nothing to do with intelligence and may be more about determination. I'm also blind in my right eye but I wanted to try 3gun, knowing I'll never be really good at it so I didn't want to throw a lot of cash into the sport. I'm just proud to say that I can compete. I have shot a few matches already that I did not come in dead last. With a little time and practice I may find my way to the middle of the pack. I could be happy with that.

I can barely see enough of what must be seen to figure out what the heck I'm doing out there - but I'm having fun at it.

Ken

Edited May 20, 2008 by NC Shooter

[mike.45]

DOH !!!!!

[J-Ho]

Bushmaster dissapator with iron sights $780

This is what I started out using. I have since added a Jard adjustable single stage trigger ($100 I didn't know anything about triggers yet. I would use a JP if I had it to do over) I also put an F2 comp ($80) on it. I have moved to a different upper since, but still love my little bushmaster.

[Merlin Orr]

Merlin,

You'll be pleased to know it has nothing to do with intelligence and may be more about determination. I'm also blind in my right eye but I wanted to try 3gun, knowing I'll never be really good at it so I didn't want to throw a lot of cash into the sport. I'm just proud to say that I can compete. I have shot a few matches already that I did not come in dead last. With a little time and practice I may find my way to the middle of the pack. I could be happy with that.

I can barely see enough of what must be seen to figure out what the heck I'm doing out there - but I'm having fun at it.

Ken

Well Ken I CAN see out of both eyes - if I wear my coke bottle glasses.... If your avatar is your seeing eye dog well I will agree that I probably can see just a wee bit better.....

As to determination..... I am determined to have fun at this even if it bankrupts me and (my wife) kills me in the process...

[NC Shooter]

Roger that! I tell my son each time I bring home another gun or buy more gear that I'm spending his inheritance fast as I can but he will get some neet toys when I'm gone.

Just don't sell it off for what I've told his mom I bought it for. $$$

By the way - that's my drinking buddy / best friend Bobby Lee, he lets me call him Buba.

Ken

Edited May 21, 2008 by NC Shooter

[AikiDale]

Still looking for the deal of the century on a 3 wheel jogging stroller for a cart.

Ken

I got mine at a consignment baby stuff store for $49. They tell me it was $300 new.

[buzzworm]

Still looking for the deal of the century on a 3 wheel jogging stroller for a cart.

Ken

I got mine at a consignment baby stuff store for $49. They tell me it was $300 new.

I got mine out of a pile of trash, er, uh, 3gun gear, at the road side leaning up against some garbage cans. Very good shape. Didn't need the playpen, er, large brass catcher.

Used Oly 20"A2 450.00

GI mags 7.00 ea

GI mag pouches 3.00 ea

Used Miculek break 30.00

money saved spent on ammo/reloading supplies

no longer my primary rifle, but has been through many local matches from 3gun to CMP

[epault]

Defiantly roll your own. ARs are to easy to build. Pick parts you like and screw the thing together. You don't need high end parts to be competitive. I think one could shoot for quite a while before expensive parts were a huge difference in placing. As long as the gun is reliable.

Paul

[Craigar45]

HeyTrapr, does this mean I get a discount on the rather expensive rifle I am buying from you?

I am a pretty frugal shooter- That is not to say I don't like nice stuff, but for the most part I run on the cheap without looking cheap. I learned to mold my own Kydex to save me from spending hundreds of dollars on holsters and pouches. I have now developed a shell stripper that holds four shells -or- an AR mag. I have sold enough to recoup some of my multigun costs. I built my AR over time, and didnt pay retail for a single part on the gun. My pistol is a home-brew that took lots of work, but is now a nice high grade limited gun. At a certain level I believe we can be held back by our equipment, but I don't believe that solutions always have to cost lots of money.

All that said, I think there are lots of opportunities to get into our sport without having a king size bank roll. I recently switched to Limited from Tactical, and boy does it feel good. I think tactical is pretty bad for wallet races, namely rifle optics. Not to say that a good shooter can out shoot someone just by buying a really fancy scope in all cases, but on some stages (i.e. long ranges) this can be a huge advantage. The problem with getting started is the huge capital to get started. Most people that are interested have a few guns that can be made to work, but if they are anything like me, they wont be satisfied running an old pump gun with a three round mag tube. I know our club is really welcoming, and there are many members that regularly shoot 3-gun who are very willing to help out new shooters. I didnt have a shotgun of my own for my first couple matches, so I teamed up with someone who was willing to share. Its the way I started, and it is the way I helped many others get their start. I think this is an important thing to remember; sure getting all the gear is expensive, but as good sportsmen, we can ease the burden on our newer shooters by sharing what we have. In the fashion of crack dealers, we are just giving the first hits for free, and in reality, I doubt we are "helping" anyone but our sport.

C

[Craigar45]

Ooh, almost forgot about my shot cart... Hold guns and gear for 2-3 shooters, long guns are stored vertically, and I have about $9.00 into it. I got the double-wide jogging stroller for free on Craig's List, and then spent a few bucks on vinyl tubing to prevent marring any finishes, and some bungies to hold the guns in. My wife dubbed it the UABB: Urban Assault Baby Buggie.

C

[bigbrowndog]

what rifle??????????? I thought you were just depositing money in my account because you liked me.

I started this topic because some people think they need to go and buy new equipment to play, I thought it would be good for new shooters to see what alot of us started out with, not exactly top of the line stuff, but reliable, and some of it piece mealed together.

I see nothing wrong with upgrading equipment when you can, or starting with the best you can afford, but a new shooter does not need to spend a month or two salary to get started.

That FAL would look real good on your UABB

Trapr

Edited May 22, 2008 by bigbrowndog