shooterbenedetto Posted March 27, 2008 Share Posted March 27, 2008 (edited) Questions: 1) I wanted to know if the pistol grip tactical m2 benelli legal in california? 2)I needed to know if a gun store out of state would ship this to CA? 3)I saw one for sale brand new for $990.00 free shipping and has 18.5 barrel and only has 5+1 load, is this a good buy. 4)My FFL also wants to charge me tax on this plus transfer fees? I thought that I could save tax if I bought it out of state? 5) Just starting 3 gun in open division, where do I buy the gear and what up grade do I do to start? Thanks. Edited March 27, 2008 by shooterbenedetto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Payne Posted March 27, 2008 Share Posted March 27, 2008 I would stick with the M2 Field with 24" barrel and no pistol grip. Pistol grips are the work of the devil and will give you bad karma at every match you take it to. If you do a search I think you will get a couple of hours worth of reading over this same subject. Good luck. I guess I only answered question #5. I don't know the answers to the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbullgpd Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 As an out of state FFL I can say I would not. It is becoming pretty common practice to not sell anything to CA. sorry, just to many rules and dont want to get in trouble with the ATF. I think you will have a hard time finding an FFL that would. As for him charging you tax, diff states and cities have different rules and if he has to report the sale, the taxman will want a piece of it, which means u got to pay for it. No tax in my state, yeah Montana, but it varies from state to state, city to city, and dealer to dealer. As for pistol grip in CA, don't know, wild guess no just because most is but I dont have a clue. As for a good deal it is but you really want a longer barrell for 3 gun, 22-24 inches. Pistol grip discussion is dime a dozen. Some yeah, some neah. But if ur shooting open I would say no. Tactical possibility. pistol grip with speed loaders would be a no go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 Ed, The tax is a "use" tax and not a sales tax. It has been on the books since 1939, I believe. It is explained in your state income tax book. Later, Chuck PS: I am not a tax expert and you may go to jail if you listen to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 Benelli pistol grip + mag extension over 5 rounds = felony (in all 50 states). Only pre-ban guns are exempt. There are NO compliance parts for Benelli yet. Since there are no compliance parts, a Benelli with these modifications screams out "felony!" from 50 yards away (unlike an AK that may or may not have internal compliance parts). While I like pistol grips on my 3gun shotgun, I would not do it on an imported gun, since you are only allowed to have a 5 round mag tube on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outerlimits Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 there's a sweet deal on the uspsa classifieds...M1 super90 with a jpoint, ralph's loading chute, a 10 round mag tube & 6 sticks...better hurry or i will! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warpspeed Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 (edited) 1) No pistol grip on semiauto shotgun in CA. Period. ( unless it was registered as an AW prior to Jan 2000 ) 2) LE AW exemption might work here. Not sure. 3) seems high but what do I know 4) yes - they are going to charge a use tax equal to the sales tax rate on out of state shipments. They have to by law. 5) mag ext to 10 rds, Arredondo Speed Chute, a whole bunch of Tec Loaders & a dot Edited March 28, 2008 by warpspeed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GringoPerdido Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 1) No pistol grip on semiauto shotgun in CA. Period. ( unless it was registered as an AW prior to Jan 2000 ) Not sure where you quoted the above from, but the following AW definitions are cut and pasted from the CA DOJ BOF web site. You can have a pistol grip on a semi auto shotgun as long as there is no folding or telescoping stock. A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following: A folding or telescoping stock. A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip. A semiautomatic shotgun that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine. Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder. Of course, compliance with 922r issues on the fed level is another issue.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 My $.02... 1) I wanted to know if the pistol grip tactical m2 benelli legal in california? Yes it is legal. Problem arises when you add a tube that makes it more than 5+1. As noted you would need to comply with 922R (Federal law). An American made follower and tube (Nordic or DMW) and an American made stock will give you the 3 required parts to be legal. 2)I needed to know if a gun store out of state would ship this to CA? They can. But it is up to them. I would just go to a Turner's or another gun store and ask them to special order it for you (if they don't already have it). Prepare for a long wait if Benelli or the distributor doesn't have any in stock. (My order for a 24" Super Nova has gone for 5+ months unfilled.) 3)I saw one for sale brand new for $990.00 free shipping and has 18.5 barrel and only has 5+1 load, is this a good buy. I think that is a good price. But the 18.5" barrel isn't what you want for Open. If you can find them, new Benelli barrels will go for around $3-450. 4)My FFL also wants to charge me tax on this plus transfer fees? I thought that I could save tax if I bought it out of state? By CA law they have to charge you a "Use Tax" which usually corresponds to the sales tax of the dealer. Some FFL's may not be aware of the law and are not collecting on the tax. You can try shopping around to find an FFL that isn't aware of the law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gose Posted April 4, 2008 Share Posted April 4, 2008 1) I wanted to know if the pistol grip tactical m2 benelli legal in california?Yes it is legal. Problem arises when you add a tube that makes it more than 5+1. As noted you would need to comply with 922R (Federal law). An American made follower and tube (Nordic or DMW) and an American made stock will give you the 3 required parts to be legal Almost. Just replacing the extension wont give you a compliance part. You have to replace the rest of the mag tube/body as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted April 4, 2008 Share Posted April 4, 2008 1) I wanted to know if the pistol grip tactical m2 benelli legal in california?Yes it is legal. Problem arises when you add a tube that makes it more than 5+1. As noted you would need to comply with 922R (Federal law). An American made follower and tube (Nordic or DMW) and an American made stock will give you the 3 required parts to be legal Almost. Just replacing the extension wont give you a compliance part. You have to replace the rest of the mag tube/body as well. Text where you are basing that on? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mxpatriot51 Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 (edited) 1) No pistol grip on semiauto shotgun in CA. Period. ( unless it was registered as an AW prior to Jan 2000 )2) LE AW exemption might work here. Not sure. 3) seems high but what do I know 4) yes - they are going to charge a use tax equal to the sales tax rate on out of state shipments. They have to by law. 5) mag ext to 10 rds, Arredondo Speed Chute, a whole bunch of Tec Loaders & a dot 1. Wrong. You cannot have a pistol grip AND a folding stock on a semi-automatic shotgun. A pistol grip with a fixed stock is fine on a semi-auto. What the OP has to worry about is making sure he has enough U.S. made compliance parts to comply with 922R when he starts swapping parts and extending tubes. And to the OP, 18.5'' is way too short for open. Your magazine tube will be a mile in front of your barrel. Edited July 27, 2008 by mxpatriot51 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franksremote Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 (edited) As an out of state FFL I can say I would not. It is becoming pretty common practice to not sell anything to CA. sorry, just to many rules and dont want to get in trouble with the ATF. I think you will have a hard time finding an FFL that would. As for him charging you tax, diff states and cities have different rules and if he has to report the sale, the taxman will want a piece of it, which means u got to pay for it. No tax in my state, yeah Montana, but it varies from state to state, city to city, and dealer to dealer. As for pistol grip in CA, don't know, wild guess no just because most is but I dont have a clue. As for a good deal it is but you really want a longer barrell for 3 gun, 22-24 inches. Pistol grip discussion is dime a dozen. Some yeah, some neah. But if ur shooting open I would say no. Tactical possibility. pistol grip with speed loaders would be a no go. As an FFL in CA, my two cents... The ATF is only concerned if you violate federal law, not CA state law. Nothing federally wrong with any AR, shotgun or pistol provided it doesn't violate NFA/SBR/SBS rules as far as the ATF is concerned; the CA DOJ has issues that need to be addressed, but that never affects the shipping FFL (not your job to know our laws). Taxes collected in CA are typically for usage, not sales. If the FFL doesn't collect it, you are responsible to file Usage Tax paperwork on your out of state purchase; he/she is doing you a favor. It is perfectly legal to own a semi-auto shotgun with a pistol grip in CA, just not one with those features and a collapsible stock. Some FFLs are reluctant to send anything into CA, not because there is any sort of legal liability, but purely due to the fact that they don't want to deal with Californians. A Federally legitimate FFL in CA is no different than an FFL in any other state (I can buy anything you can provided it doesn't violate CA assault weapons laws), it's just our responsibility to ensure the laws of CA are adhered to when it comes to disposition of them. Edited October 3, 2008 by Franksremote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cksh8me Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Yes a fixed pistol grip stock on a semi auto shotgun is legal in California law. The law everyone in all 50 states must conform with is 922r. To be compliant with a Benelli (any imported shotgun) you need to change 3 parts from their list to American made parts. The mag tube, not the extension is one part, the follower is another part. There is a list of other parts to choose from. The problem is finding them. One of the parts is a muzzle device. I am not a lawyer but.......... it sounds like a Briley choke tube would be a muzzle device. Or if you are shooting open there's all kinds of junk you can put on your gun, I dont know if any of them work. Yes the ffl is supposed to charge you tax. They can also charge you extra for receiving the firearm. Dealers can set their own fee for this. Some ffl's won't charge extra others will charge 150 bucks the rest somewhere in between. I'm not an open shooter but I agree with others I don't think the 18.5" ghetto blaster model would make a good open gun. 24" sounds better. In July the CA DOJ implemented a law that a transaction # must be obtained between the two ffls before a gun can be shipped. I'm told it's not a big deal but it's another hurdle and some ffls won't want to do this. This also applys to in state ffl transfer. If you are a wholesaler or ffl in California you are doing this. If you are a out of state dealer that might sell a gun to CA or not they might not want to bother. Buy your gear from www.speedshooters.com, www.davesmetalworks.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike.45 Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Or those great guys at NORDIC !!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gose Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Yes a fixed pistol grip stock on a semi auto shotgun is legal in California law. The law everyone in all 50 states must conform with is 922r. To be compliant with a Benelli (any imported shotgun) you need to change 3 parts from their list to American made parts. The mag tube, not the extension is one part, the follower is another part. There is a list of other parts to choose from. The problem is finding them. One of the parts is a muzzle device. I am not a lawyer but.......... it sounds like a Briley choke tube would be a muzzle device. Or if you are shooting open there's all kinds of junk you can put on your gun, I dont know if any of them work. Yes the ffl is supposed to charge you tax. They can also charge you extra for receiving the firearm. Dealers can set their own fee for this. Some ffl's won't charge extra others will charge 150 bucks the rest somewhere in between. I'm not an open shooter but I agree with others I don't think the 18.5" ghetto blaster model would make a good open gun. 24" sounds better. In July the CA DOJ implemented a law that a transaction # must be obtained between the two ffls before a gun can be shipped. I'm told it's not a big deal but it's another hurdle and some ffls won't want to do this. This also applys to in state ffl transfer. If you are a wholesaler or ffl in California you are doing this. If you are a out of state dealer that might sell a gun to CA or not they might not want to bother. Buy your gear from www.speedshooters.com, www.davesmetalworks.com I kinda doubt that a choke counts as a muzzle device, but I could be wrong. AFAIK the following US made parts are available: Speed feed stock (Just for M1?) Surefire forearm Follower Mag tube If you're running with a straight stock, you only have 12 parts, so replacing the follower and the mag tube is enough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Speed feed stock (Just for M1?) The M1 Speed feed stock can be adapted to the M2. I did it with a drill and some superglue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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