How much time is a point worth?

[Drachen27]

I've been shooting IDPA for a few years, and have just started with USPSA. In IDPA I know that I have to balance the time against accuracy. I'm better off taking a C hit vs a A hit, if I can save more than a second doing it, and it's proabably not worth the time for a reload just to make one more shot even if it means a miss.

What's the correlation in USPSA? I know I need to be fast AND accurate, but how do I figure out whether it's better to make up a slightly poor shot or to save the time? At what point am I better off racing through a stage with a mix of A & C hits, versus taking time to get all A hits?

[Chris Keen]

The rules might be different, but the theory is still the same.

[mike cyrwus]

Shoot as fast as you can get all A's.

[spook]

The wanna-b-speedy threads will be a good read.

I also did a search for hit factor

[Chills1994]

PM sent Drachen.

[Flexmoney]

IDPA = Fixed Hit Factor

USPSA = Variable Hit Factor

Hit Factor is points divided by time, or...points per second. (check out the links that spook provided to get the idea).

In IDPA, each point down is worth a fixed amount of time. That makes the scoring a little bit easier to understand...it's just your time...plus added time for any penalties.

In USPSA, you get stage points based on your hit factor. Your hit factor is variable because it is your points (actually shot) divided by the time you did it in. The best hit factor gets the stage win, and 100% of the stage points. Everybody else gets points based on how they did versus the stage winner (direct comparison...if you are 85% of the stage winner, you get 85% of the points for that stage).

So, your hit factor is kinda up to you.

As suggested, your shooting strategy probably ought to stay with shooting Alpha hits. You don't want to go too far with that and shoot likely it was Bulls-eye, but you do need to collect as many points as possible. Gain time by being efficient, not by blasting fast.

[chuckbradley]

I always did a real simple calculation which does change if you are not at or near the high hit factor yourself. But if a stage has a hit factor of 5 then a second is worth 5 points. If it has a factor of 15 then a second is worth 15 points. We used to try and change shooting style toward the theory speed is more important on high hit factor stages and accuracy was more important on low HF stages.

Bottom line is shoot all a's as fast as you can. Although you can still make a case that if you gave up so many A's and can do it so much faster on a high hit factor stage you may come out better. For stages 5 and under the All A's as fast as you can really applies.

[shred]

Hit-factors also vary by shooter ability-- what an A-shooter sees as a 10 HF stage, a C-shooter may see as a 5-HF stage.

If you don't like to analyze numbers, just make your mantra "shoot good points as rapidly as possible".

If you are the type that likes to analyze numbers, the easiest way to get your hit factor is to look at the stage results after the match. Now that doesn't help you at that match, but at the next match, you can go in thinking "ok, on a stage like this, last time I ran about a 3 HF.. so each point will be worth 1/3 of a second". Stage HFs will also tell you exactly what you need to work on. Look at your points and figure out how many seconds you lost due to points. When that number gets very small, think about speeding up.

In practice, I usually use 0.2 sec / point as a rough figure, which enforces A's for me, but that number will be very different for someone of a different skill level.

[el pres]

I asked the same question when I came out of IDPA and into IPSC.

Forget about it, its different for every stage. Oh, and then the missed shots,

IDPA- make up 2.5 seconds, easy right ?

IPSC- 10 points ???? WTH I just lost this 4 factor stage !!!!

Hit A's as fast as you can and forget about it !!

[LPatterson]

In IPSC a miss should be consider a -15, -5 for the A you didn't get and -10 for the penalty.

[warpspeed]

Here is what I have figured out.

1) Misses will kill you. You cannot make up Mikes. You cannot shoot fast enough to eat Mikes.

2) No Shoots are almost as bad as mikes. And a Mike with a No Shoot, well, that is really bad.

3) Everything equal - speed is usually the deciding factor.

So, shoot as fast as you can w/o missing and without penalties.

If the stage requires you doing something that you are not comfortable with - like tight long shots - you better slow down.

If the targets are wide open @ 7 yds, all the points won't make up for bullseye shooting style.

Look at the HHF for the classifiers. they are fast with only 1 or 2 points down.

[DogmaDog]

After shooting many USPSA stages, and seeing your results, you'll start to get a feel for what your hit factor will be on a given stage. 24 round field course with a few shots at 15 yards...I'll get about a 7.000 hit factor on it. 1 second is worth 7 points. A miss costs bit over 2 seconds. A D costs a bit less than half a second. Unless I know it's a D immediately, don't make it up, but a called miss is worth making up.

How do I know I'll get a 7.000 hit factor on it? Just because I've shot lots of stages. On a real close hoser stage, hit factors will be very high. On a course with lots of movement and long shots, HF will be low. A long field course with lots of tight or long shots, and some swingers might be as low as a 2 HF, and then it's just like IDPA--each point dropped costs you 1/2 a second.

Some shots you'd consider making up:

A Mike/no-shoot. -25 points costs you 2.5 seconds even at a 10 HF stage (which is a really high HF stage)...nearly always worth making up if you called it. If you have to look, see it, then re-engage, it might take 4 seconds--only worth it at HF 6 and below.

A miss. -15 points 3 seconds on an HF 5 stage, only 1.5 secs at HF 10. IF you called it, and can fire another without missing a beat (say 0.4 secs), then worth it to make up.

A D. -3 points. 1 second on a very low HF 3 stage. Only 1/2 second on an HF 6 stage. Usually not worth making up, unless this is a course that takes a long time to shoot anyway, and has a lot of long shots. Only worth making up if your reasonably sure you can get a better hit pretty quickly.

A C or B -1 point. If you can replace a C with an A hit in 0.2 seconds, then it's a wash on a HF 5 stage. Seldom worth it, except on a very low HF stage.

You won't be able to do any of this calculation during a course of fire, and make it worthwhile use of the analysis. I gather that if anyone benefits from this sort of thing, they kinda decide whether a stage is a "speed stage" (high HF) or an "accuracy stage" (low HF), and then tune their visual patience accordingly. Really good shooters just do this shot to shot...seeing what they need to see to hit an A, and NO MORE.

So, yeah, what they said earlier...shoot all A's as fast as you can...or shoot only as fast as you can hit A's. (But if you do shoot all A's, speed it up a bit).

DD

[Allgoodhits]

Much preceeding great advice as usual from many posters.

One flaw, IMO, to much of what is said, is a phrase Shoot "A's" as fast as you can. This phrase processed by newer shooters will likely have the reader/shooter "ignore" the "A" part and just shoot as fast as they can, letting the hits take care of themselves so to speak. Since you can't shoot fast enough to miss targets and score well. I prefer........

Shoot as slow as "you" need to have all "A's" and let the speed take care of itself. Practicing speed will make you better at speed things, such as reaction, draw, target acquisition, transitions, reloading, moveing and the like. It will not make you a better shooter, although it may raise your score. On the other hand, if you develop the shooting skills first, then the only limit you have is learning to execute what it takes to deliver the appropriate shots, and to navigate the COF more efficiently, and more quickly.

Elevate your shooting skills, and work on your speed. So many times I hear people say, I need to shoot that faster, when they should be working on I need to shoot that better! A c c u r a c y & Speed.

MJ