Calmwater Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 Hi, This is my first post so please bear with me....... I am interested in shooting GSSF, IDPA and USPSA. I have shot and carried .40 glocks for about 12 years and have been very satisfied. I intend to buy an 9mm to practice and compete with because of the cheap ammo among other reasons. I am having the classic glock 17 or glock 34 crisis. After years of shooting standard size glocks, I am leaning towards the 17. By the time I add the lighter connector and a extended slide lever to a 17 (left handed) or replace the extended mag button on the 34 with a standard one the money isn't that big a difference. I like the idea of more sight radius, but upon comparing the guns side by side I noticed when I presented the 34, I had to hunt for my front sight. The 17 came up with a good sight picture. I know training would make me as comfortable with the 34, but I'm not sure there is much benefit...... The GSSF scores from last year on glocktalk showed Taran Butler shot his best time with iron sights in master stock not in competition. I think in the amateurs the fastest time was in guardian and not comp. That would seem to suggest they shot better scores with the standard sized gun, unless the shooters just used a standard gun in comp too wouldn't it? Thanks for any response................. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMITH Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 I prefer the 17, but would be better off with a 34. Sight radius is something you can't replace on a shorter gun, it makes a BIG difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 I did some sight radius math once, but posted it on a different forum...and I don't remember which one. (Maybe I will try to dig it up). Howard is pretty hard-core on the longer sight radius being an advantage. I'm not so convinced (sorry Howard). In reality, I could argue it both ways. For GSSF...I'd take the G17/G22 to shoot in AmCiv. (well, I wouldn't, because I don't qualify for that divisin). If I'm not mistaken, a G34 would put you in Competition division...and Masters can shoot there? If the Masters are shooting against you... For IDPA and USPSA...just about everybody shoots a G34/35. There are some notable exceptions...top shooters that shoot the G17/22. I've never really noticed an difference in my scores either way. So, go with what feels right for you. Pick one and practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itchy Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 In GSSF, Taran Butler shoots an iron sighted gun in "stock" and "unlimited/open", and "competition". I think it's the same gun. He's just plain smokin fast. "Masters" in GSSF can now shoot in almost every category (subcompact, competition, majorsub), but they only compete against other "masters". If you are just beginning, it's probably better to get the 17, since it will let you shoot in both amateur and competition classes, whereas a 34 will only allow you to shoot in competition class. Then when you win amateur class, you can get yourself a 26, so then you can shoot subcompact also. When you win subcompact, get yourself the 34. I can't remember if they give a gun away to the majorsub (compact 45 cal guns and maybe 10 mm) winner, so you might want to get that gun last. I have both the 34 and the 17, but I like the feel of the 17 better, so I use the 17. But, there's something to be said for longer sight radius. Good luck! Seiichi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JThompson Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 Anything they care to pick up. That's the bottom line... some get to a point where they smoke no matter the tool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 "Masters" in GSSF can now shoot in almost every category (subcompact, competition, majorsub), but they only compete against other "masters".Seiichi Thanks for the correction there. I thught that might be the case now, but I wasn't sure. (It's been a while for me and GSSF.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FESTUS Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 I'm relatively new to the Forum and was heavily involved on Glocktalk and did shoot alot of GSSF.......actually sponsored (4) teams both Amateur and Master. I'm going to give Steel Shooting a whirl and did send in for my USPSA card and now have a number. I've had two hips replaced and I yield to the younger bodies and eyes,but hope to enjoy the sport and try to test my skills and develop more. To get to the point......I've had at one time just about everything in length in the 9,10 and .40 caliber models and have settled on playing with two model 17's....Bomars on the back with .090 fronts.....extended mag.and slide releases and a 3.5#connector that has been polished....also a lighter striker spring. Ohhh.....a little skate tape on the grip. I have seen some good times with a stock 17 as outlined above in GSSF.....in fact the best time last year was at Fort Smith for Amateur Civilan ...a 53.0 by Charlie Vanek and that was I believe his first GSSF match.Mr.Vanek was a pleasure to talk to and we discussed....what else triggers and glocks. I'm learning to draw and reload and feel that if I eliminate the variables......by shooting one pistol.....I might actually get better.....shooting GSSF I could use a 17 and as an Amateur shoot....Open,Master Stock,Competition,and finally Amateur Civilian.GSSF gives you an opportunity to win two ways......skill and luck.....I have been luckier than skillfull and year before last took (5) model 17's home. I guess I'm being wordy in saying that the 17 will give you more flexibility and if you do win some 17's.....you may decide to convert one to an open gun......looks like most use the 17 platform. goodluck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe D Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 The only advantage I have found with a G34 is the longer sight radius allows you to see off center shots a little easier. If I see a bad sight alignment with the G34 then I know I have to make up that shot. The shorter sight radius of the G17 makes it less obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket35 Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 (edited) When I first met with Dave Sevigny at a GSSF match, he said he preferred the G17. But must also feel there is enough of an avantage to the longer sight radius and barrel in the G34-35 to shoot them in USPSA. He does shoot the G17 in IPSC though. I believe the G34 is not allowed in International competition. Edited January 31, 2008 by Rocket35 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calmwater Posted January 31, 2008 Author Share Posted January 31, 2008 Thanks for all the feedback. I am leaning toward the 17. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SA Friday Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 My gun safe looks like a tupperware cupboard by Glock. I feed them regularly, and they seem to procreate. The more I shoot, the less this question really matters to the shooting aspect. It really comes down to which divisions you want to shoot. Then again, if you have to make that decision, just buy one of each and be done with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseywales Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 G17 or G34 - not enough difference to worry about, do as Flex says... ...go with what feels right for you. Pick one and practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itchy Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 I'm relatively new to the Forum and was heavily involved on Glocktalk and did shoot alot of GSSF.......actually sponsored (4) teams both Amateur and Master. I'm going to give Steel Shooting a whirl and did send in for my USPSA card and now have a number. I've had two hips replaced and I yield to the younger bodies and eyes,but hope to enjoy the sport and try to test my skills and develop more. The great thing about Steel Challenge and GSSF is that it's mostly a "stand and shoot" type event, that really stresses accuracy. I've realized that for some reason, I'm a turtle. There are guys that smoke me in USPSA, but I can keep up with them in GSSF and Steel Challenge. I guess it's all about discovering your strengths and weaknesses. This year I'm going to give ICORE a try. Movement with a stress on accuracy. Good luck, Seiichi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calmwater Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 I went to the local indoor range gunshop this afternoon and rented a 34 (I have shot a 17 in the past and took my 22 for some comparison on the range). I was very happy with the 34s performance. It grouped a little better than my 22 at the distances where I could group at all. I am sure this had as much to do with the MUCH MORE PLEASANT to shoot 9mm cartridge. Although I agree there probably isn't much difference between the 17 and 34, I liked the 34 on the range so I bought one. Most of my competition shoots starting out will be IDPA and a few USPSA. I want to shoot GSSF eventually, but will use a buddies 26 and hopefully my issue 22 with some sort of softer load if I can find one or have a loader friend of mine put one together (Cnc Cartridge company- Danny is a saint). Thanks to everyone for your help..........not that a decision between two great guns should be all that hard. Now to get to the second half of "Pick one and practice." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Good deal. (Factory 40 amo can be a bit of a handful in the Glock). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 I prefer the 17, but would be better off with a 34. Sight radius is something you can't replace on a shorter gun, it makes a BIG difference. Howard, I was able to dig up that info I posted on another thread. OK...sit down for this one. (and check my math) Using the forumula to adjust for sight height: http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=9223 ...and some math We can compare what the difference in a sighting error on a G19 vs a G34...at the distances mentioned. I am going to go with a sight radius of 5.98in for the G19 and 7.32in for the G34. (OK...I looked it up now. ) And, to make the comparison, we will have to use the same "error amount" for both guns. I picked the value of 0.05in out of thin air. That is half a tenth. It seemed to work out. If we are to define "error amount" it will be how far off the sights are from dead center when the shot broke. Here we go: - At 25y with the 7.32in gun, a sighting error of 0.05in results in the hit being off 6.15in. 25 yards equals 900 inches, so... 900 x 0.05 / 7.32 = 6.15 - At 25y with the 5.98in gun, a sighting error of 0.05in results in the hit being off 7.52in. 25 yards equals 900 inches, so... 900 x 0.05 / 5.98in = 7.52 With the same (given) sighting error, the difference between a G34 and a g19 at 25y is...1.37 inches. So, that translates into...about 22%. (1.37 / 6.15 = 22.28%) - At 40y with the 7.32in gun, a sighting error of 0.05in results in the hit being off 9.84in. 40 yards equals 1440 inches, so... 1440 x 0.05 / 7.32 = 9.84 - At 40y with the 5.98in gun, a sighting error of 0.05in results in the hit being off 12.0in. 40 yards equals 1440 inches, so... 1440 x 0.05 / 5.98 = 12.0 The difference between the two at 40y...given the same sighting error...is 2.16 inches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johann the Horrible Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 From your post I deduce that you are a LEO. If that is true try and shoot your issue firearm as much as possible. The last thing you need is to land up in a situation where someone is shooting at you and you are used to another, similar but not identical gun. IE your 20 shoots 4 inches low at 10 yards but your 34(that you shoot all the time) 2 inches high. Your mind is a powerful tool but it van be fooled. You just might end aiming lower to compensate for a sight bias with the wrong gun. If the sights are not identical the situation is even worse. In competition it is a niggle but in "real life" that "mike" just be the last chance you had. I carry and shoot the same gun, a Para .45. Its as hot as hell here in South Africa just now but I still go to the effort to conceal a large heavy gun because when the paw-paw hits the fan I need to have a familiar tool in my hand. (It is so hot here that when we phone the hell from here it is charged as a local call) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calmwater Posted February 2, 2008 Author Share Posted February 2, 2008 Johann, You are correct about my line of work. You make some valid points. I intend to shoot my duty weapon as often as possible. I believe specificity in training is very important. That being said, different ammunition through my duty weapon would also cause variance in how and where the weapon shoots. Shooting identical full boat ammo out of my duty weapon especially in the volume I intend to shoot will become cost prohibitive quickly. I enjoy the sport of judo. Even though it has rules that outlaw striking, gouging and other very effective techniques the stress innoculation I receive in randori better prepares me for real conflicts at work. My experience in judo has never made me decide not to use a technique which would be illegal in the sport when I needed to on the street. I appreciate your advice and will shoot my duty weapon regularly in addition to my new gaming gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now