Thinking about a G17 for USPSA Production

[Dave Gundry]

Probably pick one up used over the winter (hopefully sooner rather than later ), but I'm already contemplating mods and gear for it...

Whats a typical used price for a decent G17? I'm thinking ~$350, but would like more input...

Generations: Only the current (3rd?) gen has the finger gooves, correct? I like those.

Parts: a 3.5lb connector is a no brainer, but is only the Glock part legal, or are the aftermarket (i.e. LW) parts legal? Same question for mag releases and maybe an ext slide release.

Other trigger work: Anything to polish here at home that'll help? Lighter FP springs ok (i.e. legal? do they function well?)?

Grip stuff: The stock Glocks I've handled seem slippery - Can the grip be stippled (as long as not a lot of material is removed - 'i.e. grip reduction')? Any grip tape or other kits out there that get good reviews?

Holster: I love my BT DOH, but it's fairly spendy... Any low cost options out there that'll work (i.e. Uncle Mike's Kydex Belt Holster)?

Mag Pouches: Same question as above - can someone measure their mags for me, I'd like to see if my current (UM univ. double stack) pouches will work...

Thanks a ton

[Chris Keen]

Whats a typical used price for a decent G17? I'm thinking ~$350, but would like more input... You can get a used 2nd Gen. for that price, but if you want a 3rd Gen. expect to pay $400~$450.

Generations: Only the current (3rd?) gen has the finger gooves, correct? I like those.

I do too, but I started with a used 2nd Gen. Glock 17. Only Glock factory parts are legal. You will quickly learn that eventually the ext. slide release lever gets in your way. Get a nice drop-in trigger kit from Charlie Vanek or one of the others.

Can the grip be stippled (as long as not a lot of material is removed - 'i.e. grip reduction')? Any grip tape or other kits out there that get good reviews? No modifications can be made to the grip at this time (may change next year) but a great addition to any Glock is http://www.ericwesselman.com/store/store.html

Holster: I love my BT DOH, but it's fairly spendy... Any low cost options out there that'll work (i.e. Uncle Mike's Kydex Belt Holster)? Stick with the Bladetech. The best by far.

Edited October 31, 2007 by CHRIS KEEN

[sfinney]

FOR USPSA:

Only Glock brand external parts like the mag release and slide release, are legal. You can put an extended factory mag release from a G34 in your 17, (recommended), but skip the extended slide release. You can use pretty much any aftermarket sights you want. You can use aftermarket internal parts like springs, guiderods, connectors like LW, etc. - but anything external needs to be a Glock part. Exception: you can use aftermarket barrels of same caliber and length.

Grip tape is must, get EricW's (from the link above). Once you get the tape on there, you won't care about the finger grooves anymore. Get the cheapest 17 you can find.

Good sights (Heinie, Dawson, etc) , a 3.5 connector (the LW is awesome), some light polishing on the rest inside, and good grip tape.... that will get you started. And yes, stick with the Blade-tech DOH.

Edited October 31, 2007 by sfinney

[SDM]

.... that will get you started.

Started...that 'll take him all the way if he can do it (coming from someone who can't mind you). You know the good thing is that all of that might cost $150.

[eerw]

sit down with someone that knows Glocks..have them strip it all down to its parts so you understand the function..then if you shop the forums..you can set up your glock very inexpensively..

I just went through this..and I was impressed how easy good parts are too find.

This gave me a good setup without getting to extreme..

wolffe springs..extra power trigger spring, reduced power striker spring and reduce power FP spring..

Install a 3.5 connector..the ghost ultimate and the LW are nice.

Polished the trigger bar, the FP plunger, the striker and the connector.

install a good set of sights..I did the Dawson fixed rear and plain front..really sweet..

install a G34 mag release..

apply tru grip tape..

I think total I spent for this was $100 and most of that being the sights..cuz I bought them new..

and you are ready to rock production..

Edited October 31, 2007 by eerw

[Micah]

Whats a typical used price for a decent G17? I'm thinking ~$350, but would like more input... You can get a used 2nd Gen. for that price, but if you want a 3rd Gen. expect to pay $400~$450.

Generations: Only the current (3rd?) gen has the finger gooves, correct? I like those.

I do too, but I started with a used 2nd Gen. Glock 17. Only Glock factory parts are legal. You will quickly learn that eventually the ext. slide release lever gets in your way. Get a nice drop-in trigger kit from Charlie Vanek or one of the others.

Can the grip be stippled (as long as not a lot of material is removed - 'i.e. grip reduction')? Any grip tape or other kits out there that get good reviews? No modifications can be made to the grip at this time (may change next year) but a great addition to any Glock is http://www.ericwesselman.com/store/store.html

Holster: I love my BT DOH, but it's fairly spendy... Any low cost options out there that'll work (i.e. Uncle Mike's Kydex Belt Holster)? Stick with the Bladetech. The best by far.

Boy...there really isn't anything Chris said that I don't completely agree with.

Stick with TruGrip. I use CR Speed mag pouches because they keep the mags a little further away from my torso.

I wouldn't clip too many coils off of your striker spring unless you have extras. Actually, you are going to want to buy extra springs anyway. Do a search on "Backup Glock Parts"...I started a thread last year on the topic.

[G-ManBart]

Man, you've gotten some excellent advice so far...probably nothing I can add. Is there any reason why you would chose the 17 over a 34? If it's just price, there are a few sources that can get you into a 34 for only a little more based off what I've seen.

If you do get one, PM me and I'll donate a new set of EricW's grip tape so you can try them out....I've got some extra that I probably won't use. They are the absolute heat when it comes to a secure gripping surface.

Not to bash Glocks (I've got four of them) but if you get the chance, you may want to shoot them alongside a Springfield XD and/or S&W M&P to see which feels the best to you. I had high hopes of making my spare G22 a Production gun (which is why I have the grip tape) but they beat up my fingers so bad there just isn't any way I could practice enough with one. After about 150-200 rounds I'm done and that's with medical tape on my fingers. It gets so bad that eventually calluses break off and I get blood all over my gun, which isn't cool!

The Blade Tech is definitely a great holster, but the wait time on them is around six weeks, so plan accordingly. An alternative is Comp-Tac. I got one for my Smith 610 when I didn't have time to wait and it's a very nice holster that seems every bit as good as the BT.

[joseywales]

I've used the top of the line custom trigger.

I've used the Wolff and Glockmeister extra power trigger springs.

I've used the lighter striker springs.

I now use factory internals - just polished them up. For me it was just a reliability/no hassle issue - keep it simple Steve.

Sights - two favorites: Heinie Slant Pro rear, with Dawson FO front - or Warren Competition fixed sights (black on black).

Get an extended mag release from the G34.

Get the 3.5 connector from the G34.

Avoid extended slide release - just gets in the way at the most inopportune time.

Grip tape, Tru-grip - used both - good stuff, but I've gone to just using rosin bag to keep hands dry/improve grip

Holster - UM is fine, my favorite is Kytac Sooper Hooper - kept banging my thumb on the BT DOH, but it's a good one too.

CR Speed inner/outer belt, and mag pouches are really tough to beat.

Good idea to get backup parts for trigger spring, striker spring, striker, magazine spring, spring cups (easy to lose), pins, slide release, recoil rod/spring...all will break at some point and it will put your mind at ease to know you've got backups in the bag in case something does break at a match. Go to Lone Wolf Dist, make yourself a pick list from the frame & slide diagrams.

Be sure to have fun!

[sfinney]

Blade-tech DOH holsters for Glock 17/22 (along with several other types ie G34/35, 1911, S_I, etc) in stock at :

http://www.speedshooter.com/product_detail...D=RS06LX-GL1722

Edited October 31, 2007 by sfinney

[Dave Gundry]

Awesome, thanks for all the great advice guys

Well, I may have talked myself into a G34. It's ~$90 more than a G17 from my LGS. More than half that would be the cost of upgrade parts (connector, sights, ext mag release), so I think I may go for the 34 right off the bat and have the extra length and the blingin' hole in the slide I hate how I can talk myself into a $620 gun when the thought started as $350

I am going to borrow a G17 from one of the LGS employees tomorrow and see what I think. I'll have to sell my 10-22(which I love, but barely shoot anymore) and my 22/45mk3(which I don't like at all) to make either a G17 or G34 happen, but hopefully I'll be able to hang onto my Witness. Then the plan would be to pick up a 22 conversion for the Glock later down the road.

Anybody know if a 34 holster will work for a 17 just fine? I know I'd have length issues going the other way around... (thinking specifically about a BT DOH)?

Thanks again!

Edited October 31, 2007 by Krautwagen

[Albertl35]

BT lists 2 different models for the 17 vs the 34. Since the trigger guard stops it from dropping further, the 34 holster should work for a 17.

[HoMiE]

The 17/22 will fit in the 34/35 BT DOH holster.

[Jman]

All good advise. If cash is an issue the Uncle Mike kydex belt holster is just fine.

Jim M

[CDRODA396]

All good advise. If cash is an issue the Uncle Mike kydex belt holster is just fine.

Jim M

You can also pick up the DOH w/techlok adaptor and hardware for $14.95 from Bladetech, and with a little inginuity (very little) mount it to the Uncle Mike's and have the Poor Man's version of the BT DOH pretty easily.

[Dave Gundry]

All good advise. If cash is an issue the Uncle Mike kydex belt holster is just fine.

Jim M

You can also pick up the DOH w/techlok adaptor and hardware for $14.95 from Bladetech, and with a little inginuity (very little) mount it to the Uncle Mike's and have the Poor Man's version of the BT DOH pretty easily.

Ha - never thought about that. I originally bought the std SR holster for my Witness, and then bought the Tecklok w/DOH hardware just for the DOH. IIRC, they also sell the DOH with the SR loop, which is what I'd prefer. But, figure $20 for the holster, $15 for harware, and I'd be just $30 short of a real BT DOH w/SR from speedshooter as sfinney posted... I had a good night at work, so I'll have a few extra bucks to throw at this setup, so I'll probably just go for the full BT setup.

Still pondering mag pouches though... Can somebody measure their mags for me please?

Thanks a ton guys, this is what makes this forum the best out there

[BR]

Several of the top glock shooters I know prefer the G17 over the G34 for production. They say it feels quicker, with less up/down muzzle movement. I still prefer the G34, with bit longer sight radius and little more weight up front. Likewise, some prefer 125s, some prefer 147s; I still prefer 147s. To each her/his own

All my local production buds make the same essential mods, with any glock, in order of importance: (1) trugrip -- glocks feel naked without it; (2) new sights -- heinie/dawson, dawson ajd., or my favorite Sevigny comp sights. I recently swithed to a fiber optic, and like it, although it may be the trick of the day; (3) trigger job -- from do-it-yourself polishing, to Ralph Sotelo's, to Charlie Vanek's, with different spring and striker combos -- everyone seems to have her/his own prefernce. Pick one and shoot.

Also, I like an extended mag.rel., but a std. slide release. Otherwise, you'll lock the slide back when you do not want to. And, I like a metal guide rod with a 13 lb. spring, although I know guys who run springs from 10 to 17lbs., and a couple who just use the stock rod/spring set-up so they can use the same gun for uspsa, idpa, and glock matches. I, like most, use a blade-tech DOH with a 34; with a G17 I have an old comp-tac that I prefer. I'm short, so a little extra room with the DOH is useful with the little longer gun.

Seems to be a pattern to these responses. That's one of the two reasons I love production: (a) shoot almost same gun as my carry gun, and ( no real equipment race, especially with 10 rd. mag. limit. And there are plenty of good production guys who shoot sigs, xds, m&ps, and czs, berettas, for the same reasons. Everyone thinks his gun is the best, even in production.

Ciao.

-br

Edited November 1, 2007 by joker22

[Dave Gundry]

Still up in the air about 17 or 34... I like the OD 17, and haven't seen that you can get an OD 34 . Sight radius seems to be the only real advantage, the hole in the slide seems, to me, to be 90% bling factor and 10% slide weight reduction for less muzzle drop (which is probably negated by the longer, and therefore heavier, slide...

4th safety? - is that some kind of child-lock type safety? Do all new Glocks have those (or just in states that require them)?

So here's my build list:

Glock 3.5 connector ($25)

34 mag release ($3)

TruGrip, and might try out some A-Grip in the off season (unless I hear a resounding "NO!") ($25)

BT DOH holster ($65)

2 more hicap mags ($40)

Heine SlantPro sights ($50)

Possibly a Wolff Reduced Power Striker Spring...

And lots more ammo

[G-ManBart]

Still up in the air about 17 or 34... I like the OD 17, and haven't seen that you can get an OD 34 . Sight radius seems to be the only real advantage, the hole in the slide seems, to me, to be 90% bling factor and 10% slide weight reduction for less muzzle drop (which is probably negated by the longer, and therefore heavier, slide...

4th safety? - is that some kind of child-lock type safety? Do all new Glocks have those (or just in states that require them)?

So here's my build list:

Glock 3.5 connector ($25)

34 mag release ($3)

TruGrip, and might try out some A-Grip in the off season (unless I hear a resounding "NO!") ($25)

BT DOH holster ($65)

2 more hicap mags ($40)

Heine SlantPro sights ($50)

Possibly a Wolff Reduced Power Striker Spring...

And lots more ammo

I don't want this to sound mean, but from reading your comments I have to scratch my head wondering about a couple of things because it looks like a common path you're heading down. First things first, have you shot a G17 and/or a G34 before?...and by that I mean at least a couple hundred rounds. If you haven't and you're trying to decide by looking at them and listening to what other people say, you're doing yourself a disservice. I'm not sure if it's just the slide lightening or the extra length, but the 34s/35s feel totally different to me....I suspect it's a bit of both.

Second, have you shot any of the the other top contenders like the XD and M&P? If not, again, you're doing yourself a disservice. It's possible you may like one of them a lot more than anything you "think" you like right now. I say think because it's easy to look at guns in stores and online and think you know what will work best for you. I bought a G22 ages ago (before there was a 34/35) because I'd shot them a bit and it was what I thought I wanted for a Production gun....oops...didn't work for me at all.

There are a number of factors that should come into play here.....none of them being gun color First, what gun fits your hand the best? Second, which version of that gun lets you shoot the best (this might change as you get better)...in other words, does the extra sight radius of one version help you more than any advantage a shorter, quicker gun offers? Third, do you know what caliber will serve you better? .40 has become increasingly popular because the larger hole sometimes gives you the next higher scoring zone and, loaded to the same power factor shoots softer. Brass cost is nearly identical now and the only real downside is that the bullets are a bit more expensive.

Those are questions that are often best answered with the help of the folks at your local club...pretty good chance someone has what you're interested in and will be happy to let you give it a test drive. Heck, one of our members just lent me a custom single stack in .40 to help me make a caliber decision....hard to beat that for figuring out what you want/need. R,

[Dave Gundry]

Thanks for your concern Bart. Some of your comments are very, very warranted, and some points I've got covered. I know I am heading down an often traveled, and often wrong, path. My issue is that there really is not clear 'correct' path. I know I have nearly no idea what works best for me, and neither does anyone else. What's the worse thing that happens - I realize I don't like the gun, sell it and the affiliated accessories for a ~$200 hit? Wouldn't be the first time I've done it Unfortunately, the only clear path seems to reside somewhere along the road of 'we learn by doing'.

Too poor to shoot anything but 22lr and 9mm right now (college student) - so that pretty much limits me to minor scoring, which limits me to Production (or just playing around in Limited, which I'll still do occasionally, but with my Witness) - so 40's out for now.

I live in a fairly small town. One LGS sells handguns, the other doesn't stock any. The LGS doesn't even have a 17 in stock. The only one I have had my hands on is a friend's gun that is letting me borrow it. I have handled a 35, and would think it'd be fairly similar to a 34 in terms of weight and handling. I have not shot either, or any Glock for that matter. That will change on Friday when I go put ~100rnds through this 17.

Basically boils down to the fact that I cannot even look at most of the options out there without traveling long distances or waiting for the mediocre shows to come around. I don't regularly shoot with a lot of other folks, and being that it is currently deer hunting season, and will be very, very cold for the next 5 months, I probably won't get much of a chance to see many other decent shooters (or guns) at the clubs.

While I'd love to shoot as many of the options I can, it's just simply impossible for me to do so in my current position. Heck, even if I had the time to run around, I've never heard of shop in MN with a shoot before you buy policy...

I have taken a peek at the M&P and the XD's. They feel ok to me, just like the Glock feels ok (nothing feels as good as a CZ/Tanfoglio to me). All seem to be great Production guns. But, after field stripping them all, I'm loving the Glock. Being an engineering major, I really, really get a kick out of simple engineering that WORKS. All the guns I've gotten rid of have been crappy designs from the get-go, and all the ones I've kept have been great. Part of why I love guns is that they are machines, not just tools to accomplish a task. A better machine always gives me the warm fuzzies.

Color - while yes, it should not be a primary concern, it is a factor. There simply isn't a large enough difference in the 34 or 17 that I can tell without putting a few hundred down the tubes of each to make a decision on at this point. After reading for hours about what folks that have had both models think about them, it seems even after shooting them, lots of folks would agree with my assumption, or at least admit the difference is negligible. When buying a car, all things being nearly identical except color, what do you do? Pick the one you like better

[G-ManBart]

Thanks for your concern Bart. Some of your comments are very, very warranted, and some points I've got covered. I know I am heading down an often traveled, and often wrong, path. My issue is that there really is not clear 'correct' path. I know I have nearly no idea what works best for me, and neither does anyone else. What's the worse thing that happens - I realize I don't like the gun, sell it and the affiliated accessories for a ~$200 hit? Wouldn't be the first time I've done it Unfortunately, the only clear path seems to reside somewhere along the road of 'we learn by doing'.

Too poor to shoot anything but 22lr and 9mm right now (college student) - so that pretty much limits me to minor scoring, which limits me to Production (or just playing around in Limited, which I'll still do occasionally, but with my Witness) - so 40's out for now.

I live in a fairly small town. One LGS sells handguns, the other doesn't stock any. The LGS doesn't even have a 17 in stock. The only one I have had my hands on is a friend's gun that is letting me borrow it. I have handled a 35, and would think it'd be fairly similar to a 34 in terms of weight and handling. I have not shot either, or any Glock for that matter. That will change on Friday when I go put ~100rnds through this 17.

Basically boils down to the fact that I cannot even look at most of the options out there without traveling long distances or waiting for the mediocre shows to come around. I don't regularly shoot with a lot of other folks, and being that it is currently deer hunting season, and will be very, very cold for the next 5 months, I probably won't get much of a chance to see many other decent shooters (or guns) at the clubs.

While I'd love to shoot as many of the options I can, it's just simply impossible for me to do so in my current position. Heck, even if I had the time to run around, I've never heard of shop in MN with a shoot before you buy policy...

I have taken a peek at the M&P and the XD's. They feel ok to me, just like the Glock feels ok (nothing feels as good as a CZ/Tanfoglio to me). All seem to be great Production guns. But, after field stripping them all, I'm loving the Glock. Being an engineering major, I really, really get a kick out of simple engineering that WORKS. All the guns I've gotten rid of have been crappy designs from the get-go, and all the ones I've kept have been great. Part of why I love guns is that they are machines, not just tools to accomplish a task. A better machine always gives me the warm fuzzies.

Color - while yes, it should not be a primary concern, it is a factor. There simply isn't a large enough difference in the 34 or 17 that I can tell without putting a few hundred down the tubes of each to make a decision on at this point. After reading for hours about what folks that have had both models think about them, it seems even after shooting them, lots of folks would agree with my assumption, or at least admit the difference is negligible. When buying a car, all things being nearly identical except color, what do you do? Pick the one you like better

That clears up a lot and makes good sense to me. Trust me, I know all about being a college student while trying to get started in USPSA shooting. Ages ago I used to load .38 Super with hard cast bullets by clamping my Dillon to the coffee table in the apartment I shared with two roomates....loaded ammo while watching TV in the living room....lol....those were good times, but hard on the wallet and it really sucked scraping the lead out of the comp and off the scope lens after every match!

I'd think that without the the opportunity to do any side-by-side comparisons, the 17 or 34 would be an easy choice to make. It's not like you'd end up with a bad gun and if you do decide to change later, you won't really lose all that much. As someone that carries Glocks, and trusts them, I don't have any issues with them other than that they don't fit me very well....to the point of being painful. I absolutely have no problems putting bullets on target with them and they run like a champ, all of which is primary. When I pick up an XD I think "yeah, that's a little better" but when I pick up the M&P it's like "wow, that's way better". If you're not getting that sort of reaction, it makes your choice that much easier as you can get the Glock a lot cheaper, I'm sure.

It would be really cool if you could find someone with a 34 to try, but in the beginning there's a lot more stuff that will make a difference than the gun so I wouldn't lose any sleep over it either way. Don't worry...if you get the OD you can always get Ion Bond done on it after you get tired of people making fun of your gun (J/K)

Edit to add: PS: PM me about the Tru-Grip tape with mailing info...it'll work on either the 17 or 34 as the grip is the same.

Edited November 2, 2007 by G-ManBart

[Bryan W]

I've used the top of the line custom trigger.

I've used the Wolff and Glockmeister extra power trigger springs.

I've used the lighter striker springs.

I now use factory internals - just polished them up. For me it was just a reliability/no hassle issue - keep it simple Steve.

Sights - two favorites: Heinie Slant Pro rear, with Dawson FO front - or Warren Competition fixed sights (black on black).

Get an extended mag release from the G34.

Get the 3.5 connector from the G34.

Avoid extended slide release - just gets in the way at the most inopportune time.

Grip tape, Tru-grip - used both - good stuff, but I've gone to just using rosin bag to keep hands dry/improve grip

Holster - UM is fine, my favorite is Kytac Sooper Hooper - kept banging my thumb on the BT DOH, but it's a good one too.

CR Speed inner/outer belt, and mag pouches are really tough to beat.

Good idea to get backup parts for trigger spring, striker spring, striker, magazine spring, spring cups (easy to lose), pins, slide release, recoil rod/spring...all will break at some point and it will put your mind at ease to know you've got backups in the bag in case something does break at a match. Go to Lone Wolf Dist, make yourself a pick list from the frame & slide diagrams.

Be sure to have fun!

I think Steve nailed it....

[eerw]

and especially get that little spring and the little plastic part that puts tension on the depressor rod that holds the extractor..

those go who knows where if you are not careful taking off that back plate...

[Nemo]

<snip> When I pick up an XD I think "yeah, that's a little better" but when I pick up the M&P it's like "wow, that's way better".<snip>

+1

[98sr20ve]

When I pick up an XD I think "yeah, that's a little better" but when I pick up the M&P it's like "wow, that's way better". If you're not getting that sort of reaction, it makes your choice that much easier as you can get the Glock a lot cheaper, I'm sure.

Welcome to my personal HELL. I 'like' the Glock 35, got to briefly shoot a nicely tuned G35. Sweet gun. But when I fondle a M&P I love the way it just feels. No one I know competes or owns a M&P full size. I like the sight radius of the G34/35 (older eyes prefer it). So I am stuck.

I do think you can get a M&P for way less then a Glock. Buds has them in the low $400 range, S&W is giving $50 rebates and two free magazines. It's documented how to do a good trigger job yourself and sights for either brand or the same basic cost.

I "think" a young guy might prefer the 17 once they get better. I know the 19 and 34 feel very different (brother has a 19 and I don't have the love for it). I really liked my brief introduction to the G35 but like the OP I want a 9mm for ammo cost alone.

Good luck with your choice.

[sslav]

BT lists 2 different models for the 17 vs the 34. Since the trigger guard stops it from dropping further, the 34 holster should work for a 17.

I have a G19 DOH from Bladetech. It fits 19,17,22,34 & 35 just fine. The bottom is open so the additional length does not matter.

Slav