IronEqualizer Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 I use a velcro strap around my gun and holster to insure it does not get bumped and fall out when I am doing range chores and basically anytime I am not on the line. This weekend an RO told me that if I have a strap around the gun at the walkthrough then I was supposed to have it on before the start signal. This strap is not attached to the holster in any way, it is around the gun and holster. 5.2.5.3 says if it is attached it must used before the start signal. This RO said that some other ROs, especially at major matches, would force me to wear the strap at the start signal. I would like to clear this rule up. If I use it do I have to have it in place at STANBY? I use this for safety and peace of mind that I do not accidently drop my gun when pasting, setting steel etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Well there does seem to be an old rule from the dark ages of the sport about thumb straps having to be used, but we don't apply it to race holsters and "safety straps" or other gizmos that keep guns from falling out - its not in the rules, its just sort of understood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerba Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 I use a velcro strap around my gun and holster to insure it does not get bumped and fall out when I am doing range chores and basically anytime I am not on the line. This weekend an RO told me that if I have a strap around the gun at the walkthrough then I was supposed to have it on before the start signal. This strap is not attached to the holster in any way, it is around the gun and holster. 5.2.5.3 says if it is attached it must used before the start signal. This RO said that some other ROs, especially at major matches, would force me to wear the strap at the start signal. I would like to clear this rule up. If I use it do I have to have it in place at STANBY? I use this for safety and peace of mind that I do not accidently drop my gun when pasting, setting steel etc. I had this conversation with a shooter last week. He had the strap and I asked him about it. He said he went through the same scrutiny at one of the nats. The ruling was that the strap was not attached to the holster. If it is NOT attached to the holster, you do not have to use it. Technically, you can take it off and put it in your back pocket. A lot of people use the gun cover during the walk through and what not. They don't have to use those at "Standby." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Baier Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 IMO, if the a holster has a strap attached to it it must be used. I see no problem if you are using a tie down strap as long as you can remove the strap before or during the load and make ready command. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RePete Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 If it is attached to the holster, then yes it must be used. You're using it for a wrap around safety strap, then you're good to go without it at the beep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ima45dv8 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 That was me. I've never used one, but have always felt that the language about it being *attached* is a little vague and might lend itself to some controversy when the shooting is trying to get their mojo together. My recommendation was to remove it just before going to the line if at a match where it could be an issue. I admit I only have this concern because of having met one or two overly zealous ROs, and I'd hate to see anyone have to engage in that debate just as they were getting ready to start a CoF. Even if you win, you lose. (Nice to meet you this weekend, Alan!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toowide Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 If it is attached to the holster, then yes it must be used.You're using it for a wrap around safety strap, then you're good to go without it at the beep. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusher Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 I never use to use a "walk around strap" on a Safariland 012 UNTIL, at an area match a while backI was bumped (right in the magwell) from on overly enthuisiastic shooter who wanted to paste so badly that as soon as the range was called clear by the CRO. I stepped back to pick up a mag and the "paster boy" nailed my hangun and it went sailing. Then we had to YELL for the CRO who wanted to score to do his thing so I could move, I was as stiff as a granite statue untill the CRO placed the handgun back in the holster. Now I use one all the time and have never been questioned when it comes off at the LMAR and goes back on at "Range Clear" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wide45 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Rule 5.2.5.3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ima45dv8 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Like I said, I don't use one, but I'm glad to hear I may have been overly cautious in my concerns (in case I ever do get one). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pskys2 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 The "Old Rule" was: 1) If a safety device is "Part" of a holster it must be used. 2) If a safety device is needed to "Pass" the Holster Test it must be used. You're saying if someone puts a raincap over their Open Gun to keep dust out then they have to start the match with it? If you really want to get picky start coming down on competitors who twirl their retention knobs as they attain the start stance. Bet they wouldn't pass the old 2' jump with the 180 degree turn, or the roll over backwards test. But then those things aren't even done anymore. Some wear Belts & Suspenders, ya know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ima45dv8 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 You're saying if someone puts a raincap over their Open Gun to keep dust out then they have to start the match with it? No, that absolutely is not what I suggested. The question was about retainging straps, and I've been shown the light. Raincaps have nothing to do with retaining straps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LPatterson Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 For those of you using retainers or dust covers, the time to remove them is before entering the start position & before LMR. If the gun falls out then the RO & RO only gets to pick it up before you can continue. If after LMR & before RIC the gun falls out of the holster then you are done for the match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronEqualizer Posted June 26, 2007 Author Share Posted June 26, 2007 That was me. I've never used one, but have always felt that the language about it being *attached* is a little vague and might lend itself to some controversy when the shooting is trying to get their mojo together. My recommendation was to remove it just before going to the line if at a match where it could be an issue. I admit I only have this concern because of having met one or two overly zealous ROs, and I'd hate to see anyone have to engage in that debate just as they were getting ready to start a CoF. Even if you win, you lose. (Nice to meet you this weekend, Alan!) Hey Mark nice to meet you too. Looks as though you had a pretty good match. I was doing pretty well until I left my brain in my range bag for that 1 stage. I just wanted to get the rule cleared up. Hope I haven't caused you to catch any flac over this. I'll see you at the next match or South River in August. Thanks again for ROing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe4d Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Well it's a place for opinions, and most will disagree but I am gonna talk about the elephant in the room, If your holster needs an extra strap to securley hold the gun in you need another holster or should have to start with the strap on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ima45dv8 Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 That was me. I've never used one, but have always felt that the language about it being *attached* is a little vague and might lend itself to some controversy when the shooting is trying to get their mojo together. My recommendation was to remove it just before going to the line if at a match where it could be an issue. I admit I only have this concern because of having met one or two overly zealous ROs, and I'd hate to see anyone have to engage in that debate just as they were getting ready to start a CoF. Even if you win, you lose. (Nice to meet you this weekend, Alan!) Hey Mark nice to meet you too. Looks as though you had a pretty good match. I was doing pretty well until I left my brain in my range bag for that 1 stage. I just wanted to get the rule cleared up. Hope I haven't caused you to catch any flac over this. I'll see you at the next match or South River in August. Thanks again for ROing. No flack on my end. I'm glad you brought this up here, since it's the best place to get good answers to questions like these. See you soon.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LPatterson Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Well it's a place for opinions, and most will disagree but I am gonna talk about the elephant in the room, If your holster needs an extra strap to securely hold the gun in you need another holster or should have to start with the strap on it. Since not all holsters come with a locking device like a Ghost & others. What you are really saying is that I should get rid of my Safariland 011 which holds the gun fine unless it is bumped up & out or I should just quit taping & picking up brass where my gun could get knocked out. I guess I could become a Prima Donna & just everyone else work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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