Shooting Open To Improve Your Limited Game

[Zerwas]

Not sure if this has been covered before, if it has I apologize.

I was thinking about switching to the open division this year (for a change of pace).

I shot in the limited division the last 2 years and I've bumped up a bit from when I started.

I love my limited gun and shooting limited is fun, but, I have an open gun that is calling my name. I'd like to see what I could do with it. I was able to use it in a special classifier match last spring and I am now classified with it. In the words of Bill Murray "...so at least I got that goin' for me, which is nice".

My fear is, if I go to the open division I might mess up my limited game. After talking with a couple of guys at last years limited nationals, they suggested I go for the open division because it'll make my limited game that much faster. They said it would allow me to speed up my transitions because I wouldn't have to concentrate on the sites so much...

I'm trying to decide what to do for next year, and quite frankly, I'm having a tough time trying to decide which way to go.

I have already earned a spot to next years limited nationals, and I don't want to mess myself up for that event. Yet, if shooting in open will trully make my limited game faster, then,,,what the heck. aaaarrrrrgggghhhhhhh.

Any help would be appreciated.

[uscbigdawg]

Shooting Open WILL help your Limited game. Basically, the simplicity of everything and the muzzle flip control will help with your shot calling and sight tracking. Meaning, with less going on, you will have the chance to see what's going on in front of you that much better (i.e. sight location at the point of ignition, sights lifting, sights returning, etc.).

This can easily then transfer over to the Limited gun. Yes, there will be more of it, but at least now you'll know what you need to be looking for.

Rich

[Chris Keen]

.......... but don't be surprised if it dosent "take" right away when switching back to Limited. It will take a short amount of time before you say "Oh now I understand". It does sink in ..... just not immediately.

Of course everyone is different.

YMMV

[Flexmoney]

The things that I've noticed that you need to watch for...

- When shooters pick up the Open gun, they magically expect their performance to make an improvement.

- After shooting Open for a time, they have trouble remembering the Limited gun has a front sight. They continue shooting (poorly) with a target focus.

Avoid those pitfalls and you should have some fun.

[blkbrd]

Shooting open has sped up my limited game, the hard part for me when transitioning is remembering the limited gun has a REAR sight and not to shoot the dot from my front sight.

Lots of the going fast is realizing just what fast is and how fast you really can go. Open will open your eyes as to what pure speed really is, its neat going back to a limited gun or a Glock and thinking the slide is moving in slow motion.

[warpspeed]

What really helped me was shooting a revolver all summer. I started out shooting it like I had been shooting my open gun and found out what areas I need to improve very quickly. Now that I've started shooting open again, my accuracy has picked up significantly. Last match was a clean one - no mikes, no NS's.

I think that switching platforms for a period of time can help you see things differently. It is up to you to recognize the areas that need improvement and act accordingly.

[Matt Cheely]

If you really want to get better, do it. But you have to commit to the open gun for at least a season, no switching back and forth. It will take you many months to get used to the open gun and start the real learning from it.

[PaulW]

Limited guns have rear sites? No wonder.......

[38superman]

Steven,

It's interesting that you brought this up because I have been thinking about the same thing.

Not so much to improve my limited shooting, but I recently bought a Pro Sx and I'd like to spend some quality time with it.

I went back to lim10 and shot it all of the past year.

The idea was to force myself to think a little harder about breaking down the stages and work on reloads.

It seems to have helped.

Now the dilemma is whether to go back to limited and work on my A card or jump into Open.

I sure would like to make A in limited and I think it is within my reach this year.

I know that it will take a while to get up to speed in open and the idea of taking a step backward right now feels a little hard to swallow.

Maybe I'll just stick with limited and play around a bit with the open gun.

That way I could get real comfortable with the Brazos before I make another division switch.

On the other hand, why did I spend all that money for an open gun if I wasn't going to compete with it?

But then again.........

Arrrrrrrgggggghh. +1

Why do I do this to myself?

Decisions, decisions.

Tony L Shores

P.S. Let me know what you decide.

Edited December 5, 2006 by tlshores

[blkbrd]

We buy a new toy=We shoot more?

We shoot more=we get better.

He who dies with the most toys wins.

Edited December 5, 2006 by blkbrd

[HSMITH]

My Open gun should be done in time for the early spring matches and I am going to shoot Open at least most of next season. I am on the edge of A in Limited, unclassified in Open, and don't care that I am taking a step back by switching guns. The Open shooting and classification will catch up when they catch up.

I practiced with a dot sighted 22 for a while this summer and it DOES make a difference, it helped my Limited shooting for sure. Knowing that I am jumping in with both feet.

[38superman]

This discussion brings into focus something that bears closer scrutiny.

I often hear shooters say you are better off to pick a gun and a division and stick with it.

I wonder if the multiple GM's and Masters got there by sticking with a division and then branching out after they made it to the top.

Perhaps they bounced around and tried to advance their skills across mulitple platforms until they were proficient with them all.

Does proficiency in one division automatically create proficiency in another?

The rules would seem to support that theory since advancment in one division drags your classification up in others.

This begs the question:

If being competitive in multiple divisions is your long term goal, are you hurting or helping your cause by "division jumping"?

Hmm.... This could make for some intersting discussion.

I think I'll break it out into it's own thread.

Tls

Edited December 6, 2006 by tlshores

[XRe]

If being competitive in multiple divisions is your long term goal, are you hurting or helping your cause by "division jumping"?

At the start, you're hurting it, I think... You need consistency. You need less things on your mind about the mechanics of what you're doing, and such, so that you can focus on various skills. After you achieve some success, and have developed the basics and are well into advanced skills - movement, strategy, etc - switching platforms can help you further solidify the basics, and help you experience them in a different way (the greatest difference being, obviously, to switch between Open and an iron sight gun).

After having played in L-10 for a year, and then switching back to Open, I feel pretty strongly that you can shorten your learning curve on the advanced topics by shooting a hi-cap gun of some form. That gives you the ability to focus more completely on advanced skills, without having to do a reload every 8 shots or so. Shoot a hi-cap (Open or Limited) for a while, then switch *back* to a 10 or 8 round division, and you'll see a big gain (which, as has already been mentioned, will need you to shoot in the "new" division for a while before it fully materializes).

[CenTX]

Shooting open has sped up my limited game, the hard part for me when transitioning is remembering the limited gun has a REAR sight and not to shoot the dot from my front sight.

+1

[mike4045]

I switched to open last year and have thought about changing back to limited. Shooting open is so much fun that I hate to put it down. When I have played with the lim gun it feels so much faster. Everything flows so much easier now. I finally got my scores up high enough to move to B. I have even shot a few IDPA matches with the dot gun. I really like to just burn thru a stage without any cares, just to see how fast I can shoot it.

Mike

[Steve Moneypenny]

It really depends on your goals as a toatal, Getting used to open takes a lot of time, can you put the time into it and sacrafice a season to get there? open is not something that just happens, it takes a lot of work. but the dot and light trigger and lack of a reload allows you to focus more on your movement, and "speed" as some are referring to the shifting of focus off of what is happening at your gun.

Honestly if your definitley shooting Limited in 2007 nats..... buy plenty of ammo for you rlimited gun, and maybe a big stick and shoot open at local matches with it. I personally could not get used to an open gun in the 6 months i tried. BUT when going back to production i had improved.

[Zerwas]

It really depends on your goals as a toatal, Getting used to open takes a lot of time, can you put the time into it and sacrafice a season to get there? open is not something that just happens, it takes a lot of work. but the dot and light trigger and lack of a reload allows you to focus more on your movement, and "speed" as some are referring to the shifting of focus off of what is happening at your gun.

Honestly if your definitley shooting Limited in 2007 nats..... buy plenty of ammo for you rlimited gun, and maybe a big stick and shoot open at local matches with it. I personally could not get used to an open gun in the 6 months i tried. BUT when going back to production i had improved.

Thanks for the info Steve. I should qualify my opening remarks and questions with:

When I shot the open gun in the special classifier match, I ended up classifying as an M shooter.

I am an M shooter in limited as well.

The ability to concentrate on the movements I guess is what I was referring too. I understand that will help all with all of the other divisions. I keep going back and forth with the thought of running with it. AARRGGGHHH I wish I could just make up my mind, and I had better soon as the season is fast approaching.

[Zerwas]

I've decided on what I'm going to do. I'm shooting SS and limited the first half of the year. I'll be switching to open a month before the area 5 match. I think I'm gunna run with it then for the following year (2008).

At least I believe so. I think so. That is the plan anyway. We'll see what happes after I hear the BEEEEEEEP of the timer..haha

[Mick]

I learned a big lesson shooting Open after getting my M card in LTD. JoJo Vidanes responded to an email I sent about trying to get more speed years ago. I earned the M LTD card and switched to Open. JoJo said to cover the far side of the C-More lense with tape or ? so I couldn't see through it. I practiced this way and even shot some stages too. I got my Mcard in Open BUT when I went back to LTD my left eye was now working and I went faster in LTD too. I went to 98% in 3 months!!!!

Your eyes will learn to superimpose between the dot and the target where only one eye can see either. I was impressed and pass this on all the time. It works well with my AR and the Aimpoint as well.

[Chris Spiess]

So, a question that follows for me is should one shoot just Open or just the iron sight divisions and not switch back and forth during the same season? I had planned on shooting production this season, but have wound up with access to an open gun unexpectedly. I am considering shooting production still, but practicing with the open gun as well. Will i be better off just picking one or the other?

[HSMITH]

I have done a little practice shooting with a dot sighted 22 and it helps me for sure. Shooting the open gun would help too I think, even if you are shooting production most of the time. My use showed me things I was not able to see with irons, especially when shooting on the move and shooting in hose mode. The dot movement is a lot easier for me to see and recognize than the front sight movement when doing something wrong.

My open gun is shootable now, and I am going to give it a go! It will be interesting to see where it takes me and teaches me. I don't know what to expect from it, so the ability to start fresh and just see what happens is pretty exciting.

[Nemo]

HERE is my recommendation.

Enjoy!