Cuz Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 I'm looking for a new safe. I'm trying to determine if I need to step up to 3/16" sides or if 10ga walls are strong enough? Also, how much weight is too much for the first floor of a normal New England stick built home approximately 30 years old? I know that's a real hard question to answer, but I'm just wondering if a 1200 pound safe is too much weight for the floor to support. Any help anyone can provide is appreciated. Thanks, Cuz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIIID Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 Cuz, What are the size of the floor joists and will the safe be over or near a support beam/wall? Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMITH Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 Cuz, over on thehighroad.org there are some good discussions on safes with participation from a couple of safe dealers. They discuss ratings, thickness and so on. Covered a TON of things I didn't know about safes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 Pretty much any retail 'gun safe' isn't safe from a pro (a good quote I saw somewhere is "What gun people call safes, safe guys call cute cabinets"). Given that, the wall thickness probably isn't such a big deal - as long as it's a pain to get in using the tools you have on hand, you're probably ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipscbob Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 Pretty much any retail 'gun safe' isn't safe from a pro (a good quote I saw somewhere is "What gun people call safes, safe guys call cute cabinets").Given that, the wall thickness probably isn't such a big deal - as long as it's a pain to get in using the tools you have on hand, you're probably ok. Yup. If someone who knows what they are doing wants in, they will get in. A safe is generally to keep honest people honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Norman Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 As I understand it, all safes are rated as to the time it will take to enter them, even bank vaults are rated in entry time. The average gunsafe is designed to keep your collection safe from your kids friends comming over and deciding to play with your collection. It will likely deter the average smash and grab theif, but anyone that wants in can do it. Good reasons to have a gunsafe include: Keeps the guns out of the hands of unauthorized users, ie, your kids or their frineds. Fire resistance protecttion from smash and grab type burglary Liability, you made a serious attempt to keep your collection from mis-use by the unauthorized. This may just allow you to keep living in the style to which you have become accustomed as opposed to supporting the family of the teen that was injured by the ki that robbed your house. There are safe dealers that sell used commercial grade safes that are both far superior to and less expensive tnat gun safes. They weigh a lot, make that a LOT more than the average gunsafe. As to putting a safe in your home. look at ti this way, you have total load and load per square foot. A 1000 pound safe that is 3 x 4 is 12 sq. ft. or 84 pounds per square foot. A 6-0 tall, 250 pound man with a pair of size 12 shoes load the floor at about 277 pounds per square foot (Size 12's are less than a square foot!) That said, I would place the safe against a wall and if possible over a wall. This will give you the most support. Jim Norman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 Pier & Beam house..? Crawl under there with a few cinderblocks and some 4x4s and shore that puppy up a little where the safe is to sit. $30.00 worth of materials, a friend and a 12 pack should get it done in an hour... of actual work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 As I understand it, all safes are rated as to the time it will take to enter them, even bank vaults are rated in entry time. Well, most safes (there would be a fun job.. rating safes for entry). Some ratings include explosives, most are just for tools.. Gun safes are usually in the 5-minute, no explosives, range, if that. Going higher is usually a waste of $ and steel for most people. Good alarms and secondary security is usually far more cost-effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 Pier & Beam house..? Crawl under there with a few cinderblocks and some 4x4s and shore that puppy up a little where the safe is to sit. $30.00 worth of materials, a friend and a 12 pack should get it done in an hour... of actual work. Merlin, It's not on piers, very few houses in New England don't have a cellar (basement). I still call it a cellar, mine is a dirt floor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cking Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 I like dual lined fire safes. will be harder to cut in through the sides. they usually offer a full hour of fire protection. any quality safe will have a tough door. any quality safe man can open most combo's in less than 20 minutes. You can put it any place in house on ground floor by using a screw jack under it in the basement. by a 24X24X4 in concrete pad, nail three 2X6 together and span the floor beams, snug it up before you locate the safe. if you don't with time it will sag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuz Posted September 20, 2006 Author Share Posted September 20, 2006 Cuz,What are the size of the floor joists and will the safe be over or near a support beam/wall? Rich Floor joists are 2x8 (or more like 1.5x7). Cuz, over on thehighroad.org there are some good discussions on safes with participation from a couple of safe dealers. They discuss ratings, thickness and so on. Covered a TON of things I didn't know about safes. Thanks. I'll check it out. Pier & Beam house..? Crawl under there with a few cinderblocks and some 4x4s and shore that puppy up a little where the safe is to sit. $30.00 worth of materials, a friend and a 12 pack should get it done in an hour... of actual work. Pier & Beam??? Here in New England we have good old fashioned basements. In fact, the basement under where I want to put the safe is already finished so I won't be able to support it with a jack support either. Thanks for all the info. After reading thru the replies I now agree that extra money for the 3/16 walls is not worth it. Better to put the money into fire protection. Then I can also keep valuable photos and other documents in the safe as well. I'll go with 10ga. Also, I went looking thru my basement and found that in one corner of the room I've selected there is a beam running under the floor joists that should provide extra support to help prevent sagging. It wasn't my first choice location but I think it will work out ok. Thanks, -Cuz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ima45dv8 Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 Thanks for all the info. After reading thru the replies I now agree that extra money for the 3/16 walls is not worth it. Better to put the money into fire protection. Fire protection is provided by sheetrock. Pull back the liner on a fire rated safe and that's what you'll find. Might make it worthwhile to get the 3/16 and stop by Home Depot for wallboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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