Fast Draws

[Larrys1911]

Guy over on 1911 forums is talking **** about .3 to .5 draws on a 10 foot tgt from a Timer Beep.  I was just wondering what kind of times you guys have actually seen IRL!

My fastest Draw to date from an IDPA legal rig unconcealed 7yds was .83  Gottem in the Crotch!

I think this guy is full of it, Matt B. told him he thought he was but the thread was closed! I dont want to start a pissing contest but he said .5s were EASY!

http://www.1911forum.com/forums/showthread...;threadid=26442

Just wondering!

Larry P

(Edited by Larrys1911 at 10:04 pm on Sep. 23, 2002)

[Jake Di Vita]

Perhaps he was speaking of .5 from a retention position. That is not unheard of, although still smokin. As for a .5 sight picture and A hit from our conventional IPSC and IDPA draws, I'd like to see him do it.

(Edited by TheItlianStalion at 7:20 pm on Sep. 21, 2002)

[down0]

.5?  Studly times are near a second.  BE or other masters of the universe probably run under a second.  But .5?  Methinks not.

[Ron Ankeny]

My best times from IPSC gear run around .85 if I just let it rip, from surrender. My par draw in matches is much slower at around 1.1 to 1.2 on fairly close targets and 1.7 on tight or distant shots. I am an A class USPSA shooter and "low" master IDPA.

The fastest that I have seen (I was running the timer myself) was .65 by another forum member. He is a Limited Master and very fast. It's rare for this guy to take much more than .9 out to about ten yards, even on steel.

[38supPat]

I once (ONCE) had a witnessed .48 (another shooter was running the timer)...and have never come close to it since, most at 3 to 5 yds run .65

But thats with a speed holster, warmed up ready to rock.

From concealment or tactical gear, I'll bet on it being a big pile of CRAP

As Matt said, If he could do it, we'd all know his name

(Edited by Pat Harrison at 9:06 pm on Sep. 21, 2002)

[A33435]

I am not the fastest for sure and a moderate shooter in the netherlands.

The fastest draws i could make thusfare are

1.10 for 15 yards targets

1.22 for El Presidente

0.85 for 7 yards targets

Overhere there are also STORYS about people you never see at the range, never heart of there names before but from hear say they should be the best.

I always say, seeing is believing and mostly the best shooters you'll find on top of the list.

[John Dunn]

Unless this guy is Bob Munden, I'd have to see it to believe it.  Personal best: 5 yards, hands at side, any hit on a regulation IPSC target counts, thoroughly warmed up, was .73.  My practice buddy turned in a .71 on the next draw, and this "record" for the two of us has remained for quite some time now.  Cold shot and caring about hitting more than just anywhere on the target and my times are around 1.4.

Just call me pokey.

[Bigbadaboom]

What is really sad is that the guy isn't smart enough to realize that Matt B. could start hand-cuffed behind the back and still out-draw him. To bad the thread was closed.

(Edited by Bigbadaboom at 5:59 pm on Sep. 22, 2002)

[shred]

A long long while ago, somebody was blathering on about how they could draw and kick out one of those "Glock Blocks" in some unbelievable time.

After a bit of mucking about I sorted out how they did it-- they redefine "draw" to "start with a full grip on the gun". At the timer, yank it out and go to town. Point-shot 0.5's aren't hard like that.

[mcoliver]

Ok guys I have two questions:

1. In sub second draws, is the gun at eye level or chest level but with an A-hit?  (Can somebody actually do this with an Uncle Mikes kydex holster?...ok 3 q's )

2. When you're smooth, you're fast (but you feel like you're taking your time, right?) So how do you tell when you're smooth and not just dragging your feet?

(Edited by mcoliver at 11:42 pm on Sep. 22, 2002)

[Flexmoney]

1.  The gun is in the full position.  Yes, it can be done out of Kydex UM.

2.  The timer tells the story.  Tension kills speed.

[down0]

Let me modify my first response.  I was speaking from an IDPA perspective, as that is what I usually shoot.  The times I mentioned are from concealment with hands at sides.  I am but a sharpshooter, so my best times are 1.2ish.  However, I have SO'd the IDPA Nationals and several State matches, and have had the pleasure of running some of the fastest shooters on the planet.  I have seen very, very few draws of less than 1 second.    And believe me, when the Leatham's and Sevigny's of the world come through, I check their draw times and their splits.....wouldn't you?  

[Duane Thomas]

"1. In sub second draws, is the gun at eye level or chest level but with an A-hit?  (Can somebody actually do this with an Uncle Mikes kydex holster?"

Sure. Even I can do this on occasion, and I'm just A-class in USPSA, Expert in IDPA. It's not that hard.

[Larrys1911]

Yes it can be done from an Uncle Mikes rig.

Thats what I use for IDPA, I like the position it puts the gun in!  My fastest, the aforementioned .83, was from a UM!

There is a WORLD of difference between a .8 and a .5 though and a HUGE difference  from there to .3!  For "ME" anyway since about 2/3 of that would be my reaction time ! High .9s and low 1.0s are the norm at 7 for me!

Ive run a speedrock at a arms length tgt just screwing around and had a .7? but I was screwing around and I dont know if I could repeat it!  and Trying for .3 would just put a bullet in the ground......or uh ME!

keep practicing, the ones will come!  

Down0, are you SOing this year?  

(Edited by Larrys1911 at 10:29 pm on Sep. 23, 2002)

[mcoliver]

You guys are scaring me...okay, I'll take a step back for a while and breath....I'd just like to make one thing clear, these sub-second draws from kydex rigs can be done on demand? at 7-10 yards?

Now, I just did this excercise last weekend and the best I can do with my glock was around .8-.9 A-hit in 3 yrds. But I was more like point shooting the gun around my chest level (20 draws all A's...a little to the left.)  Can't say the same with my 1911, maybe because of the weight, maybe because I still need to practice alot...I'm trying to find out.  Did a couple of those reaction time exercises and I usually start with .20-.23 the first few tries then hover around .17-.19.  I'm losing time somewhere...maybe I need to take 5 steps back.

[Duane Thomas]

I do most of my practice at 10 yards. My "personal best" was an A-hit in .90 second. Honesty does compel me to admit I don't always fire As and normally we're looking at times in the 1.1s and 1.2s.

(Edited by Duane Thomas at 8:44 pm on Sep. 23, 2002)

[Larrys1911]

Be Afraid, BE VERY AFRAID!  

You can do it, all it takes is "TIME"

DO more PRACTICE!!

[Steve Anderson]

I once heard GSSF matches referred to as the match with no draw, as I beleive it's all from low ready. (could be wrong)

If that's the case, folks telling gssf stories would revert to calling the first shot "the draw" by default.

Munden starts with hand alomost on the gun, and the timer starts when he does. Not the other way around. Impressive, but apples/oranges.

Interesting sidenote. I'm faster from a draw than from low ready. Figure that out...

Current best ever is .79 at 5 yards from surrender. Production rig.

Last night, bianchi plates at 10 yds, 1.28 consistent.

[shred]

I think we discussed this elsewhere, but super-speedy draws aren't as big a deal as we usually make them out to be. I'm usually in the 1.3 range for IPSC-type draws and I'm doing OK in A-open.

[Larrys1911]

Quote: from Steve Anderson on 7:06 am on Sep. 24, 2002

Interesting sidenote. I'm faster from a draw than from low ready. Figure that out...

1st your right its not  as big a deal as everyone thinks! COOL though!

2nd, glad Im not the lone stranger on the low ready thing!

Must be that I never practice that!

Try bringing your gun back to your body then Punch it out like the last part of your draw!

Larry P

[Bigbadaboom]

  Shred is 100% on this. All the good IPSC shooters that I talk to, by good I mean Master or above, tell me that draw time is not as important as people make it out to be and that it is much more important to make sure your grip is right and your hit is good because a .9 C hit adds up to about a 1.3 A hit. I doen't even work on draw times any more. I only work on makeing sure I have my grip when I come out of my holster and my sights are on the A zone and since I changed to practiceing this way my draw times have lowered. I'm a B class Limited shooter and my draws @ 10 yds. and closer are usually around 1.1-1.2, 1.2-1.4 @ 10-20yds. and so on depending on no-shoot placement of course

[benos]

I've seen The Great One and Tawn Argeris "hit" a target at 10 feet in under .5 secs. But it is kind of frightening.

[Ron Ankeny]

I pity the poor fool who yells. "GET DOWN" in Tawn's lunch room.

[down0]

I will be SO'ing this year, and I am really looking forward to it, almost as much as shooting.....call me strange....

[Duane Thomas]

"Munden starts with hand alomost on the gun, and the timer starts when he does. Not the other way around. Impressive, but...."

I knew the bit about "almost touching the gun." The rules in quick draw say only that you can't be touching the gun. The technique of choice is to grip the gun in the holster and then just relax your hand enough that it's not touching the gun butt - you've got a tiny fraction of an inch of air between your hand and the butt.

But I didn't know that "the timer starts when he does" thing. You're telling me we should add the timer guy's reaction time to any "impressive" draw times Munden posts? Jesus wept. If I could do that in IPSC, those sub-second draws wouldn't come hard at all.