Revolver bullet profile

[Pseudonym]

I have always used round nose bullets when I used to shoot in revolver, in competition. Due to some difficulty in getting various loading components I was contemplating trying some spire tip bullets. I recall someone taking about it in a thread in this forum probably 15 years ago, but I can't find it, most everything has been archived and is not searchable.  Anyone tried any spire tips(Not flat points) in their moon-clip guns? 

Edited December 21, 2022 by Pseudonym

[Bill Sahlberg]

I used 130 gr RN Montana Gold bullets for years and just switched recently to their 124 gr JHPs and found they load faster with a conical profile over the RN!

[pskys2]

Carmoney used the mg 142 ifp and had no problems.

[Pseudonym]

7 minutes ago, pskys2 said:

Carmoney used the mg 142 ifp and had no problems.

I recall Mike posting many moons ago about using a 90ish grain MG bullet in 9mm I do not recall the profile. I do not think a spire point bullet would be an issue if the OAL is short enough to avoid binding, if that makes any sense. 

[pskys2]

15 hours ago, Pseudonym said:

I recall Mike posting many moons ago about using a 90ish grain MG bullet in 9mm I do not recall the profile. I do not think a spire point bullet would be an issue if the OAL is short enough to avoid binding, if that makes any sense. 

He used a 9mm 90 grain for s s, 1911.  His revolver load was a 142 ifp, don't think they offer it anymore.

[gargoil66]

Wouldn't have believed it but here you go.  https://www.steinelammo.com/product/357-magnum-125gr-spire-point-rnfp-copy/

 

Yes, I know these aren't for our purposes but in all my years casting bullets, buying cast bullets, shooting cast bullets, I have never seen a spire point cast bullet for handguns so was surprised to find these.

 

I do have some spire point .357 Magnum FMJ though.  Winchester and marked 'Metal Piercing'.  These go back to the 70's.  I bet they don't pierce metal any better than any other .357.

 

If you are independently wealthy, Hornady makes a 140 in .38 that technically is a spire point I believe.  Uses a ballistic Tip.  

 

GG

 

 

 

 

 

 

[superdude]

1 hour ago, gargoil66 said:

Wouldn't have believed it but here you go.  https://www.steinelammo.com/product/357-magnum-125gr-spire-point-rnfp-copy/

 

Those bullets have been around forever. They are in my old Lyman loading manual, circa 1970s.

 

Matts Bullets sells them.

 

https://www.mattsbullets.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=65&products_id=225

[gargoil66]

3 minutes ago, superdude said:

 

Those bullets have been around forever. They are in my old Lyman loading manual, circa 1970s.

 

Matts Bullets sells them.

 

https://www.mattsbullets.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=65&products_id=225

Yes -- sure is!  I think I still have a Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook but probably a later addition.  Would think it almost impossible to get a good fill with that mold unless a guy was using a casting machine.  

 

Would be cool to try some for accuracy at distance though.  Bet they cut a nice clean hole providing the point is about as perfectly formed and centered as humanly possible.  Bad Ju-Ju if that mold and the casting procedure is not really, really, good.

 

May drop the money for some of them just to see how they do.  Good thing about cast bullets is if you buy some that suck, toss them into the next melt.

 

GG

 

 

 

 

 

[10mmdave]

Is this what your looking for ?

www.bangandclang.com

you can get them sized .356, .357 or .358 in weights 115, 145 and 160 grain, other company's go as high as 170 grain.

use a taper crimp 9mm die instead of a roll crimp.

 

(and if this isn't what your looking for sorry for the thread drift)

[Pseudonym]

On 12/19/2022 at 2:01 PM, Bill Sahlberg said:

I used 130 gr RN Montana Gold bullets for years and just switched recently to their 124 gr JHPs and found they load faster with a conical profile over the RN!

I would be concerned with the HP getting caught like a FP if I did not hit the cylinder lined up. I guess I am putting too much thought into it.

[Toolguy]

Anything with a flat part on the end can potentially hang up during a reload. Round nose is still the best choice. Probably the spire points would work well too, never tried them.

[Pseudonym]

1 hour ago, Toolguy said:

Anything with a flat part on the end can potentially hang up during a reload. Round nose is still the best choice. Probably the spire points would work well too, never tried them.

Thanks Warren. Steve from Bear Creek sent me some 130gr .358 to mess with some time back and I did not have any issues getting those in the cylinder from speed loaders. His bullets have a round nose on the point, and are not as severe of a point as the 125gr that were posted above. The bullet I was going to give a try have more of a rifle style ogive to them, longer and sharper point. 

[gargoil66]

1 hour ago, Pseudonym said:

Thanks Warren. Steve from Bear Creek sent me some 130gr .358 to mess with some time back and I did not have any issues getting those in the cylinder from speed loaders. His bullets have a round nose on the point, and are not as severe of a point as the 125gr that were posted above. The bullet I was going to give a try have more of a rifle style ogive to them, longer and sharper point. 

 

PN:

 

Look around and you may find some with a bit of a longer ogive but they won't look like a spire point rifle bullet.  I am a firm believer that a bullet must have a bearing surface at least as long as the bore diameter but no longer than twice the bore diameter.  Lets say a decent .38 bullet has a bearing surface right around .4" to .5".  Not much left for a spitzer tip in the traditional sense unless you want to shoot a really heavy bullet. 

 

Have to ask though.  Why a spitzer profile? 

 

GG

 

[Squirrel45]

2 hours ago, Pseudonym said:

Thanks Warren. Steve from Bear Creek sent me some 130gr .358 to mess with some time back and I did not have any issues getting those in the cylinder from speed loaders. His bullets have a round nose on the point, and are not as severe of a point as the 125gr that were posted above. The bullet I was going to give a try have more of a rifle style ogive to them, longer and sharper point. 

I have good luck running Steve's 170g &150g in my 929 and 627. Blue bullets makes a pretty sharp profile however in the limited time Iv spent with them iv had so so accuracy. 

[Pseudonym]

2 hours ago, Squirrel45 said:

I have good luck running Steve's 170g &150g in my 929 and 627. Blue bullets makes a pretty sharp profile however in the limited time Iv spent with them iv had so so accuracy. 

I am using his 158gr RN in my 38 loads he was out of the 150 & 170 swaged last time I ordered. 

[Pseudonym]

3 hours ago, gargoil66 said:

 

PN:

 

Look around and you may find some with a bit of a longer ogive but they won't look like a spire point rifle bullet.  I am a firm believer that a bullet must have a bearing surface at least as long as the bore diameter but no longer than twice the bore diameter.  Lets say a decent .38 bullet has a bearing surface right around .4" to .5".  Not much left for a spitzer tip in the traditional sense unless you want to shoot a really heavy bullet. 

 

Have to ask though.  Why a spitzer profile? 

 

GG

 

 I have been messing around with .32H&R and .327mag. and to get the bullet weight I want without using a flat-point, I found a .313 spire point bullet.

[Farmer]

15 hours ago, Pseudonym said:

 I have been messing around with .32H&R and .327mag. and to get the bullet weight I want without using a flat-point, I found a .313 spire point bullet.

7.62x39 Rifle bullets?

When you said Spire points for the 357 the first thing that came to mind was the old Speer 170g that guys used for silhouettes. But even that had a flat point on it. 

[Toolguy]

I've been having good luck with Bayou Bullet polymer coated 160 RN, loaded in 38 Short Colt. Several other bullet makers have the same one.

[pskys2]

22 hours ago, Toolguy said:

I've been having good luck with Bayou Bullet polymer coated 160 RN, loaded in 38 Short Colt. Several other bullet makers have the same one.

Bbi also, and they seem to keep more in stock and slightly better pricing.

[Pseudonym]

On 12/22/2022 at 8:37 AM, Farmer said:

7.62x39 Rifle bullets?

When you said Spire points for the 357 the first thing that came to mind was the old Speer 170g that guys used for silhouettes. But even that had a flat point on it. 

Yes 7.62x39 rifle bullets, I think also for a mid war Arisaka rifle as well. I had just asked about spire points for reloads, people thought 38 bullets I guess. I have tried some in 38, but as I had said the ogive is very different. Also found out from reading some of the old handgun silhouette forums that the 32 H&R TC contenders barrels came in both .308 and .313. Ruger used .313 in their GP100's so finding a bullet weight with the profile I am after has been a project.  

[Farmer]

1 hour ago, Pseudonym said:

Yes 7.62x39 rifle bullets, I think also for a mid war Arisaka rifle as well. I had just asked about spire points for reloads, people thought 38 bullets I guess. I have tried some in 38, but as I had said the ogive is very different. Also found out from reading some of the old handgun silhouette forums that the 32 H&R TC contenders barrels came in both .308 and .313. Ruger used .313 in their GP100's so finding a bullet weight with the profile I am after has been a project.  

Yeah I know what you mean. I wanted to find a .313-.314 flat nosed spitzer for my 327 Henry but everything is pointed or very heavy.  Would have to load them one at a time. When they made those bbl’s sized .308 that gave a guy many more options for bullets but I tried loading some into 327 cases and couldn’t get enough neck tension to hold them in place properly, especially for a tube magazine. In a single shot they would work or if a cannalure was in the right place. Was thinking of having LBT make me a mold. 

[gargoil66]

3 hours ago, Farmer said:

Yeah I know what you mean. I wanted to find a .313-.314 flat nosed spitzer for my 327 Henry but everything is pointed or very heavy.  Would have to load them one at a time. When they made those bbl’s sized .308 that gave a guy many more options for bullets but I tried loading some into 327 cases and couldn’t get enough neck tension to hold them in place properly, especially for a tube magazine. In a single shot they would work or if a cannalure was in the right place. Was thinking of having LBT make me a mold. 

Farmer:

 

Take a look at the Accurate Molds catalog.  https://www.accuratemolds.com/  May have 'zakley' what you are looking for.

 

Have found this place to be super responsive.  Within a week of ordering I normally have the mold.

 

Have a number of LBT molds too and they are also quality.

 

GG

 

 

[Farmer]

On 12/24/2022 at 2:45 PM, gargoil66 said:

Farmer:

 

Take a look at the Accurate Molds catalog.  https://www.accuratemolds.com/  May have 'zakley' what you are looking for.

 

Have found this place to be super responsive.  Within a week of ordering I normally have the mold.

 

Have a number of LBT molds too and they are also quality.

 

GG

 

 

GG 

Thanks for that resource, do they cast as well as the LBT?

[gargoil66]

5 hours ago, Farmer said:

GG 

Thanks for that resource, do they cast as well as the LBT?

 

Farmer:

 

Both are top end molds but I have found that even the best can have problems.  My LBT molds are for my BPCR's and the Accurate molds for the revolver.  I seem to have more LBT's sticking than with the Accurate molds though.   The Accurate molds for the revolver and are five and six cavity.  Had one mold whose bullet lengths differed slightly and I contacted Accurate.  Sent the mold back and had a new one within a week.  No questions asked.  

 

Sprue Plate design on the LBT's seems more user friendly.  You can whack it parallel to the mold and it opens up.  The Accurate molds need to be whacked perpendicular to the length of the mold.  Directly into the mold or you will be beating it for a long time.  I turn the mold sideways and strike downwards.  

 

I went with Accurate because their catalogue had such a variety of molds and give the dimensions of the bullet.  LBT has a much more limited catalogue.  If you order one from Accurate today, my bet is that you will have it within ten days.  Not sure what the turn around time is for LBT.  Been decades since I bought a LBT mold.

 

GG

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Farmer]

7 hours ago, gargoil66 said:

 

Farmer:

 

Both are top end molds but I have found that even the best can have problems.  My LBT molds are for my BPCR's and the Accurate molds for the revolver.  I seem to have more LBT's sticking than with the Accurate molds though.   The Accurate molds for the revolver and are five and six cavity.  Had one mold whose bullet lengths differed slightly and I contacted Accurate.  Sent the mold back and had a new one within a week.  No questions asked.  

 

Sprue Plate design on the LBT's seems more user friendly.  You can whack it parallel to the mold and it opens up.  The Accurate molds need to be whacked perpendicular to the length of the mold.  Directly into the mold or you will be beating it for a long time.  I turn the mold sideways and strike downwards.  

 

I went with Accurate because their catalogue had such a variety of molds and give the dimensions of the bullet.  LBT has a much more limited catalogue.  If you order one from Accurate today, my bet is that you will have it within ten days.  Not sure what the turn around time is for LBT.  Been decades since I bought a LBT mold.

 

GG

 

 

 

 

 

 

Good to know. I know with some molds there is sometimes a very fine hair like burr on the parting lines that can make them stick. One of my LBT’s was doing that and Veral told me to simply take a pen eraser to the edge and lightly clean it up. He apologized for missing that when the mold was made as he hand de-burrs them. He’s got to be in his eighties by now as that was quite a while ago. He was kind of a pioneer with new bullet shapes and profiles as it seemed that no one else wanted to develop anything new. Sort of kicked the others in the rear.