EGW U die with the MBF powder funnel/expander...

[rev1911]

I currently use the Mr Bulletfeeder powder funnels for 9mm and .45 on my 550b. They are great for seating the bullet, but the brass does stick to them more than the Dillon funnel.

Now I'm considering trying the EGW undersized die, and I'm wondering if the sized down brass might make the sticking worse? Anyone using both of these together?

Thanks

[rowdyb]

yes, it did make it worse for me. though i load on a 1050 so i found a different solution with Rick's help.

i use an egw-u die in 9mm as well. the mrbf powder funnel was very sticky with a definite "thunk" as it came out of the case.

[usmc90]

I would think polishing the the funnel surface some would help

[johnson184]

yes, it did make it worse for me. though i load on a 1050 so i found a different solution with Rick's help.

i use an egw-u die in 9mm as well. the mrbf powder funnel was very sticky with a definite "thunk" as it came out of the case.

Just curious... what was your solution?

[rev1911]

I would think polishing the the funnel surface some would help

I've polished them to a mirror finish, any improvement is minor, and it's gone after the first 100 rounds.

The sticking is obviously not ideal, but I can live with it. I just don't think I want it to get worse.

[Sarge]

I run both on a 650 and the sticking is tolerable

[EngineerEli]

I use a U die and the regular dillon funnel expander, and definitly notice the sticking. Not a huge deal, but I would think all that would have to be done, is manufactur a powder funnel expander with the outside tapered ever so slightly, so that as soon as you start lowering the case off it, the die would no longer be contacting the case. Someone with a CNC lathe out there should give this a try!

[Sarge]

I use a U die and the regular dillon funnel expander, and definitly notice the sticking. Not a huge deal, but I would think all that would have to be done, is manufactur a powder funnel expander with the outside tapered ever so slightly, so that as soon as you start lowering the case off it, the die would no longer be contacting the case. Someone with a CNC lathe out there should give this a try!

Such a funnel already exists. Some of us tried a 1050 powder actuator that just bells. It doesn't expand the neck at all. Only problem is bullets tend to seat way off center

[RDA]

I use a U die and the regular dillon funnel expander, and definitly notice the sticking. Not a huge deal, but I would think all that would have to be done, is manufactur a powder funnel expander with the outside tapered ever so slightly, so that as soon as you start lowering the case off it, the die would no longer be contacting the case. Someone with a CNC lathe out there should give this a try!

I may not be an engineer, but it doesn't stick because of the shape, it sticks because you are taking an item made of brass (it has some springiness) and expanding the mouth with a steel tool. You have metal-on-metal contact along with some tension and no lubrication.

[Bob DuBois]

Really like the U die but to make it easier. Remove the powder funnel, turn down the neck till a piece of sized brass slips on the funnel.

I used a drill press and sand paper then polished the outside and the inside of the funnel. This will stop the sticking and the occasional

chigger bite on the case mouth. Setting the U die use a thin strip of paper as a go no go gauge, it should pull out with drag but not push

in with tension on the operating handle. The carbide insert in Lee's dies are closer to the case mouth and you can crack the insert if it's

set to tight to the shell plate.

Lube cases, it's a big deal your sizing the brass even tighter and closer to the extractor groove. Your machine needs to be in time and may

run a little slower.

Polishing the inside of the funnel helps bridging I also polish the inside of the powder measure first with some 400 paper then Simichrome

Polish, I get it at a Motorcycle Supply Store but can be purchased at Midway or Brownell's. There's a one piece powder adjustment bolt for sale

on E Bay. He sells it for $12.00 this was a great addition to my powder measures. Well made easy to operate. Also use Lee's seating die and the

dealer made some flat inserts so your pushing on the tip of the bullet not the sides. I can hold OAL tighter. Prefer Dillons crimp die as the Lee

FCD can affect accuracy, if used back the adjustment off so it just crimps. I like to set crimp light, .0002 to .0004 here again to much crimp

can affect accuracy.

Seen several guns with tight chambers that wouldn't run start running by going to the U die. At present using standard Lee sizing die in everything

but 40S@W that where the U die really shines. Loading on 650.

[EngineerEli]

I do agree you would not want a die with no expansion, because the die would just float and the bell could be off centered. The shape does matter. Yes brass has a decent amount of elasticity to it, but think of it this way. If you have a cylinder sliding in and out of a parallel bore, you have the entire outer surface riding against the bore, like with the standard expander dies. If you had a tapered one, visualize this, you have a cone seated inside of another cone, the moment you start backing the first one out, it is no long in contact with the other one at all. It's the same concept used with the slightly tapered 9mm, and 7.62x39 cases. It allows for more reliable extraction because of reduced friction/contact. Think about if you accidentally chamber a dirty or sandy .40 round (which are straight walled) you really have to put a lot of force into getting the round ejected.

I would say Bob is basically doing what I am saying by just sanding down the belling portion. It is just hard to be precise with sand paper. I would want the end of the die to be a slightly smaller dia, then the part right before the belling section.

End of technical ramble...

[ES13Raven]

I use both, and what works for me is to use cases tumbled in dry media for 90 min max. Wet tumbling removes all the residue from the inside of the cases, which the powder funnel needs as a lubricant.

My cases do not stick this way.

[RDA]

I do agree you would not want a die with no expansion, because the die would just float and the bell could be off centered. The shape does matter. Yes brass has a decent amount of elasticity to it, but think of it this way. If you have a cylinder sliding in and out of a parallel bore, you have the entire outer surface riding against the bore, like with the standard expander dies. If you had a tapered one, visualize this, you have a cone seated inside of another cone, the moment you start backing the first one out, it is no long in contact with the other one at all. It's the same concept used with the slightly tapered 9mm, and 7.62x39 cases. It allows for more reliable extraction because of reduced friction/contact. Think about if you accidentally chamber a dirty or sandy .40 round (which are straight walled) you really have to put a lot of force into getting the round ejected.

I don't think your tapered cone would work too well, the expansion would be too abrupt and steep and would be too inconsistent in it's expansion (too heavily dependent on consistent case length).

[rowdyb]

I put the Dillon funnel back in. I adjusted the upper swage support rod (I'm on a 1050) differently than I had before. This time I cut a case in half horizontally, making it shorter. This way I could make certain I was adjusting the rod down as far as possible. The upper part of the swaging support rod provides enough belling/expansion coupled with the slight belling from the Dillon powder drop that I do not need the Mr Bullet Feeder powder drop funnel.

I dry tumble and use Dillon case lube. With the EGW U die and Redding Competition Seating Die and Lee Factory Crimp die I was getting enough stick/push/pull thunk that the MrBF funnel just was too much for me.

Polishing the funnel did not work for me either. What I did notice is that this whole thing exposed I maybe let my shell plate get a little too lose. And most especially that my bench was not as secure and flex free as it should have been. With whatever slower, more deliberate stroke I was using before the MrBF it didn't seem so bad.

But after, it just helped to magnify the thunking of my press in operation. That's what worked for me, but I am on a 1050......

[EngineerEli]

I don't think your tapered cone would work too well, the expansion would be too abrupt and steep and would be too inconsistent in it's expansion (too heavily dependent on consistent case length).

I was just using the tapered cone to help get the concept across. The taper would be more along the lines of a 9mm case, just enough to keep cases from sticking, but barley noticeable if at all by the naked eye.

[Sarge]

I didn't mess with my MBF funnel but it's not nearly as sticky as my old Dillon funnel. On it I chucked it in a drill and took a fine file and sandpaper to it. It doesn't have to be loose to make a dramatic difference. Just a touch will do