Best attributes for Competition "Production" Gun?

[JimmyZip]

A "feel for completion?"

[kneelingatlas]

I love CZs, but if you already have a G34, just shoot that while you get a feel for completion and get to lusting after another division.

You can certainly become a GM with a G34.

I remember getting some very different advice from you that set me on my current path with my SP-01! lol

Every case is unique If he hasn't shot his first match yet and already has a capable pistol, why not give it a try?

A "feel for completion?"

Sure, competition isn't for everyone; it might take a few months to see if you get hooked.

[johnsons1480]

I love CZs, but if you already have a G34, just shoot that while you get a feel for completion and get to lusting after another division.

You can certainly become a GM with a G34.

I remember getting some very different advice from you that set me on my current path with my SP-01! lol

Every case is unique If he hasn't shot his first match yet and already has a capable pistol, why not give it a try?

A "feel for completion?"

Sure, competition isn't for everyone; it might take a few months to see if you get hooked.

He was commenting on your unique way of spelling competition

[AZoneZenSeeker]

Well Johnsons1480, how is it going on the path with a SP-10? I'm going to be looking at one this weekend.

Seems like strong hand SA it would be great. However, I do have concerns about DA, and, ease of mag release and slide lock release. Seems there are typically about six stages, so, only six DA shots... So, how many shots in a typical stage that you can shoot SA? The Glock is very easy for drop mag and release slide lock. Any tougher with a big external safety in the way? With the a Glock I don't have to move my grip much to hit both releases. I have not competed yet, so, do not know how important these mag changes are in a typical stage.

[TonytheTiger]

What is this "slide lock release"? Sounds like part of a bad day. Every shot other than the first one out of the holster will be in SA.

[AZoneZenSeeker]

That is what I am interested in, typically how many shots in a stage? If a lot then DA not near as important as SA.

Slide lock release might be more important in California, where we can only have 10 rounds in the mag, leading to emergency reloads if the stage has a lot of shots....

[johnsons1480]

Well Johnsons1480, how is it going on the path with a SP-10? I'm going to be looking at one this weekend.

Seems like strong hand SA it would be great. However, I do have concerns about DA, and, ease of mag release and slide lock release. Seems there are typically about six stages, so, only six DA shots... So, how many shots in a typical stage that you can shoot SA? The Glock is very easy for drop mag and release slide lock. Any tougher with a big external safety in the way? With the a Glock I don't have to move my grip much to hit both releases. I have not competed yet, so, do not know how important these mag changes are in a typical stage.

The SP-01 has been pretty good so far. DA isn't an issue with regular dry fire and live fire. I don't notice it anymore. I find it MUCH easier to drop mags with the SP-01 than the Glock. I don't have to shift my grip at all. I got a smaller slide stop because my thumb was riding on top of the SP-01 slide stop, and now the slide locks back reliably. I'm sure I could easily reach the slide stop to release the slide, I just never practice that. At a six stage match, you will only fire about 6 DA shots. The only way you would fire more is if you have a stage with multiple strings. Empty start stages don't have DA shots. I could be wrong, but it seems like you're thinking that the gun goes back into DA during a stage. Once you fire that first DA shot, it's SA for the remainder of the course of fire. Courses typically range from 12-32 shots, so you will have 1 of those be DA. The safety doesn't get in the way of anything for me at this point. Mag changes in Production Division (which is where this gun would best fit in USPSA) are very important, but you do your best to never do a slide lock reload.

I have shot a little over 5k rounds through my SP-01 so far this year, and about 6.5k total. I am committed to shooting this gun through the remainder of this year, but I may switch back to the Glock next season. I haven't made that decision yet though.

Bottom line, DO NOT buy a new gun before you shoot a few competitions. You already have a very competitive gun for production division. I know that you may decide to go against what I say, and that's fine. I didn't take everyone's advice either and jumped in head first. I wasted a good bit of money on things that didn't work for me instead of getting out there and competing with what I had and finding out what was working for everyone else. Ask people to try their gear, I'm sure they will be happy to let you check it out.

[pointerman1967]

Or go ahead and buy a new pistol. It never hurts to add another toy to the collection.

[johnsons1480]

Or go ahead and buy a new pistol. It never hurts to add another toy to the collection.

Or that

[kneelingatlas]

He was commenting on your unique way of spelling competition

Cut me some slack, I'm typing on a phone!

[AZoneZenSeeker]

Ya that auto spell "corrector" is a pain. I'm on an iPad and get no emoticon buttons.

Pointerman1967, I must admit that one "attribute" of a DA/SA gun that makes it very appealing, for me, is that it's a NEW TOY . And since I have more money than brains ( but not that much money.... Hmmmm ) I am still looking at selecting one. I have not shot one since Army Infantry training ( Colt 45 MANY years ago ) and I am hoping a DA/SA just works better for me. Thanks for input johnsons1480. Am looking toward a SP-01 that I can get upgrades for competition after I buy it. CGW or CZ Customs both look good. But CGW not taking any more gun smithing work for the rest of June.

I do have a last (probably) couple of Noob questions. Since a DA/SA metal gun will be heavier than a "poly" gun, does anyone have issues shooting one Weak Hand Only? Right now shooting WHO my aim wobbles around even with my Glock 34. In Typical competitions, are there many WHO stages?

I hope to get better understanding of competitions by observing both an IDPA and USPSA match in the next month or so. Again, thanks for the great feedback!

[pointerman1967]

There are some classifiers that require some single hand shooting. In general, other match stages don't specify any hand requirements. I believe the stage has to be under a certain round count for the designer to do so.

I doubt the wobble has a lot to do with weight. Good news is that with this type of shooting you rarely point at one target for more than a second (unless you are missing steel) so the wobble factor of normal target shooting does not usually come into effect. If you have issues spend some time holding a small weight like you would a pistol when shooting for a few minutes each day and you can fix that issue.

[gavagai]

If you choose the SP01 remember that the roster model does not have a decocker (I am forced to know these things too). Unless I'm mistaken you will have to manually decock it at Make Ready in Production. I believe this is the "preferred" SP01 model (because trigger jobs are easier and maybe better), but manual decocking is beyond my comfort level. YMMV.

Just getting started too, and thinking about all the same questions. Good luck. FWIW I chose a 9mm 1911 because I like heavy and thin, and I want to be able to afford to shoot it lots at my low level (so not .45). Couldn't find anything I liked for Production on the roster.

[pointerman1967]

SP01 is best decocked using the finger roll method. As demonstrated in the video below.

[rowdyb]

You're in so-cal and new. The best pistol then is the one you own. Holster, 4 or 5 mags, 4 or 5 pouches. GO! And I like how you put "production" in quotes like that. None of my production or stock service pistols have ever been very stock, hahaha.

If you're worried about your ability before you go to a competition ask yourself these questions. "safely" defined as finger off the trigger and gun pointed down range. not the sky, not your hand, not your foot but down range.

-can I draw my gun from a holster safely?

-can I reload my gun safely?

-can I unload and load my gun safely?

-can I walk/jog with my gun safely?

-can you comprehend simple range commands? "make ready?", "are you ready?", "unload and show clear" and so on. idpa and uspsa say essentially the same thing but differently.

-can you do two column addition if someone asks you to keep score? rarely will this happen your first match.

-can you peel tape from a roll and apply it to a piece of cardboard?

-can you learn through observation?

If you can answer yes to these questions then you are more than ready to shoot your first match! uspsa, idpa, both, it doesn't matter. without a mentor/friend who is already into it and is helping you, you really won't be able to make informed decisions for yourself until you start going and doing.

So get out there!

Edited June 20, 2015 by rowdyb

[jbultman]

SP01 is best decocked using the finger roll method. As demonstrated in the video below.

Every time I SO and someone comes to the line and does this, I wince. Waiting for a ND...just waiting! I've had it happen under my watch. No thanks not for me. To each their own I guess.

[TonytheTiger]

Which method would you prefer?

[jbultman]

"The single action, Striker fired or SA/DA with a decocker" method. Haha in all seriousness... its your gun, your match, your method not mine. I'm not telling y'all what gun to use, how to shoot it or what method of x, y or z to use. I shoot with a bunch of people that shoot CZ's without a decocker, they love it. It has to be done, there's no way to put it in DA without putting the hammer down. Method wise idk, what's the best... face it down range and good luck!!

[zhunter]

I'd be afraid to thumb/finger roll

Punching the sides of the hammer allows you to control it all the way down

[jbultman]

I'd be afraid to thumb/finger roll

Punching the sides of the hammer allows you to control it all the way down

I've seen an ND that way too. There's just no good way around it in my book.

[jbultman]

To the OP... Just shoot want ya got. It's plenty sufficient and will do the job better than you can. Use it for a while, until you decide what platform and direction you want to go.see what other are shooting, ask them questions and if you dont decide the 34. Then would I start the process of looking for a gun for production. Who knows you may want to move divisions, and not stuck with production. I'm not saying that a CZ wont do as well in another division but theres other options you may decide on after getting out and shooting for a while.

I too wanted to get a new gun when i started shooting IDPA/USPSA. I shot my 19 for the better part of a year before deciding to go the route I went.

Edited June 21, 2015 by jbultman

[AZoneZenSeeker]

Well yesterday morning I found and bought a CZ SP-01 at an FFL here in SoCal. Thanks pointerman1967 for the heads up to the source! I loved the feel of the gun. Yes johnson1480, the mag release is great. The stock trigger felt great in SA. The slide release is a bit farther than my Glock, but, if an issue I guess I could go the "slingshot" route. I assume in USPSA you can choose when to reload, so, that would not be an issue. Don't know how often an "emergency reload" situation might be mandated in IDPA. I admit that the manual decock is a concern. Tried the "thumb roll" technique with it several times. It seemed to work fairly well, but, still heard a small click when when it finally released. I have always used Federal ammo because of the reputation of a sensitive primer. Maybe different ammo with a not so sensitive primer?. I bought it before I read jbultman's experiences as a SO, which added a bit more concern. Will be practicing manual decocking techniques many times on empty practice range with live ammo before ever using in competition. I would have preferred a Decocker version of this pistol, but, not on the California Roster!

I am taking to heart all the advice from so many to use my Glock 34 and dive into competition. I will delay my plan to get a new drop in trigger for the Glock. Staying away from a lighter trigger pull for now, for added safety. The list by rowdyb is a great checklist. I feel I am good to go for everything but some movement with gun. Will get some private handgun bay time in to work toward "run and gun". Although I plan on "slow walking" my first competition. For my own egos sake, I add one more aspect to that list.... Hit the A Zone once in a while! . To that end, this forum has been a great help. I feel that I may soon be able to change my "title" to "sees sights rise".

So, my plan is to observe at least one match and get a feel for requirements for movement and accuracy and then use my Glock to start competition. I feel very comfortable with it. This will allow me to get comfortable with the competition environment without also learning a new DA/SA (manual decocking) gun. I will need to wait a few weeks to get my hands on the CZ (California "jail" time for new guns). After I try it out on the range, I will then be sending it off to CGW or CZ Customs for competition mods and that will take several weeks. By the time I get it back and get proficient with it I will hopefully be comfortable with competition. At that point I can finally determine the "attributes" of the gun that work best for me.

[jbultman]

Congrats on the purchase AZ. The SP-01s are a really nice pistol. It treat you pretty well!

Don't be concerned too much with the decocking on line after the make ready command. Being in your shoes I'd look up a couple different ways to decock, practice and find the best way. I know of three off hand.

Id practice practice practice with it, prior to sending it off. The slide stop isn't an issue. When you reload at slide lock with your glock you can hit it with you dominant hand. With the CZ treat it like a 1911. Load the magazine and release with the same hand (your off hand thumb).

I would send it off to Cajun Gun Works. A buddy just got his back and .... Damn its nice! Almost made me get one. Haha

Get out to a match, take your time get your hits and be safe. As long as you can safety; holster, draw, reload and move with a loaded gun get out there. Follow your SOs instructions and make alot of friends. Talk to them get in with a group, travel and shoot with them.

Good luck!

[rowdyb]

If you live in San Diego or near by I will let you check out my SP01's. I have had almost everyone of my CZ's worked on by Automatic Accuracy. Give them a call and you can mention my name, Rowdy, and they will treat you nicely.

As someone who went from a G34 to various CZ models in both idpa and uspsa if you have any specific questions feel free to pm me. Congrats on your new journey.