Nik Habicht Posted May 28, 2001 Share Posted May 28, 2001 One of the local IPSC clubs is going to be holding a shotgun side match from now on. Beyond knowing that I should bring my shotgun (Remington 870, Ashley Express sights, 7 round total capacity) any words of advice on ammo selection, gunhandling, practice, etc. would be greatly appreciated. I can put slugs into a tighter group at 25 yards than I can with any handgun if that's a help.... Thanks, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted May 28, 2001 Share Posted May 28, 2001 Nik, It all depends on what the course calls for. Some run steel and 7.5 shot works good. Others are 00 buck and slugs. You'll be at a slight disadvantage with a pump but you can win IF you practice with it. If your interested Wal-mart is closing out a bunch of 1100's for 369 or less supposedly going down 10% a week until 206. I'm waiting to see here there still 369. Shotguns are a reloading game. He who loads the fastest usually wins. You can get into big bucks tricking out a shotgun just depends on how serius you are and if you want to go onto 3 gun matches. For drills the plate racks are tough to beat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted May 28, 2001 Author Share Posted May 28, 2001 Chris, Thanks for the tips. Wish I could buy an 1100 but since they take the extended mag tubes of the 870 that would make me a felon in NJ. Can't posess a semi-auto shotgun that holds more than six rounds you know...... or the components to make one.... But if you're willing to pump the action then 15 rounds is the magic number. Anyone make an extension for the 870 that will hold 15 rounds? (Just kidding, I wouldn't want to try to track targets with one.) (Edited by Nik Habicht at 7:43 pm on May 27, 2001) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted May 28, 2001 Share Posted May 28, 2001 Nik, Move to PA. Everybody else has! Where did you shoot today Old bridge? Biggest tube out there is a +5 unless you can find a custom maker to do one. I think Jim Clark has a 17 shot tube. Damn thing is taller than he is! I shot a pump in a couple matches did pretty good against the semis. Speed tubes are what kicked my butt. Of course I carry the same shotgun day in and day out. Helps a little! Good luck! Are you coming over to shoot the Mid Atlantic Sectional? Last weekend in July at Topton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted May 28, 2001 Author Share Posted May 28, 2001 Chriss, How would one register for something like Topton? If I'm not slaving away at work I might be interested. As far as PA is concerned ---- it would have been nice, but we're closing on a house in Trenton in the next couple of weeks. Thanks again for the advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted May 28, 2001 Share Posted May 28, 2001 Nik, The match application is on the uspsa website. I think it is 45.00 for the match. Should be a good match. They have a nice facility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellyn Posted May 29, 2001 Share Posted May 29, 2001 random thoughts about shotgun shooting: I think that it is really important to lean into the shotgun very aggressively. Otherwise you'll get pushed out of position and find yourself standing on your heels. Use your strong side leg as a shock absorber and put most of your weight on your weak side leg. don't place your natural point of aim on the first target. Instead put it towards the middle of the array or even towards the far side of the array. If shooting from the high ready, cover the target w/ the muzzle and when the start signal goes, simply push the muzzle towards the 1st target. This will raise the butt to your face. Bring the stock to your face not vice versa. Don't swing thru targets and try to shoot them. Wait for the shotgun to stop on each target, however briefly, and then shoot. Hope that helps. With that 17rd tube, Clark does not even shoot, he just hits the steel w/ the end of the tube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted May 29, 2001 Share Posted May 29, 2001 I sure would like to see him stick that sucker through a port. I'll stick to the small 10rounders! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill H Posted May 29, 2001 Share Posted May 29, 2001 NiK, try to get some Tactical (low recoil) slugs and buckshot. Thay are a big help.You can find them at ammoman.com. I use these and winchester 7 1/2 heavy trap loads.USANA says they are going to start having shotgun side matches. Is that where you are going?Glad to see some "locals" on here. Bill Hearne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted May 30, 2001 Share Posted May 30, 2001 Just a comment, I think I'll post this on the Hate forum - I really hate those 17 rd, or whatever those ridiculous tubes are on shotguns. They make me want to leave the range! be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted May 30, 2001 Share Posted May 30, 2001 Stupid courses of fire breed stupid solutions, where have we seen this before. Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted May 30, 2001 Author Share Posted May 30, 2001 Bill, I don't know where USANA is. I'll be shooting the match at Central Jersey on the second Sunday of June and the match at Old Bridge on the fourth Sunday. Thanks for the tips on ammo. I'll have to check that site out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogmaDog Posted May 8, 2002 Share Posted May 8, 2002 I just shot my first "shotgun side match" at an IDPA match last weekend. The course was 3 shots through each of 3 ports at 3 arrays of (you guessed it) 3 poppers at around 10 to 15 yards. Pretty easy shooting. Started with 3 shells loaded, then at the second port had to load shells singly and fire, and then at the 3rd port could load all 3 or go singly. I shot a police officer's 870 with bead sight, and really got a kick out of it. Now I'm looking for my own shotgun. Probably will get a Nova Pump with ghost ring sights...going for about $250 now. How do you like your 870 with express sights? That's my second choice right now. Anyway, we used birdshot loads (#7 or so), and carried guns muzzle down, action open to and from the line. After that match, I would practice reloading, and target transitions while pumping. Semper fi, Dogmadog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted May 9, 2002 Author Share Posted May 9, 2002 I really love express sights on a shotgun. I rarely miss, even when folks with beads are having trouble knocking steel over at 20-25 yards on a windy day. The sights are almost as accurate as notch and post, and a whole lot faster to acquire. That said, I didn't care for them on my Glock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogmaDog Posted May 9, 2002 Share Posted May 9, 2002 Hey, just got the results back from my match on Saturday. I won the shotgun match in "pump" division, against 9 shooters, and my time was only a second or so off the auto shooter's times. Yay me Anyway, I keep going around and around with this shotgun choice thing. I'm not ready to spend enough for a full-on limited gun (auto, etc.). I want a pump. The Nova looks pretty good. Add a $60 mag extension and a side saddle and it's ready to go. An 870 is classic. I could get the Express Synthetic with 18" barrel, add a mag extension and express sights, and be ready to go. Or I could get an 870 with 21" turkey barrel, 3 round mag extension, and express sights, and be ready to go with a slightly longer, 8 round gun (vs. 7). May need to get chokes for any of them. Don't know if the 18 inchers are even tapped for screw in chokes. Nova is cheapest because it comes with ghost rings already. 870 looks cooler (IMO), rusts easier, and would require a little more work (apparently you have to drill out some indentations in the mag tube that prevent the use of mag extensions, and I'd have to mount the AO sights). After the sights and the mag tube, the 870 would be about $50 more, + any professional gunsmith fee or tool costs. Any thoughts, opinions, or recommendations? Thanks, DogmaDog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikW Posted May 9, 2002 Share Posted May 9, 2002 If you get an 870 Police model you won't have to worry about magazine tube indents. I hate the Nova but it may be better for big boys. There's a chance my forearm injury was caused by shooting that thing. Are you sure mag extensions and side saddles are available for it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogmaDog Posted May 9, 2002 Share Posted May 9, 2002 Benelli has a factory made 2 rnd extension for the Nova. I don't know about side saddles...I think a short (4 or 5 rounds) one would be necessary because of the extended forend grip, but it can't be THAT hard to fit one. Why would the Nova be better for big boys, or potentially more injurious to you than an 870? I'll have to ask about a "police" model. If it isn't any more expensive, then maybe that's the route to go. I went shopping at the local MC Sports, and told the guy what I was looking for, and he got all uppity with me. "Oh, you want an ASSAULT shotgun?!" "We don't sell those here, because they're designed to KILL people" and when another salesman came by, he says to him "This guy wants an ASSAULT shotgun!" Given the number of Glocks, S&Ws, and Kimbers in his pistol cabinet, I could hardly understand why an "assault shotgun" would be distasteful. But I didn't even consider asking for the "police model". Thanks, DogmaDog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogmaDog Posted May 13, 2002 Share Posted May 13, 2002 Well, I went ahead and bought the Nova pump on Friday. 18.5" barrel, ghost ring sights, and I got a 2 round mag extension. Out the door for about $300, which is about equal to what I'd have to pay to get any other shotgun to a similar setup. I haven't shot it yet, but so far I like it a lot (for whatever that's worth ) It does look like it will be hard to impossible to get a side saddle on it, though. However, I like the longer pump handle, because it allows you to grip the forend closer in to your body. I also have taken a liking to the appearance of the thing (it grows on you). It looks sort of like an H.R. Giger design (he's the artist who drew stuff for "Aliens") I'm sorta confused about one thing, though. It came with a 4 round mag, to which I added a 2 round extension, but I can put 7 2.75" shells in the thing!? For some reason, the 2.75" shells I bought are only 2.25" long. I don't get it. I'm gonna have to take a course on shotgun math now. Semper Fi, DogmaDog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhgtyre Posted May 13, 2002 Share Posted May 13, 2002 DogmaDog, When you put on the mag extension you didn't happen to remove a dowel from the tube did you? Or did the extension come with a new follower that was shorter than the old one? Or, and this is the last of my ideas, maybe the extension came with a different spring? Those things either together or singly could explain the extra round. -jhgtyre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted May 13, 2002 Share Posted May 13, 2002 Some brands of shells are shorter than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogmaDog Posted May 14, 2002 Share Posted May 14, 2002 Jhg, Hmmm. Well, it did come with a "limiter plug" in the standard 4 round mag, which reduced capacity to 2 (supposedly...I didn't try it). The +2 extension is 6" long, so I figured it really would only hold +2, but since the 2 3/4" shells are only 2 1/4" long, I'm able to get 7 in there. Certainly nothing to be upset about in my book! Just made me wonder if shell length is measured before the crimp, or what. Learning the lingo for regular pistol cartridges was tough enough, now I have to figure out "drams" and shot size and all this other weird stuff. Ack! Also, I did find a 4 round side saddle carrier for it on line (tac star, I think?) I think I'll hold off for now, just so you all have a chance to run out and buy your own Novas so you can be like me Semper Fi, DogmaDog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted May 14, 2002 Share Posted May 14, 2002 Now I am interested - what brand of 2&3/4 shell are you using that is only 2 & 1/4 in?? BTW, anybody else notice that many 2&3/4" slugs are actually longer than 2&3/4? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Sweeney Posted May 14, 2002 Share Posted May 14, 2002 The length of the shell is determined by how long it is when opened. Thus a 2.25" loaded shell becomes a 2.75" when the crimp unfolds. This peculiarity gets some people in trouble when they find that 3" shells "fit" their 2.75" chambered gun. And some are slightly longer or shorter loaded. If you can get them, try 3-1/4 dram shells loaded with #4 shot (lead!). They will carry more energy to the popper, giving you an edge on the long shots or on heavy-set poppers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogmaDog Posted May 14, 2002 Share Posted May 14, 2002 Patrick, Thanks! I'll have to try to track some down. Are you describing a turkey load (and are turkeys really that tough??? I keep seeing ads for turkey ammo that they describe as though it could take down rhinos). What I bought was a bulk pack at Walmart...100 shells for $15.88. Federal multi-purpose 3 dram, 1 1/8 oz of 7 1/2 shot, 2 3/4" shells that are only 2 1/4" when you load them. Maybe it's a good thing I got a gun capable of shooting 3 1/2" shells...no chance of screwing up by loading too much shell in my gun...but then again, I read labels on boxes of ammo, and on barrels of guns, so I don't think it would happen. Semper Fi, DogmaDog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhgtyre Posted May 14, 2002 Share Posted May 14, 2002 I use the WalMart specials a lot and have wished for some heavier loads when I didn't get good center hits on steel. If anyone knows of a good (hopefully cheap) source for the loads Patrick suggests I would like to try them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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