Canuck223 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 So , my X-calibur is sitting in LGS , waiting for paperwork ( NY thing ) , got to play with it today and there was instant chemistry (lol) Can't wait to pick it up. Have fun with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magsz Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 Ok guys, ive had mine in my hands for about an hour so far and i cant put it down. Here are my impressions: The Good: 1. Holy crap this thing is well machined. There is no flash, no obtrusive mold lines, no sharp corners or anything of the sort on the frame. The slide itself is EXTREMELY well machined to the point where im wondering why other countries/manufacturers cant seem to perform at this level, cough, CZ, cough... 2. The trigger in double action has a fairly long reach and for me with my medium sized gloves is almost too long but its just on that edge. The single action is simply absurd. There is zero over travel, the takeup is minimal like 2-3mm's and the break is crisp beyond compare. The double action does stack almost imperceptibly toward the end of the travel but its not a huge deal. 3. The mag release is a gigantic mushroom sized thing and within perfect reach of my thumb 4. The beavertail area of the grip nestles very well into the web of my hand and it is thick enough where it wont bounce around in my grip like the shadow. 5. The gun, due to the hammer shape and the rear of the slide is very easy to manually decock. 6. The sights are well made, steel sights both front and rear. The front is finely serrated. I will take measurements later. The rear sight is finely serrated and the top corners of the blade are rounded off to prevent blood from being drawn. 7. The serrations in the rear are deep, really deep and afford a VERY positive grip. The serrations or slide lightening cuts in the front also seem to work well as grasping grooves so coolio. This will make racking the slide off of tables and unloaded starts pretty easy if that's your chosen technique method. 8. The safeties are oddly shaped and operate at extreme angles but they actually work quite well. It surprised me a little how easy it was to actually activate and deactivate the huge blades. 9. The ambi mag release is very functional and may prove useful at some point but its not really a necessity for me on this type of gun. 10. Holy CRAP, there is a magnet in the magwell, i swear...this thing is a hoover vacuum when it comes to reloading. Despite it not having a generous bevel the dimension of the magwell just gobble up the magazines. The amount of actual surface area removed from the magwell due to the grip shape is impressive. This thing is a joy to reload and the mags drop free as well or better than my shadow. 11. The stainless steel pins that they use are really nicely surface ground/finished. They scream quality and this means something to me as the parts holding the gun together seem VERY well made. The Bad: 1. Field stripping this thing and putting it back together is just stupid...i dont like it but thankfully, i shoot more than i clean or field strip my pistols so ill live. 2. The front sight is thick, thicker than id like and the fiber optic is also thicker than id prefer. No biggie as this gun at least has workable sights out of the box whereas my shadow sights sucked even harder than these do. 1500 bucks for a shadow and the sight setup is just...yeah, its not my cup of tea at all. For 800 bucks, i can definitely live with the front sight for a little while and the rear sight is gorgeous, exactly what i wanted. Here's to hoping it will hold its zero. 3. The grip texture is awful, there is none. Come on GP, what's the story here? From a concealed carry standpoint, sure, having slick slide is probably preferable but from a duty standpoint, or a competition standpoint, this frame is like a bar of butter. The NICE thing about that is that we can easily apply grip tape and we wont have to worry about it adhering. 4. The grip modules feel like over time, if you swap them around, they will wear out the frame and eventually fall off but this is pure speculation and is probably more paranoia than anything. 5. These wide safeties are going to be a huge pain in the ass. Thankfully, GP includes a set of low profile safeties that im going to be putting on the gun immediately. I have small/medium hands and the safeties impede my ability to get a high grip. They also rest right on top of my index finger and under recoil that could get annoying as i believe the rear end of the safety may impact the last knuckle of my index finger. 6. The ambi slide locks, while nicely stamped, seem to be a little sharp. Depending on your hand size i can see these things potentially creating some wear points with your hands. I may knock this one off of the list after ive shot the gun. 7. The magazine baseplates are like gigantic star destroyers. They're simply too long front to back but thankfully, if you so choose, this can be alleviated via aftermarket pads. Thank you springer precision! The Unforgivable: 1. I can feel the half cock notch on the hammer, you can also hear it as you draw back the trigger in double action. By "feel" i mean i can feel the trigger bow vibrating as the hammer cams back..i dont like that. 2. There seems to be something wrong with my trigger. My trigger bar seems to be improperly assembled as i can feel it falling into place in single action as i press through the pre travel. The gun is functional but again, it has this weird stutter as the trigger bar falls into place. I can get a video up of this shortly. So, these are my out of the box impressions. I am really liking this thing but i need the new car smell to wear off so that i can compare this thing objectively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck223 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 Ok guys, ive had mine in my hands for about an hour so far and i cant put it down. Here are my impressions: The Bad: 1. Field stripping this thing and putting it back together is just stupid...i dont like it but thankfully, i shoot more than i clean or field strip my pistols so ill live. The trick is to remember that there is no sense in lifting up until you are at full rear slide travel with the take down latch pulled down. For reassembly, make sure the barrel is fully forward. 4. The grip modules feel like over time, if you swap them around, they will wear out the frame and eventually fall off but this is pure speculation and is probably more paranoia than anything. My original Xcal was my test bed. The grips were swapped 100's of times. It's still fairly tight. As the average owner isn't going to be swapping nearly as much, you should be good to go. 5. These wide safeties are going to be a huge pain in the ass. Thankfully, GP includes a set of low profile safeties that im going to be putting on the gun immediately. I have small/medium hands and the safeties impede my ability to get a high grip. They also rest right on top of my index finger and under recoil that could get annoying as i believe the rear end of the safety may impact the last knuckle of my index finger. If you are not riding the wide safety, then definitely switch. 6. The ambi slide locks, while nicely stamped, seem to be a little sharp. Depending on your hand size i can see these things potentially creating some wear points with your hands. I may knock this one off of the list after ive shot the gun. The gun auto forwards so the only concern is your grip. The Unforgivable: 1. I can feel the half cock notch on the hammer, you can also hear it as you draw back the trigger in double action. By "feel" i mean i can feel the trigger bow vibrating as the hammer cams back..i dont like that. 2. There seems to be something wrong with my trigger. My trigger bar seems to be improperly assembled as i can feel it falling into place in single action as i press through the pre travel. The gun is functional but again, it has this weird stutter as the trigger bar falls into place. I can get a video up of this shortly. Field strip the gun and watch the disconnector as you use the DA and SA trigger. Look at the disconnector grooves in the slide. The reason for the trigger feel is found within, and it's normal. So, these are my out of the box impressions. I am really liking this thing but i need the new car smell to wear off so that i can compare this thing objectively. . Comments added above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magsz Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 I went ahead and took a video of the issue. If its not an issue, let me know and i will immediately amend the title of the video. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck223 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 Not an issue. Look at :48 and watch the disconnector popping back up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magsz Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 Ok. Its inconsistent though. Sometimes i can feel that "slack" in the trigger bar and sometimes i cant. Any idea why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck223 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 Some video on take down and full detail stripping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck223 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 Ok. Its inconsistent though. Sometimes i can feel that "slack" in the trigger bar and sometimes i cant. Any idea why? It's brand new and likely still coated with the shipping lube. Once it's broken in a little, cleaned and freshly lubed you will notice that it's fairly consistent. The slide drives the trigger bow down in recoil. When the trigger resets, the trigger bow is driven back up by the trigger return spring. The only things that tend to interfere are excess fouling or over time, s weakened trigger return spring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magsz Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 Could the trigger return spring be out of "place" resulting in a weak upward drive of the trigger bar? Im not going to detail strip the gun just yet as id like to shoot it first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck223 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 (edited) No, now go and shoot the damn thing and quit fretting...... Edited May 2, 2015 by Canuck223 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NicVerAZ Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 (edited) What is really interesting is that Magsz wrote such a long report without shooting one single round through the gun (unless I missed something). I posted my report after shooting 200 rounds. It went from a tight, finicky gun into a well tuned tack driver in less than a quarter of that amount. When I claim that I can print a fist-size group off-hand in a relaxed isosceles position at 75 ft, I am not joking. I can tell you which load I used but in general this gun does best with 124 or 135gr bullets. It does not do so well with 147s. Like Magsz I disliked the dumbo ear safety levers until I learned to use them to my advantage. With a strong grip and strong hand thumb riding the lever, it provides increased recoil control. Also if you shoot in limited or IDPA ESP, you can start single action locked and the safety is disengaged without even paying any attention to it. With the tiny safeties, not so much. As for the field stripping, I bet you I can take it down in 4 pieces (lower, slide, barrel, recoil spring) and together again in less than 40 seconds. The trick is to put it together upside down and with the barrel inserted all the way in, flat surface breach-side of the barrel on the flat surface inside of the slide. The fact that the grips are smooth is not an issue since you can stipple, put a Hogue slip, buy one of Scott Springer's pre-cut grip tapes or do as I do and buy a roll of 3M thread tape. It will last you forever and is aggressive enough. That is one of the issues I have with the PPQ. I found the one I tried to not really give you an option: the grips and preformed and force your hands to conform to them. I personally don't think there's even an issue with smooth grips. CZs usually have a smooth grip and they are a favorite among many GMs. I am not sure as to what sort of issue you have with the trigger. It is very crisp on mine and breaks very consistently. Canuck knows that part more than I do, to me it's voodoo magic. All I know is the less I screw with it, the better. Now, here is why the industry really hates this gun: there is nothing to do to tune it. It's already tuned for racing out of the box. No extra part, no "drop in" trigger kit, no spring kit, nothing at all. I am inclined now to believe that removing the hammer spring end cap to lower the trigger pull or even switching recoil spring is absolutely unnecessary. Shoot it as stock as it comes when you open the box. The aftermarket will be limited to magazine base pads, grip tape and mag wells. And, yes, I agree with Magsz: the front sight is way too wide, especially for shooters who focus on the target, as I do. Now, for the kicker. I have left a very known GM from Arizona (I won't name him because he does not officially endorse GP and he has his own endorsement, but I'll let you guess) shoot my X-Calibur. He was thoroughly impressed and called it "virtually recoilless". He even said "This looks expensive... How much did you pay for it?" When I told him $800 before taxes and FFL fee, he could not believe it. And he has no issues calling your gun a piece of you-know-what otherwise, as he did with my GP6 (which was not exactly the most competitive gun out there, you have to admit). I have to also add that Eagle and Grand Power have an awesome customer service and that they've been doing a good job importing these guns and providing replacement parts. Edited May 4, 2015 by NicVerAZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Moneypenny Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 Regarding a couple of your issues.. The safeties feel HUGE.. but they work quite well thumb on top like a 1011 it helps you get a higher grip on the gun.... I have the safeties off of my K100 x-trim, I'll trade! as for the base pads, CZ Tanfoglio, and a few others use the same ugly base pad... Shockbottle base pads will be available soon ( and could be requested through one of their dealers.) CZ base pads won't quite work even though the mags are VERY similar... I like the tiny base pads, like glock mags also. GP also does steel base pads on certain mags, not sure who gets those. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck223 Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 CZ base pads will work, but you need to get the smaller retainer plate. I use the rubber bonded version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magsz Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 (edited) 400 rounds down the pipe yesterday. I shot 300 of my reloads and 100 factory, perfecta and WWB. The gun had two failures to go into battery with my reloads which i wont count against the gun. The factory ammo ran great with zero light strikes. The good: The gun ran and ran and ran and ran. It is the softest recoiling polymer gun ive ever shot. I thought my P09 was a pussycat but this thing takes the cake. I struggle with 5 inch guns. I normally find a longer sight radius to have a "bouncing" effect upon returning to battery where the front sight oscillates too much and requires more control to get it back to where i want it to be before breaking my next shot. This gun simply goes bang and the front sight returns. No magic, no sorcery, it is that stable and "flat" in its recoil impulse. In hand, the gun feels a little nose heavy which i dont like. In practice, when actually shooting, you dont notice it and target transitions are effortless. The weight seems to be just right as there was no over swinging on targets like i experienced with my shadow and my tanfoglios. The gun worked marvelously with the lighter weight recoil springs. Some of my Glocks, P09 and my M&P would get sluggish when dirty and you could feel the rounds impacting the feed ramp. Not so with this bad boy but more time and rounds and dirt will tell the tale. The frame wasnt as slippery as i thought BUT i also was barely sweating yesterday due to the amazing temperature in the low 80's. I will revisit this this summer and see how it pans out. Also, Nick, i know we are on a competition forum but not everyone WANTS a slick gun so that they can apply grip tape. I like this gun so much that i am looking at the K100 as a potential backpacking/CC/HD gun and id rather not have to deal with sandpaper on those guns. The left side safety worked like a 2011 and allowed me to ride it with my strong hand thumb. It did not impede my grip at all. The Bad: The right side safety was banging the shit out of my strong hand index finger knuckle the entire day. I am going to see if i can swap the low profile safety lever onto the right and side but i have no clue if that is possible while retaining the huge paddle on the left. The gun barely ever locks back for me but this is due to my grip. The gun auto forwards if you whisper at it. I despise auto forwarding and i really dont care if you think its the greatest thing in the world. It has burned me and i do not like it. Thankfully, slide lock reloads will be very uncommon with this particular gun so no biggie. Im not sure if i hate the front sight but the light bar ratio is completely foreign to me. I just dont understand having a blade on the front that is thicker than your rear notch is wide. I didnt have any major accuracy issues with the gun it just felt very awkward to me. Before i tear the thing off and go with a thinner front sight i am going to put some time into this sight setup to see if i can make it work. I WILL say that the fiber rod is just too big for me. The unforgivable: For game purposes the click in single action doesnt matter but man, when shooting groups or firing slowly, it is REALLY annoying...I cant imagine that this is the way it was actually designed but i have a sample of one so i cannot say. I trust the guys that have responded to me about this so i guess im just going to have to live with it. Its a minor gripe in the grand scheme of things, especially considering its not a functional defect. The rear sight sucks. The blade is perfect but the "detents" are faint and appear to be VERY weak. There is almost no discernible click and the only way to ensure that the elevation screw was resting in a detent was to stick my face up next to the sight and watch the detent ball actually move. I hope it will hold zero but only time will tell. If need be, ill replace the unit with a Kensight blade. Edited May 4, 2015 by Magsz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyler2you Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 No, it doesn't. We do have the 1mm FO front sights if you prefer. I just spoke to a nice lady at Eagle Imports and she says the only front FO sights they have are identical to what comes on the gun from the factory. Can you help us out with a part number? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowgun Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 I found a couple local to me (https://secure.arnzenarms.com/product/grand-power/grand-power-x-calibur-9mm-luger-499-inch-barrel-blue-15-round) was going to go check them out after work today. What is the best place to get spare parts (Trigger return spring, sear, etc) if I want to mess around with the trigger a little? Grand power EU itself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Btw, just got a stock k100 mk12 in at my dealer today. The trigger on that gun is quite different I have spare left side wide safety, plus fiber front. I do need a solid black back though. Now the shortness of the k100 I like. It is a bit heavier trigger, but the reset is even shorter. I have my mandatory 7 day wait. But this one should be fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magsz Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 What is different about the trigger? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck223 Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 What is different about the trigger? The Xcal uses a different sear and hammer. The location of the sear is different. The K100 can have a sharper and crisper feel to it, but is always going to be just a little heavier. The Xcal also has a slight rolling break which some prefer and others hate. If you slap the trigger, the Xcal will show you the limits of that approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck223 Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 No, it doesn't. We do have the 1mm FO front sights if you prefer. I just spoke to a nice lady at Eagle Imports and she says the only front FO sights they have are identical to what comes on the gun from the factory.Can you help us out with a part number? I'll follow up with Eagles. They may not have added them to the current order but maybe we can get them added to this months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magsz Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 (edited) Speaking of trigger slap. I ran some two shot drills from the draw, DA/SA transition. I was able to hammer out a .15 split with this gun at 10 yards into an IPSC A-Zone repeatably. Ive never been able to run faster than .19 splits on any other handgun platform ive ever shot unless i gave up control. On AR15's, .10 splits are no problem so ive got the finger speed. The trigger system on this gun is that well designed. Edited May 5, 2015 by Magsz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowgun Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 So I got to look at this gun at the local shop yesterday, and I noticed it came with three recoil springs. To standard wire coil, and a red flat coil spring. The flat coil spring Felt much stiffer. Is there anywhere that mentions what these various recoil Springs are for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magsz Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 I think people have gone over that in this thread but its 19 pages at this point and i cannot find the info. The red, flatwire is for duty loads, one of the round wire springs is MUCH lighter than the other. The spring that came in the gun feels like its probably a 14 or 15 pound spring. The other round wire spring feels like an 11-13 lb spring. I havent installed the red, flat wire spring since i have no need for it. Ive been trying to call Eagle for two days now to see if i can get some more info on those light weight recoil springs but no one picks up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0kawn Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 The compressed spring length is 1.21" And another user measured the 3 springs at 9.5lb, 11.5lb, and 15 lb. I have a pile of beretta, cz, and 1911 recoil springs waiting at my dealer for me to trim down then measure weight at compressed length this weekend to find an easier replacement. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck223 Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Ive been trying to call Eagle for two days now to see if i can get some more info on those light weight recoil springs but no one picks up. I think they have been trying to navigate a phone system problem. I will check. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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