bmillios Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 So, I'm torn between the Versamax Tactical (not waiting any longer for the Tactical Competition 3gun model - it could be months before that comes out) and the M2. Reading all the threads. Which model of the M2 do people recommend? And what barrel length - and why? Local place has a bunch of M2s with pistol grips. Why don't I see anybody using those? I'll stop by there in a day or two, and compare the M2 alongside the VMT. See which one follows me home. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KY1911 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 How do you reload? Single, doubles, quads? Strong- or weak-hand? IMHO the biggest question as to whether to pistol grip or not. Plus, are you used to a pistol grip? As for length, I prefer slightly longer so have a 24" regular stocked M2. Swings better for me and has been 1,000% reliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxymajor Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I vote pistol grip with 18.5" choke tac barrel. GET RIFLE SIGHTS not the ghost. There are many reasons i like the short barrel and pistol grip. Try the "pistol grip flip" for two and/or four loading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmillios Posted March 31, 2014 Author Share Posted March 31, 2014 (edited) I should have added - I've shot trap and skeet before, but this is my first gun for 3-gun. As for reloading - I'm thinking the dualoads would be my thing. Not super-nimble enough for the quads, and the singles look too slow. Roxymajor - why not the ghost sights? Edited March 31, 2014 by bmillios Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadeslade Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Lots of shooters use pistol grips on Benelli M1 and M2. Kind of need to load weak hand if you do that. Hard to turn and burn with pistol grip, but not impossible. 21" with extended chokes or 24" are what you see 90% of the time. Never can go wrong with standard stock, pistol grip is what I prefer, not available for some shotguns. Stay away from tactical shotguns if you can, Barrels are too short for good gun handling. Ghost ring sights take too long to line up and they are for slugs. A standard field model M2 in 21 or 24 would be just fine. Get chokes and learn them-it's not that different than shooting clays-still look at target,not gun and you are moving, not the targets,but essentially the same deal. DVC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amccallister Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I would steer clear of a pistol grip shotgun for 3 gun. I went down that road with an M2 tactical, ghost ring sights, pistol grip stock, etc., and I ended up buying a Comfortech stock and 21" barrel and spending a ton more money than I needed to. I would suggest a field model with a 21", 24", or 26" barrel and the Comfortech stock. The pistol grip is just way too awkward when trying to flip the gun for a load 2 or quad load, and my opinion is that a vent rib is faster for the kind of shooting we do than any kind of rifle sights. The Versamax is also a fine shotgun for the game, it's what I use now, moved my Benelli to back up duties. I don't think the Remington is made to the same quality standards as the Benelli, you can look at the internals side by side and the difference is easy to see, BUT, the Versamax can be made to load easier and is way softer shooting (at the expense of being heavier). Both the VM and my Benelli have been super reliable, you can't go wrong with either one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steel1212 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I'm not a full time 3 gunner like some of these guys but I do like it. I also haven't spent a lot of time on reloading the shotgun. Here is my take. Everything needs a pistol grip! :-) Its not hard to load around it. I feel I've got more control of the gun with it. I also shoot a M1 so I don't have a comfort tech option. what I do have is a limbsaver on my pistol grip gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 My vote is a 24" field model, vent rib, comfort tech stock. I found ghost rings too big to be of any value with slugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxymajor Posted July 20, 2014 Share Posted July 20, 2014 (edited) deleted Edited July 20, 2014 by roxymajor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headworked Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 (edited) I also am not an expert 3gunner, but enjoy shooting it immensely... I have been shooting an M1 w standard stock for many years.. I recently got to handle steel1212's and Roxymajors' PG stocked guns, and really enjoyed the way they handled and pointed during walkthrus... It also felt good throwing up on the shoulder for L2 or L4... Rolling the wrist for left hand L2 would take a little practice, but would be no problem.. And then there's always the tried and true weak hand or strong hand caddie load that still works good.. I think the PG option is a decent one for a shooter with some experience and time under his belt as well as a new shooter... It's all what you get used to Edited July 21, 2014 by Headworked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 I'm pretty sure that there is a reason the guys at the top of the 3-gun/shotgun matches run standard stock's. I mean most of those guys could have any configuration they want, and I'm sure have done lots of testing to see what is easiest to use and fastest on the clock. Maybe they just don't know about them yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoky Bear Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 I was once told that the only place a pistol grip belongs is on a....Pistol! Wonder who told me that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headworked Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 (edited) Maybe we should all convert our AR rifle stocks over to Monte Carlo and remove the pistol grips there too Edited July 21, 2014 by Headworked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoky Bear Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Maybe we should all convert our AR rifle stocks over to Monte Carlo and remove the pistol grips there too Or shoot an M-14, which is his rifle of choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxymajor Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Since Steel1911 showed you the strong hand, here is the WEAK HAND LOAD-TWO Pistol Grip Flip. Yes I cherry picked this one! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GQKBHlh74s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxymajor Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 I'm pretty sure that there is a reason the guys at the top of the 3-gun/shotgun matches run standard stock's. I mean most of those guys could have any configuration they want, and I'm sure have done lots of testing to see what is easiest to use and fastest on the clock. Maybe they just don't know about them yet. I think within the last few years it makes more sense to look at the weak hand pistol grip flip because it fits so well with the two-load and four-load. It is an advantage with a ten round tube on loading 2 at a port-arms start and it SEEMs like I am quicker on run-loading. It SEEMS like have more control of the shotty. Besides Taran Bulter (i dont know if he is still using, I have not seem him at a shotty match lately), I don't see any other top shooters using the pistol grip, and they probably won't because that is a huge switch, why re-train their muscle memory? BUT if you are a new shooter and you have a strong right arm, could be a winner. The load to sight/target aquisition recovery (from load to bang) MIGHT be a little quicker also. These are my observations, not facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaranTactical Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 I'm pretty sure that there is a reason the guys at the top of the 3-gun/shotgun matches run standard stock's. I mean most of those guys could have any configuration they want, and I'm sure have done lots of testing to see what is easiest to use and fastest on the clock. Maybe they just don't know about them yet. I think within the last few years it makes more sense to look at the weak hand pistol grip flip because it fits so well with the two-load and four-load. It is an advantage with a ten round tube on loading 2 at a port-arms start and it SEEMs like I am quicker on run-loading. It SEEMS like have more control of the shotty. Besides Taran Bulter (i dont know if he is still using, I have not seem him at a shotty match lately), I don't see any other top shooters using the pistol grip, and they probably won't because that is a huge switch, why re-train their muscle memory? BUT if you are a new shooter and you have a strong right arm, could be a winner. The load to sight/target aquisition recovery (from load to bang) MIGHT be a little quicker also. These are my observations, not facts. Taran is still using a pistol grip for his Benelli. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Well I know the pistol grip is a very new thing. The first ones on Benelli I ever saw was around 1990, and man they were THE rage!! Just about all the top shooters, which are still todays top shooters, had a pistol grip on their shotgun. By 1998 it was hard to find any of the top shooters using one. Sure there are a few die hards like old Tarantino, but the vast majority found out they were slower and abandoned them. I guess the next generation of 3-gunners need to re-discover things for themselves and thats cool. Back in the hay day of the first go around I made a bunch of money selling pistol grip stocks.....then I made a bunch of money selling them their old stocks back. Looks like iI can do it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 I am an older gentleman and I prefer flipping the gun strong side and loading two with my left and the pistol grip gets in the way. I consider myself lucky when I do not rank in the last three. If I were younger and had the time to practice more then I would shoot Taran's benelli as it rocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stlhead Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 The original poster asked a question. People have tried to answer. Differing opinions have been presented. I will give my opinion, but I have no intention of debating over it. I do offer a 100% money back gaurantee. If you do not like or agree with the following statement I will refund every Penney you paid for it. When asked what shotgun I use and recommend, I say this: m2 24" vent rib, comfortech, with the Triangle full meal deal, 9 round tube, no rear sight, no clamp, red fiber. To complete the ensemble I use 7.5 light handicap Remington sts shells. I also prefer the old school weak hand reload. With that said, it don't matter what I like, or what I shot, or how I load. You must always find your own way in the world. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxymajor Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 My only point to earlier was that the top shooters probably never tried the weak hand LOAD_TWO when they were shooting pistol grips. Two and Four loading didn't really come on strong until 5 years ago. You old farts were all strong hand and week hand grab four and stuff'em. The new shooters ought to give it a try (also so when the ATF shows up at a match, I'm not the only one going to jail! ) I know Mr. Weak Hand is not going to change and I'm not going to change, but some of the newer shooters looking for an edge?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 (edited) I would propose that one of us is talking about the actual act of shooting, kind of like how fast you can run a plate rack, transitions left and right, near to far, flying targets etc. And one of us is talking about loading around a pistol grip. Loading is loading, but shooting is quite a different matter. One of us recently shot a world championship IPSC match and not one of the top 20 used a pistol gripped shotgun....and yes they are readily available overseas. Now remember over there they have been doing shotgun only matches for a long time and this wondrous "New loading method" of duces and quads originated over there over 10 years ago, and yet for SHOOTING they won't use a pistol grip.....so throw out all the old guy jokes you want, but one of us has a bunch of testing both personally and results from other top shooters both here and abroad to draw from. Edited July 23, 2014 by kurtm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbrowndog Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Ah yes the recent future past............ Everyone knows everything originates here in the US, 2 and 4 loading didn't come on strong until 5 years ago, yep you're absolutely right!!!! there is a town in the Texas panhandle called Dumas, too!!! just like a 12-19 year old kid saying "yeah, I know" all the time, we all "know" everything when we're young?!?!?!?!? So you're right all the old farts, don't know nuthin', don't confuse education with intelligence, or experience with expertise!!!! You can go to school, but it doesn't make you smart!!! they shot a monkey into space, but it doesn't make it an astronaut!!!! You can buy a pro card but it doesn't make you a pro!! You can see something for the first time but it doesn't mean you discovered it!!! You can be a badass local shooter but it doesn't mean you won't get your butt kicked by some old guy in major match!!! You can see something on youtube, but it doesn't make it a reality!!! Trapr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Headworked, your statement "Maybe we should all convert our AR rifle stocks over to Monte Carlo and remove the pistol grips there too" is amusing, however if we look at it, the AR-15 system was designed as a "straight line recoil" system and a pistol grip is an integral part of that system. The M1/M2/M4/1100/ fill in the blank shotguns were not designed with a "pistol grip" in mind, it is an add on. Much the same way as converting an M1A to a pistol grip stock. It is awkward and unwieldy and wasn't designed that way, and in my opinion makes either platform harder to shoot well..... but doesn't really change the loading of either system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cas Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 Stopped reading at "shotty". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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