USPSA 8-shot Revo -- the first in the nation?

[Carmoney]

OK guys, I believe I was the very first competitor in the U.S. to legally compete in Revolver Division with an 8-shot revolver--firing all 8 rounds between reloads--in a sanctioned USPSA event. I was the only wheelgunner in the morning rotation of day one of the WIIT indoor championship at the Pine Tree Pistol Club in Rockford, Illinois. We began shooting at 7:00 a.m. central time on February 1, 2014, and I was the first shooter on the squad. I fired 8 shots on the first array (2 paper and 4 steel poppers), then reloaded and finished out the stage.

Can anybody prove me wrong? Did anyone on the east coast get in ahead of me?

Either way, I had a lot of fun today. 8-shot revolver is a great platform to shoot. Everybody should try it, at least once.

Edited February 2, 2014 by Carmoney

[Shadowrider]

Hmmm... You probably beat ChrisC and Bubber. They shot revo today but the match doesn't start that early.

BTW, ChrisC did very very well too, he beat out several A, B and at least one M class shooter in Lim, SS and Prod. All with his revo. I think he took 8th overall out of 48.

Edited February 2, 2014 by Shadowrider

[The Antichrome]

OK guys, I believe I was the very first competitor in the U.S. to legally compete with an 8-shot revolver--firing all 8 rounds between reloads--in a sanctioned USPSA event.

Either way, I had a lot of fun today. 8-shot revolver is a great platform to shoot. Everybody should try it, at least once.

You mean in Revolver Division specifically right? Cuz I've seen 8 shot revos in "sanctioned USPSA events" before...just not in the Revolver Division.

[alecmc]

I was the first to shoot on my squad around 9am eastern time.... so you might of still beat me

[pskys2]

And so the Journey begins!!!

[DavidSnethkamp]

I made it by 7 PM, you win

[Gregg K]

Mike

Did you figure out how many reloads that you eliminated at this match by running an 8 shooter and what the difference in points due to minor scoring? I'm betting that if you were shooting against yourself with a 6 shooter that the 8 would have killed the 6 shooter. Most revo shooters hit mostly Alphas anyway and 6 shot arrays are not the norm.

[ChuckS]

We had a guy on our squad who started at 0800 PST. So, he was not first but it was really interesting. Unlike Mike, who has been all over this, this guy came back to the game after 15 years! He said that he had a 45 ACP wheelie but his arm couldn't take the beating. He brought out his 8 shot 38 and had a great time. And he shot pretty well for being away for 1.5 decades. The match (Norco) was pretty much single-stack friendly (getting ready for the WSSSC) so his 8-shot worked very well. I guess that this change is doing what it was supposed to do (in one case, at least). He did mention that he was really considering about shooting the match this morning. Up his average to one match in 7.5 years

Well done!

Chuck

[ChrisC]

1st "legal" 8 gunner

[ChrisC]

Greg if I was shooting against a 6 shooter in okc they would have called the coroner. Every stage I saved standing reloads except the classifer. It favored the major 6.

[Carmoney]

OK guys, I believe I was the very first competitor in the U.S. to legally compete with an 8-shot revolver--firing all 8 rounds between reloads--in a sanctioned USPSA event.

Either way, I had a lot of fun today. 8-shot revolver is a great platform to shoot. Everybody should try it, at least once.

You mean in Revolver Division specifically right? Cuz I've seen 8 shot revos in "sanctioned USPSA events" before...just not in the Revolver Division.

Correct--by capitalizing Revo in the thread title I meant Revolver Division, but I have clarified the original post.

[Carmoney]

Mike

Did you figure out how many reloads that you eliminated at this match by running an 8 shooter and what the difference in points due to minor scoring? I'm betting that if you were shooting against yourself with a 6 shooter that the 8 would have killed the 6 shooter. Most revo shooters hit mostly Alphas anyway and 6 shot arrays are not the norm.

I didn't try to figure that out, Gregg. I think this match favored the 8-shot. I definitely saved some reloads, but several of those extra reloads would have been on the move where they don't eat up much time. My hits were good, but I think I was a little more tentative than normal, knowing I needed more A hits with the minor scoring. I was sorta shooting in ICORE mode, know what I mean?

One other factor--they had a couple big steel poppers that must have been calibrated a little too heavy, because they did not go down even with perfectly centered hits. This happened to me twice, on two separate stages. Both times I went ahead and shot them down with a second shot, but it threw me off plan and hurt my performance on those stages. My ammo has been tested over multiple chronographs and runs 133 p.f. (using 142-gr. MGs).

I view this as a downside of the 8-shot revolver that I had not really considered. This would not have happened with my 625. With a production or SS minor pistol, a recalcitrant popper is not usually a big deal, because you normally have some extra rounds in the gun--with an 8-shot revolver, you may not have that extra round to spare, and it may force you to make an extra unplanned reload. We all hate those, right?

Makes me wonder if running a little hotter ammo might make sense--especially for local level matches where they may not always have the steel well-calibrated? With my world repository of loaded .38 Short Colts, I think I'm just gonna need to remember to aim a little high on big poppers!

Edited February 2, 2014 by Carmoney

[ChrisC]

I dropped 31 points through 6 stages. I did have a mike and it happened to be on the same target my delta came from. No major shooters showed up just me and bubber shooting the 8 shots. I dont see how a 6 gun would have kept up in the match a lot of 8 shot arrays only avaliable from one spot.

[pskys2]

Steel is a problem for all minor at some point, especially outside.

So any issues with the bullet/load?

I guarantee I won't be able to slow down, ICORE Mode HA! I'm just counting on the lighter recoil moving most of those D's to C's and C's to A's.

Or it may be a long year.

[Tom E]

Steel is a problem for all minor at some point, especially outside.

Seems to depend if the poppers are forward falling or the (older) rear falling poppers. I shot a man on man steel side match where we played with the forward falling poppers beforehand. The big forward falling poppers fell ~50% of the time with a centered hit of 22 LR from a 6" 617.

Edited February 2, 2014 by Tom E

[Gregg K]

I dropped 31 points through 6 stages. I did have a mike and it happened to be on the same target my delta came from. No major shooters showed up just me and bubber shooting the 8 shots. I dont see how a 6 gun would have kept up in the match a lot of 8 shot arrays only avaliable from one spot.

Hey Chris

The silver lining part of this story is that a Mike scores the same, major or minor.

[ChrisC]

yes they do....

[Jaxshooter]

Mike

I am shooting 147 gr BBI bullets over N-320 powder in my 38 super revolver at 135 PF and it takes down the steel with no problems even on slightly low hits.

[pskys2]

Forward falling poppers don't usually need any calibrating, their trap is to NOT take a 2nd shot unless you know you missed. Seen a few reset by being hit a 2nd time. Rear falling ones do and I'd say that's the most prevalent still.

[robertson]

We had a guy on our squad who started at 0800 PST. So, he was not first but it was really interesting. Unlike Mike, who has been all over this, this guy came back to the game after 15 years! He said that he had a 45 ACP wheelie but his arm couldn't take the beating. He brought out his 8 shot 38 and had a great time. And he shot pretty well for being away for 1.5 decades. The match (Norco) was pretty much single-stack friendly (getting ready for the WSSSC) so his 8-shot worked very well. I guess that this change is doing what it was supposed to do (in one case, at least). He did mention that he was really considering about shooting the match this morning. Up his average to one match in 7.5 years

Well done!

Chuck

Thanks for the kind words Chuck, I really enjoyed it.

John

[Carmoney]

Steel is a problem for all minor at some point, especially outside.

So any issues with the bullet/load?

Just out of curiosity, I chronoed my short colts, and they are at 131 PF from the gun I shot at the WIIT. That's with ice cold ammo straight out of my range bag that was left in the car all night long in single-digit temperatures. I don't think I have an ammo problem, although a little more power might be a good thing.

Interestingly, my 6.5" 27-7 (the gun I shot) is the slower of my match guns. My 5" 627-5 shot the same load at 137 PF. So from here on, I believe I will run my 5" 627 in USPSA matches, where I could use a little more power for steel, and save the 27-7 for steel and ICORE matches.

Another good reason for that is I had yet another issue with my CR Speed holster releasing my gun unintentionally. They had a stage where you had to start lying face-down on a padded bench--on the start signal, you rolled off the side, grabbed your gun off a low table to shoot the stage. During my walk-through, I did a practice roll-out and my 27-7 popped right through the lock and nearly fell on the floor--luckily one of the holes in the front of the cylinder happened to come straight down on the little muzzle peg at the bottom of the holster. I froze in place and called for an RO, and eventually we were able to get the gun loose, although it was stuck on there very tightly--it took real force to free the gun. I run the frickin' CR Speed rig only with the 6.5" gun because of the long barrel--otherwise, I use a Blade-Tech kydex holster for my 5" guns.

Another reminder that speed holsters are not worth the hassle.

[Bubber]

I find that the lighter bullet making the same PF of the heavier bullet seems to dissipate most of it's energy and does not have enough left to drop a slightly heavier set popper. Been there done that.

[Carmoney]

I find that the lighter bullet making the same PF of the heavier bullet seems to dissipate most of it's energy and does not have enough left to drop a slightly heavier set popper. Been there done that.

That has always been the conventional wisdom, but on the other hand I shot most of the last 3 seasons with Production and SS pistols in 9mm, shooting minor loads of 95-gr. MG JHP at around 1350fps, and had no problems taking down steel.

[pskys2]

I find that the lighter bullet making the same PF of the heavier bullet seems to dissipate most of it's energy and does not have enough left to drop a slightly heavier set popper. Been there done that.

That has always been the conventional wisdom, but on the other hand I shot most of the last 3 seasons with Production and SS pistols in 9mm, shooting minor loads of 95-gr. MG JHP at around 1350fps, and had no problems taking down steel.

I seem to remember 3 re-shoots on the all steel course of A3 a couple of years ago? Granted every time it was a different plate and did NOT fail even with match ammo from the position you shot, and I'm sure those were 115 or 124 9mm's. But each time it was an angled shot. So I'd surmise that with head on shots, you're right it doesn't matter, but as the angles get more extreme, it may.

But I'd think a 142 at 130+PF should fit even within conventional wisdom.

[Carmoney]

Dave, I think when the official calibration gun failed to take down those poppers three separate times in a row, that pretty well establishes that it wasn't my load!

Overall, I believe my little 95-gr. zingers take steel just as well as the heavy bullets loaded to the same P.F. I have not done any testing, but I will tell you that I have shot a lot of matches with my 95-gr. 9mms over the past several years (including a bunch of major USPSA matches, Big Dawgs, and Pro-Am matches), and frankly I wouldn't be using that load if it were iffy on steel.