.223 MOR load (factory?

[michael_aos]

I'm not (wasn't) ready to jump into MOR with both feet.

I bought a Remington 700P, 26" barrel, 1:9" twist .223.

Badger 1pc 20-minute scope mount, badger 30mm rings w/1" reducers.

HS Precision 5rd detachable box magazine.

Now I'm looking for some good "match quality" factory ammo and / or suggestions on handloaded ammo.

For right now, I'm mostly concerned with targets at 300yds - 400yds.

I've tried some blue-box Black Hills 68gr and 69gr and I wasn't impressed. Maybe it's me.

Suggestions? (besides getting a .260 or .308)

Mike

[rhino]

Wow! I was going to suggest the Black Hills 68gr and 69gr until I read you'd already tried it! What kind of groups did you get?

How about Federal's high end 69gr load?

[rkgsmith]

Love the federal 69 grain HPBTM. Whenever I have 300 yard targets that 's what I stuff the mag with.

[paraman1]

Try 24.3-25.0 grains of Varget and the 75 grain Hornady AMAX with the Federal Match primer . You may have to try loading it out to within .005 of the lands which would make you rifle a single shot (depending on length of magazine). Works well out of my Savage with a 1-9 twist out to 600 yards .

[michael_aos]

Wow!  I was going to suggest the Black Hills 68gr and 69gr until I read you'd already tried it!  What kind of groups did you get?

How about Federal's high end 69gr load?

I guess I don't remember what the groups looked like. Just that I wasn't "wowed" like I thought I would be.

I just checked, and I've only shot 4rds of the 69gr and 6rds of the 68gr blue-box Black Hills I bought back in July.

I guess I need to take it out and seriously try it.

I _do_ recall that my best groups were with Winchester 45gr "varmint" value-packs from Wal-Mart.

Mike

[George]

Michael,

If you have at least a 1:8 barrel twist rate, screw the 69’s from Federal and Black Hills. My re-load of the SMK 69 over 24.5gr of Varget get’s sub-moa in good AR’s, but is still not a good choice at 250+ in the wind.

If you are shooting a bolt action, you should jump right to the 75-80 grainers. Because you are shooting a bolter, you can load the 80gr VLD’s at the length they require and put yourself right into real high BC country.

For loading good stuff myself, I would look at SMK 77’s, or anyone else’s 75 grainer over 24 to 25 grains of Varget (work it up from under 24gr and load at least 2.260” OAL, or longer).

Varget might be a compressed load under the 80 grainers unless you have the throat to load real long. AA2520 is also a good choice under the 80’s. Chuck 22.5 to 23gr under an 80gr loaded real long and you will probably be very happy without a lot of messing around.

Federal and Black hills both load 75 & 77’s. I would do it myself if I was looking for real consistency. It‘s almost all in the case prep and selection once you have a good powder choice under a good projectile choice.

******************

Edited to note that I failed to note you specified 1:9 twist. I will amend my advice to try no heavier than 75, or 77 because the 80 almost certainly won’t stabilize in 1:9. I sure wish you had a 1:8, or 1:7 because you would be in phat city for long distance with that .223 bolter. Try pushing the SMK 69 up to 2950-3000fps (but do it slowly and carefully). In a long barrel bolt action that is achievable. Load long with AA2520 and try pushing it up until you hit 3k, or primers flatten nicely. At anywhere around 3k fps, the SMK 69 should do a reasonable job at 3-400 yards once you find a velocity node for your barrel. Factory loading will not get there as they are tailored to be safe and feed in AR’s too.

--

Regards

Edited December 7, 2004 by George

[rishii]

Mike,

I have a 700p with a leupiod 8.5x25 on it.

the best factory load I've found for it is remington's 62gr, hpbtm, it's listed as a LE load, and last time I checked with not listed with their sporting ammo.

for hand loads, I've always had good results with a 55gr berger hp, over 27 gr of

W 748 loaded in norma brass.

for heavier bullets, try berger 62 gr over W748.

and like george posted case prep is important, and if you don't feel like weighting cases, neck turning, primer pocket uniforming, flash hole de-burring, get some

norma brass from

http://www.sinclairintl.com/cgi-bin/catego...BRNO&type=store

it's expensive, but its worth it.

also I've never been satified with any 69gr load thru my rifle.

[Tom Freeman]

I would get some dies for your 550 and work up a load.

[michael_aos]

I would get some dies for your 550 and work up a load.

How'd I know you were going to say that....

Yes, it's on my to-do list. But it's a large short-term outlay of cash for everything to convert my 550B to .223.

Plus powder, projectiles and brass.

Plus any additional case-prep tools.

All for a gun I don't currently shoot that much. I've probably put 2K through my AR in the time I put 100 through the 700P. Lately Grace has been shooting it more than I have.

Mike

[bgary]

I've tried some blue-box Black Hills 68gr and 69gr and I wasn't impressed. Maybe it's me.

I had the same experience - the Black Hills 68gr blue-box stuff was not very impressive. Not "bad", just not what I thought it should be.

What really works well, both in my 700 and my AR, is their blue-box 62-grain stuff. Shoots absolutely awesome groups in both rifles out to 300 yards (which is pretty much the limit of my ability to discriminate value)... and over the chrono the velodity spread was something like 10 fps.

Unfortunately, BH doesn't make that load any more. Something about their Israeli supplier of 62gr projectiles diverting production to "other needs".

So, I'm hoarding the last few hundred rounds I have, and hoping that I can work up an equivalent load before I run out.

BTW - tell me about the HS-precision box mag? Do you like it? Was it worth the $$$?

Bruce

[EricW]

I've tried some blue-box Black Hills 68gr and 69gr and I wasn't impressed.  Maybe it's me.

I had the same experience - the Black Hills 68gr blue-box stuff was not very impressive. Not "bad", just not what I thought it should be.

I heard that Black Hills uses two different brands of bullets in their loads:

1) Hornady

2) And when the run out of the Hornady: Speer.

Guess which one shoots better? Apparently you can detect Speer by the presence of an "S" at the end of the part # or lot #, if I remember correctly.

[/Anecdotal Hearsay Mode]

[rhino]

What should I try in my Rem 700 .223? I think the twist is 1-12. Should I try mostly 45, 52, and 55gr loads?

[George]

Yeah, 55 and lighter in a 1:12. 52’s should be a good choice.

--

Regards,

[rhino]

Thanks!

[michael_aos]

BTW - tell me about the HS-precision box mag? Do you like it? Was it worth the $$$?

Bruce

Hmm. I guess I'm not sure yet. I want to say it was $200 for the conversion with 1 magazine. Then something like $75/each for the 2 additional magazines.

They're nearly flush-fit, and with the o-ring they take a firm push to seat. That might improve with use.

The first one worked great. It took 4 or 5 of the additional magazines to find 2 that functioned. Actually, I never did get any more that functioned. I finally gave up exchanging them and took a Dremel tool to the feed lips. They seem fine now.

I didn't care for the blind magazine, so I'd say the detachable box magazines are better than that. But probably not $350 better.

I think the gun was like $799, plus $300 for Badger Ordnance base, 30mm rings and 1" ring reducers. Then the box magazine kit, and $200ish for a Bushnell Scopechief 4.5-14x50mm scope. If I had to do it all over again, I'd probably just buy another AR or a nice Limited pistol.

Maybe I'll change my tune if I can get some MOA groups at 400yds.

Mike

[spring]

Jumping into this thread 2 years later with a similar question:

What do I need to know to consider that the projectile is sufficiently stabilized? Since I get some nickel-sized groups at 100 yards, can I assume that they won't start tumbling at two or three or four-hundred yards?

(60 gr V-max work nicely, but I'd like to stretch the range with 75 gr MHP's from my short 1:9 barrel.)

Thanks.

[michael_aos]

Here's what I'm planning for local matches this year.

Remington 700P LTR.

24" Lilja barrel in 260 Remington

Bennie Cooley brake

Badger alloy 20MOA base

Badger alloy standard rings (.823)

Leupold Mark 4 2.5-8x36mm M2 w/TMR reticle

HS Precision detachable box magazine

Badger bolt-knob

Harris bipod w/Pod-Loc

[smokshwn]

michael,

that should work nicely. have you spent any time over on

www.snipershide.com

great site for info on everything concerning precision rifles

[Religious Shooter]

Michael,

Hey how much was the Cooley brake and install? Who did the work? How much does the reticle lift at 8X? Can you see you hits? That looks cool.

[ShooterSteve]

I know this thread is a little dated, but don't overlook the Berger 73gr BT over 24.5gr of Varget in the 223. This load comes straight from the Berger shop for loads in the 300-400 yard range.

That's a nice looking rig you have there Michael!

Steve

[George]

What do I need to know to consider that the projectile is sufficiently stabilized? Since I get some nickel-sized groups at 100 yards, can I assume that they won't start tumbling at two or three or four-hundred yards?

(60 gr V-max work nicely, but I'd like to stretch the range with 75 gr MHP's from my short 1:9 barrel.)

Thanks.

You need to shoot the 60's at 400+ to know what they do terminally. Back when the 68/69's were all that was available in heavies, I found out that my SMK 69's doing 2900ish were going subsonic and keyholing the target at 600 yards by actually shooting at that distance.

Depending on their starting velocity, my guess is that the 60's are gonna' stay chill till about 500 yards (if they are moving up near 2900 fps to start with that is) and then they are gonna' go sub-sonic and drop like they are on an express elevator. Check your muzzle velocity on a chrono and then run a ballistic program using the BC for the 60 V-max. When it drops sub-sonic is when it typically de-stabilizes and flys erratically.

The 75's may, or may not like a 1:9 twist. Hafta' try it to see, but my guess is less than likely that they will properly stabilize in a 1:9. A 1:8 is the minimum recommended twist for 75grains + in a .223 projectile, but ocassionally they do run downrange OK in some 1:9 bbls.

[Dan Sierpina]

75 grain Hornady hollow points, not A-Max bullets will stabilize in a 9 inch twist barrel. I have a Wilson 9 inch twist, 18 1/2" long barrel on my AR. For the heck of it, I took some 75 HP's that were left from shooting Highpower, to try. Pleasantly surprised to get a nice small group, sub 1/2". Be aware, that button rifled barrels can vary a bit in twist. Douglas, I believe states a twist tolerance of plus or minus 1/2" on the twist.

[jer]

i have a rem. 700 tactical with a 6x18 leupold on it .it has a 20 inch barrel on it .it just loves hornady 75 gr. tap ammo ,and handloads of 52 gr. berger bullets with 26grs.h335 powder and 28 grs .of h380 with same bullet .