Target Aquisition on the Draw

[benos]

If you haven't acquired the front sight, looking at the target won't help much.

Eyes should be focused in the near field, in front of the chest. As the pistol comes up, and you push it out, your eyes will already be focused at the distance of the sights. Acquire the sights and then move them to the target.

Your mind will remember where the target is. But, your eyes have to acquire the sights.

You can prove this by watching other shooters. When you see a shooter who focuses on the target, you'll note that he/she misses a lot of first shots -- or, at least, takes a long time to get prepared for that shot.

My teacher said that the muscles that control the lens of the eye can relax (move to long focus) faster than they can contract (move to short focus). All I know is, acquiring the sights is job one when engaging any target at any distance.

Is this the reason why some say to shoot the further targets first?

I don't know if I'd go with that. I could pick up a razor sharp front sight focus on a 5 yard target as quickly as I could get a razor sharp front sight focus on a 25 yard target.

[northernbird]

Brian, If I understand you correctly, your saying theres really not much of a difference between the sight focus for a 5yrd shot or a 25yrd shot.. in both cases your focused on where your sights are going to appear when you are in your index position. I think that makes sense to me.

[benos]

Brian, If I understand you correctly, your saying theres really not much of a difference between the sight focus for a 5yrd shot or a 25yrd shot.. in both cases your focused on where your sights are going to appear when you are in your index position.

Yes that's it.

[Koppi]

Why in gun fights do the guns or hand/s the gun is in get shot?

I think its because in the normal corse of stress people look at the point of interest/threat first. Therefore, the gun you are holding comes into the sighting plane which is in the focus of the threat.

With that said, which is in focus? Both?

[Chris_C]

You cannot focus on two points at different distances at the same time.

[triggerhound]

Personally, I find it easier to shoot at the closer targets first, because sight picture is easier at closer distances. Larger targets are inherently easier to hit

[SoCalNoMore]

I have read and practiced the "close your eyes and bring sights to alignment" procedure.

What has really worked for me may not work for others, but here it is. While in your shooting stance bring the pistol up to sights aligned and ready to fire position. Fixate on how you are standing, where your arms are and how the sights are aligned. Then put the gun in the holster. Close your eyes and bring the gun back up to firing position and where you "feel" the sights are aligned. Practice this until you get it perfect "all" of the time.

For advanced training, do this same drill and now add a target to align the sights too. Get the rear sights, front sights and the bulls-eye all aligned after closing your eyes and you will be able to get your first shot off without even looking. A bit of sarcasm with that last statement.

Muscle memory will assist you with that first shot.

Now if I could only remember where I read this.......

Edited April 12, 2013 by SoCalNoMore

[benos]

A similar technique worked well for me... With the sights perfectly aligned, in your Index Position, close your eyes and remember the upper body's total feeling as one feeling. The open your eyes and holster the psitol. The close your eyes, summon the total feeling, and draw into it. Open your eyes and note the sight picture. Repeat - forever.

be

[loneranger04]

Good information. I've shot pistol all my life however it was for bullseye or slow fire competitions where you have plenty of time to aquire and line up your sights. Now shooting 3gun and IDPA I'm way behind on the learning curve and haven't been very competitive, especially with pistol which bothers me because I used to be the one to beat at slow fire. Much different style of shooting. I'll try focusing closer before the buzzer however, at the age of 54, my eye doc tells me I'm getting catracts already. Having a terrible time seeing sights, especially shooting fast.

[Koppi]

Lonerange04, you maybe luck'er than you think. A friend who is now in his 60's had new lenses put in his eyes. He says he see better now than he ever did. He had his right eye set up for iron sights and his left for longer distance.

Shooting fast is just a matter of letting it happen, your not shooting 10's. I would call it mass shooting-- go fast take chances, get a D once in a while. :-)

[eric nielsen]

This thread has helped me, not just in getting on the sights. Found that alternating ~3 reps eyes-open with ~3 reps eyes-closed (many times) tends to let the body settle into movements that are "natural" for your arms' range of motion.

Rather than commanding the arms/hands/gun to look a certain way and evaluating the "feel" of making that enforced motion (what we do with all-eyes-open training), with the eyes-shut reps we let the body use its own way of swiveling the shoulder, elbow, and wrist joints to reach the objective. Then the eyes-open reps get you accustomed to seeing this motion and being visually comfortable with it. The eyes tell you when you're getting too out of line (inefficient) and the no-eyes tells you when you're making things too complicated.

Helped a lot with a change in my surrender draw - went from wrists barely above shoulders (most efficient) to hands touching ears/earmuffs (most consistent); also helps a ton with the Production mag change (which is worth a whole other thread).

[Not-So-Mad Matt]

I've shot pistol all my life however it was for bullseye or slow fire competitions where you have plenty of time to aquire and line up your sights. Now shooting 3gun and IDPA I'm way behind on the learning curve and haven't been very competitive, especially with pistol which bothers me because I used to be the one to beat at slow fire. Much different style of shooting.

Out of curiosity, loneranger04, how did you, as a bullseye shooter, perform on the IDPA Classifier? Any idea what your Stage 3 score was? (The question of bullseye shooters taking the Classifier came up in another"]another thread.)

Edited April 13, 2013 by Not-So-Mad Matt

[abq87120]

What works fairly well for me is 1) Get the gun up and get on the front sight. 2) Get the front sight on the target. 3) Get the rear sights / whole sight picture correct. I still make mistakes but this sequence is what I strive for. I have to remind myself to work through the steps but it's like remembering to feel for the trigger reset in my Glock. That one simple little step really makes the trigger pull a lot easier. Little things count for me if I remember them. FWIW, I'm a noob and am just beginning to get tuned in to my techniques so take what I say with a grain of salt, lol.

Edited April 14, 2013 by abq87120

[loneranger04]

I've shot pistol all my life however it was for bullseye or slow fire competitions where you have plenty of time to aquire and line up your sights. Now shooting 3gun and IDPA I'm way behind on the learning curve and haven't been very competitive, especially with pistol which bothers me because I used to be the one to beat at slow fire. Much different style of shooting.

Out of curiosity, loneranger04, how did you, as a bullseye shooter, perform on the IDPA Classifier? Any idea what your Stage 3 score was? (The question of bullseye shooters taking the Classifier came up in another thread.)

I haven't shot Bullseye since the mid 70s. Where I was good at slow fire was black powder matches and metallic silouettes (small local matches). Idpa I classified as a Sharpshooter CDP. Worked hard but never could get any better than that. In 3gun I shoot tac opts and am not very hard to beat. Getting older and fatter and slower. But I've been trying to focus my eyes to arms length before drawing the pistol and it really helps picking up the sights faster. I guess my biggest problem is nerves. Can't seem to control them and my whole game plan goes out the window as soon as the buzzer goes off. Enjoying the tips though. Keep them coming.

[sroe3]

Sometimes I practice this without a gun. Focus on a point as the target. I bring my hands from drawing position together, then up to my line of sight. I visually focus on my thumb as I press out. It's exercise for my eyes, and reps of what I expect from my focus and draw motion. At steel last week I was sometimes breaking shots before finishing my press out due to quick sight acquisition.

[S197Shelby]

My latest drill to improve this I have been using clay pigeons. I have them set on stands at varying distances. On beep draw and fire on one pigeon. I havent set par times so much as just trying to improve my times.

[redial]

In order to pre-focus your eyes at front sight distance before the buzzer, what do you look at? I've been trying all kinds of goofy experiments, looking for a reference.

Thanks

[eric nielsen]

I pick the furthest dry-fire target I can place in my house, then focus back onto the front sight, then make mental note of the apparent distance between the double-vision image(s) of that target. Then I holster the gun. Then I force the same amount of double vision. Then I draw to the split target on the right. Sights come up under my right eye on the draw.

Since starting this I'm seeing the serrations in the top of my CZ Shadow slide distinctly as the sights are moving into position. Before a week ago I never noticed that at all. Also the front sight is in focus very noticeable sooner than before. That's even carrying over to target transitions.

Edited April 18, 2013 by eric nielsen

[spanky]

If you haven't acquired the front sight, looking at the target won't help much.

Eyes should be focused in the near field, in front of the chest. As the pistol comes up, and you push it out, your eyes will already be focused at the distance of the sights. Acquire the sights and then move them to the target.

Your mind will remember where the target is. But, your eyes have to acquire the sights.

You can prove this by watching other shooters. When you see a shooter who focuses on the target, you'll note that he/she misses a lot of first shots -- or, at least, takes a long time to get prepared for that shot.

My teacher said that the muscles that control the lens of the eye can relax (move to long focus) faster than they can contract (move to short focus). All I know is, acquiring the sights is job one when engaging any target at any distance.

Is this the reason why some say to shoot the further targets first?

I can't speak for everyone but, at least for me, I go with the harder shot first because I find it easier for myself to speed up than slow down.

[sroe3]

My first shot is always double action so I try to plan the closest shot first as much as possible.