Trigger staging I caught my myself doing it

[Shoepop]

I'm new to revolver shooting and caught myself staging the trigger between transitions. I was getting it about half way pulled before on next target. It really seemed to settle gun down not having to get on target and full stroke the trigger. I then tried it on the draw but that was not as easy to do. I had a few premature shots before on target, nothing close but sure not on target. It sure seems like the way to go. Something I need to concentrate on perfecting ? Thanks

[firewalker]

Yes staging a revolver trigger is a very usefull technique. With that being said , You have to be careful where you are willing to stage it. I practice staging with dryfires, transistions. A lot of revolver shooters start a draw from holster as a quick wrist snap bringing the gun out 45 degrees pointed down range and stage as you extend and pick up as much of your front sight as u choose to use , CAUTION THERE IS NOTHING AS NASTY AS HAVING A ACCIDENTAL DISCHARGE IN HOLSTER

In competition you must stage to be fast and accurate, just be sure to invest a lot of practice into it before u try and shoot a match. saftey is always a first concern...

[hopalong]

Shoepop,

Instead of "stageing" the trigger, if you don't have a timer borrow one and figgure out how long it takes you to get a good sight picture and smoothly stroke the tigger and get another sight picture and smoothly stroke the trigger again but not stopping between shots.

example buzzer, draw gun comes up sees sights on target smoothly go through trigger, bang sights go up while sights are going up release trigger and start smoothly through the trigger again, sights come down settle on target bang.

might be something like this on the timer.

first shot 1.82 second shot .38

now try at more than one target, what you are looking for is what ever time it takes you to draw, get a good sight picture and go through the trigger smoothly and in rythem, what this does is keeps the hammer moving all the time and gets rid of the "dead time" in staging the trigger.

here is what you should get if you have 3 targets say 15 yds away wide open.

draw 2.10( these are random made up times so don't use them as a reference)

.42 second shot .40-.45 third shot(between targets) .42 fourth shot, .40-.45 fifth shot (between targets) and another .42

the biggest way to gain time is speed up between targets esp if they are evenly spaced a good smooth rythem will beat two fast shots, slow transition to 2nd target 2 fast shots and slow transition to 3rd target and 2 last shots.

Stageing the trigger is keeping it moving while the gun moves yes but most peoples staging has a stop in the middle of the stage, you are on the right track now just keep the hammer moving and don't stop until you have got the target(s) taken care of.

lets do the math for the above. 2.10+.42+.45+.42+.41.+42=4.22

now lets do the match for fast slow fast slow

draw will be the same 2.10+.28+.85+.25+.84+.21=4.48

now see the difference? plus the other way you actually have more tme between shots to watch the sights.

Good luck! welcome to the wonderful world of revolvers, keep working and keep asking, I wish I had something like this when I started doing this!!!

And as Firewalker stressed be carefull (extra, extra) when drawing, I myself do not prep the trigger until the gun has come halfway up from the draw and am already seeing the sights.

Hopalong

[dajarrel]

Shoepop,

You have the right idea.

My hero (Jerry M) made the comment that if you are waiting until you are on target to start the cylinder turning, you are wasting alot of time.

Within arrays, I am always trying pull the trigger (stage it) as I transition. Between arrays requires holding off a touch, especially if you are moving.

I too, would advise caution on starting the trigger pull early in the draw. I haven't had one go off in the holster, but I have seen one.

FWIW

dj

[D.carden]

Heres something that might help!

stageing the trigger too early might cause an AD. If your timing is good (dry firing well enable you to see this coming) your eyes will always "lead" first to the next target. Once you see the target (leading) begin your staging, when the sights line-up , "BANG". REPEAT-REPEAT-REPEAT etc. Its smooth and splits are the same . I practice the same 3 target drill Jerry does in his video for speed practice, the trigger never stops moving, i see the next target before the sights get there and start the staging then. Hits are good. Times are as follows: Draw .90 shot-to-shot .19/.21 , all 6 shots 1.8 to 2.0. It can be done.

Dan

[Shoepop]

Thanks very much gentlemen. I will take all the wisdom you provided and apply it. I just got classified, middle C so I have a loooooong hard road to hoe and can use any and all help I can get. Thanks again, Shoepop

[benos]

There's two kinds of revolver shooters - those who stage and those that don't.

For me, staging was a natural tendency. But after serious experimenting, I learn to replace it with a straight pull, that although it may slow down toward the end (or may not, depending on the shot), it never actually stopped, ever. That was the most valuable thing I learned, that helped me to shoot a revolver consistently and accurately. But that's just me. But if you're a stager, you might give it a whirl for a month or two. Don't even stage when shooting groups of a sandbag, and especially avoid the tendency to stage on the first shot. I know it sounds crazy, but if you don't really try it, you'll never know.

be

[D.carden]

Good point Brian,

Being a full-time revo shooter, the staging part of my game has become a natural reflex and is not a mental thought at all. Thats where you get when ( with lots of practice ) you shoot one type of gun only.

Dan

[Ron Ankeny]

I used to stage the trigger all the time in PPC. By staging, I mean yanking the trigger back until the cylinder stop dropped into the notch, then I would stop and pull through for a precision shot. I quit doing that and just went with a continous pull like Brian describes. To each his own, but I wouldn't recommend staging a trigger at all.

[rwmagnus]

My expierences have been when I "stage" (prep the trigger) it speeds up my times. I don't like the term "staging" as I understand it to be taking up the trigger to the single action point, pausing then releasing the shot. Rather what I believe is being discussed is preping the trigger (taking up half the split time) or better yet keeping the cylinder moving while comming into the target.

As already stated your finger is never placed on the trigger while in the holster during the draw. There should never be an accidental or holster discharge of the weapon.

I start the trigger pull after the gun clears the holster and the weak hand gets it's grip. There is plenty of time to take up the trigger during the forward press to the target. I just wish I was better at it. From time to time I find my transition and trigger prep get out of time and I release the shot when the sights weren't right. Shortly thereafter I find myself acquiring a new target with a dead gun (no trigger prep), old habits die hard!

As others have state practice it both ways to see which provides better results or feels more comfortable.

[redmist10]

Besides the potential for a Negligent Discharge there is also the possibility that you might relax the trigger pull in a moment of hesitation (say, you don't quite have a good sight picture and you relax the trigger pull ever so slightly). This may cause the cylinder to roll just enough that when you actually follow through on the trigger pull (after relaxing) the cylinder will have moved enough to cause the hammer to fall on the next round - if this is a spent round it causes you to have to "click" on five dead rounds before the final one goes off.

I've seen this happen on lightened trigger pulls and it seems like an eternity as you listen to "click, click, CLICK, CLICK, CLICK - BANG! Most of the times I've seen this happen on older guns that are beginning to "go out of time."

If you're new to revolver shooting I would not recommend "staging." Concentrate on consistent and S-M-O-O-T-H trigger pulls.

Steve

[D.carden]

My defention of staging is getting the trigger moving before the sights are fully on target, also, keeping it moving continuosly.

[JohnRodriguez]

hey Mark

you shouldn't be trying to stage your trigger, your first shot should be a sight picture, roll trigger, you should alway roll your trigger, not yank it or jerk the heck out of it. Your better off taking an extra .2-.3 sec to get a first good shoot than chucking lead and missing.

tomarrow i'll give you a demonstration in Deming, it'll be a snap roll and shoot, snap roll and shoot etc when we shoot the steel.

also did you get load data I sent you???

[firewalker]

OK i must clarify what i meant...If staging is taking the trigger to the place where the cylinder bolt ingages and hestating...Then i dont stage...What makes the most sence to me is Preping the trigger...the trigger is always moving as i shoot, and i agree smooth should be your goal, speed will come with practice.

My example would be on a close classifier....draw shoot 2 body and 1 head...7 yrds..When i shoot with no PREP...2.5 secs is as fast as i can shoot cleanly. On the other hand if i prep after the draw and break at extension, second shot preping as sight lowers from recoil, preping as sight rises and break as it starts down the head. then 1.7 and 1.8 become possible... Like lots of techiniques it works for somethings, But now for where it dosent work...I had 2 shoot targets a no shoot and another shoot...2 to each target...I figured heh id just use cadence and pause as i swung over no shoot right? my mistake was looking at the no shoot....either way the preping as u pass over something u dont want to shoot is a bad idea...just my .02 worth

[Bubber]

I will just muddy up the waters just a little. If staging a trigger means the trigger come to a complete stop prior to firing and preping the trigger is a constant pull through. I do both. In IPSC I will seldom ever stop the trigger when engaging an array of targets. But In ICORE on the LONG SHOTS, 25 to 50 yards I will stop the trigger and spend a lttle extra time after the shot prior to transitioning to the next target. Neither is wrong. Of course the Revo I use in IPSC has a dot and is compensated and that helps me see better than I could with iron sights. Just a thought.

[rwmagnus]

Totally agree, preping up the trigger oveer a no shoot is asking for trouble in a match. When the action starts and the pressure is on it doesn't take much to let that shot go. It's kinda hard to turn it on and off during a stage but there are times the trigger prep works to your advantage and then there are the other times, LOL.

Hate to admit it but last night was one of those other times. Shooting clean would have been better than pushing the envelope and needing an extra reload.

[Vic]

In my opinion; Senor Rodriguez nailed it. I never "stage" my trigger, but perform the roll-bang method, and I think most of us are trying to articulate that concept, and it might be misconstrued as "staging"?

John, I swear you name rings a bell with me, from a match long ago. I was at the IPSC sectional championship for New Mexico in 1991, and could swear we had a brief conversation in the bleachers during the last day top 16 shoot-offs?

I can remember yacking with a guy, and he asked where I placed, which was 16th overall, and I didnt realize I had to get ready for the shoot offs:)

The match was in Carlsbad NM, 91.....was that you I recall?

By the way, when/where/what type of pistol and revolver matches are held in Deming?, sounds like fun,Im only a couple hours away.

[JohnRodriguez]

I started shooting ICORE at to rio salado club in 2001 and didn't start shooting IPSC/USPSA untill 2002, before that I was shooting NRA Service rifle, and had to stop shooting when my eye's would strain to point of not being able to focus when shooting 600 yard. That's the main reason I started shooting pistol. It must have been another Rodriguez you met, there are a bunch of use here in NM.

as far as shooting in southern NM, Deming shoots on the first saturday, Fort Bliss shoots on the second and third Saturdays and alamagordo shoots on the 4th sunday of each month. all the clubs are uspsa clubs along with all the rules and regs.

I tried to cure Mark from stagging his trigger, but I think that me yelling at him when he was shooting just made him nervous.

here's the link to the Deming club I believe there is map in the files section of the site, come on out and join us all three clubs do draw a few revos since we shoot one gun, take a 15 minute break and then shoot a second gun

I'm talking with a couple of the club to see if they would like to shoot the ICORE postal match, so there is another reason to join use out there

hppt://groups.yahoo.com/group/ddsa/

[Vic]

Must be John, just threw me because I think this fellas name was J.C. Rodriguez?and yours was damned close. Oh well, thanks for the info. The spartan page for their club didnt give any directions, and i noticed they don't allow any race guns...sticking to IDPA type rules. I have a stock revolver I could pick up I suppose:)

So you lived in Az then if you shot at Rio Salado, Im way down in southeastern Arizona. I used to shoot with a bunch of those guys from Phoenix and Casa Grande ect. Gene Marshall,Phil Rosato, Roger Davis,Vic pickett and a couple others Ive forgotten:) Im generally the lone revolver shooter down at the local matches in my area too, I know how lonely it is.

[rwmagnus]

Vic does that mean your normal rig is an Open Class Revolver and a speed holster? I've been competiting with a 625 exclusively since March of this year and shot a Tue night steel match at Rio Salado a few weeks back. Several wheel guns were there mostly Open Class Red Dot stuff. Lots of race rigs also. Good group of folks there, nice match also.

Use to travel NM as part of my territory for work in the SW, wish I could get it back. Guess I'll have to lobby for that change once again. I'm in AZ about every 4-6 weeks these days. Seems like the wheel guns are making a come back lately.

[JohnRodriguez]

DDSA was a ipda club, not anymore, they do allow open guns, and I usually run my open revo there. I live in Hurley NM, and yesterday (2nd sunday of month) was the ICORE match at rio, i had just gotten back from there when i saw your post, it's a 262 mile drive from my house to the range. I've become pretty go friends with Vic Pickett, and have learned a lot about shooting revo's and quiet a bit about setting one up to run compatition