IPSC new SG rule changes 1.1.2012

[Sako92S]

Some new rule changes which were decided on 2011 GA at Rhodes Creece:

2.1.12 Courses of fire must nominate a single permitted type of ammunition, i.e. birdshot, buckshot

or slugs.

5.2.3 Unless otherwise specified in the written stage briefing the competitor’s equipment belt

carrying cartridges (in caddies, loops, clips, bags or pouches) and/or detachable magazines

and/or speed loaders must be worn at waist level. “Chest rigs”, bandoliers and similar

carriers are expressly prohibited. Additional ammunition carriers mounted on forearms are

permitted provided that cartridges are carried individually in loops or clips.

5.2.3.1 Not Applicable.

5.2.3.2 Only one equipment carrying belt is permitted. Cartridges held in loops or clips on

the belt are restricted to a maximum of 2 cartridges high. Rounds carried in

caddies (often known as “strippers”) must not exceed 6 rounds in height.

5.2.3.3 The Range Master may make allowances for variations to Rule 5.2.3 due to

anatomical considerations. The Range Master's decision on conformity to Rule

5.2.3 is final.

5.2.4 Unless otherwise specified in the written stage briefing, ammunition and

speed loaders must be carried on the competitor or gun in pouches,

pockets, loops, clips or other suitable retention devices. Loops, clips or other suitable

retention devices fitted to the gun or to a sling fitted to

the gun, to hold individual cartridges or speed loaders are specifically

permitted allowed.

5.2.5 When carried in loops, clips or caddies no part of any cartridge is permitted to extend further

than 75mm from a competitor's body. Cartridges carried on the gun are exempt and loose

cartridges carried in a pouch or bag are usually exempt from this rule. The Range Master’s

decision will be final in this matter. Open Division competitors are exempt from this rule.

5.5.6.1 Slugs that protrude beyond the external limits of the cartridge casing are deemed unsafe (see Rule

10.5.15).

5.5.6.2 Only cartridges using conventional wads are permitted. Cartridges using

specialized long-range wads are prohibited (see Glossary). See Rule 10.5.15.

5.5.6.4 Cartridges with steel or tungsten based shot or slugs are deemed unsafe for

shooting at metal targets (see Rule 10.5.15).

5.5.7 All rounds loaded in the shotgun prior to the start signal must be of the same configuration

(i.e. wad, velocity, propellant, pellet weight, pellet size, length, etc.). Violations may be

subject to Rule 10.6.1.

5.6.1 The power factors for each Division are stipulated in Appendix D.

The cartridge power factor is usually calculated by reference to the

manufacturer’s published data. However, one or more official match chronographs may be

used to assist in the determination of power factor. In the absence of

manufacturer’s published data and chronographs, the power factor declared by

a competitor cannot be challenged.

8.1.6 For the initial load prior to the start signal the Range Master may require that all rounds be

firstly placed in a box or other container to facilitate an easy check on the number and

configuration of cartridges to be loaded.

8.7.1 Competitors are prohibited from taking a sight picture and/or dry firing with prior to the start signal.

Violation will result in a warning for the first occurrence and

one procedural penalty for each subsequent occurrence in the same match. Competitors

may, while pointing their firearm at the ground, adjust electronic sights.

APPENDIX F1

16. For any stage incorporating one or more paper targets and requiring the use of buckshot

ammunition match organizers are permitted to set a limit on the maximum number of pellets per

cartridge and this limit will apply for the entire stage.

20. At Level III matches and above the maximum required number of rounds for buckshot and slug

ammunition (combined) is restricted to 80 rounds.

APPENDIX D

6. Maximum overall length for open and modified gun 1320mm, see Point 17

Open Division

18. Detachable magazines accessible to a competitor during a COF must not contain more than 10

rounds at the Start Signal. However, detachable magazines with a capacity of up to 12 rounds

are permitted. Magazines must not be clipped, taped or otherwise attached to any other

magazine at any time. Guns with fixed magazines may have an initial load of 14 rounds.

I'm NOT happy about these new rule changes.

Open is not open anymore with mag capacity restrictions.

[Chuck Anderson]

As one of the IPSC Officials posted on Global Village, deal with it. I am. I won't ever shoot an IPSC shotgun match. There dealt with. Fortunately that's easy to say since I have lots of other options. Sucks for folks outside the US. I really don't understand why they felt the need to pass any of the new rules.

[Flexmoney]

I hope that some of the other places have options too....I know that some may not.

Chuck's position is one that we always need to remember...nobody is forcing folks to play our game(s). They can take their toys and play someplace else. Whatever the game we always need to make sure it remains a good option for shooters, Match Directors and match staff.

[West Texas Granny]

I hope that some of the other places have options too....I know that some may not.

Chuck's position is one that we always need to remember...nobody is forcing folks to play our game(s). They can take their toys and play someplace else. Whatever the game we always need to make sure it remains a good option for shooters, Match Directors and match staff.

And when they start walking you won't get them back. It will be a cancer that will migrate to the other disciplines. This attitude of, " They can take their toys and play someplace else " is self-destructive. Attitude like this can and will destroy IPSC. It's like a car company saying their cars come in one color only and if you don't like it go to my competitor. I would highly suggest that a review of the new rules be started, that the new rules are put on hold and input from members is solicited for consideration to changes.

[Singlestack]

I would highly suggest that a review of the new rules be started, that the new rules are put on hold and input from members is solicited for consideration to changes.

You are aware that we are talking IPSC rule changes, not USPSA, right?

[ziebart]

Does anyone think these rules will migrate over to USPSA 3gun? It seems like a lot of people put a bunch of money into the new 4x4 caddies or the load 2 systems would be out of luck.

[Flexmoney]

Does anyone think these rules will migrate over to USPSA 3gun?

Nope.

[West Texas Granny]

I would highly suggest that a review of the new rules be started, that the new rules are put on hold and input from members is solicited for consideration to changes.

You are aware that we are talking IPSC rule changes, not USPSA, right?

Does it really matter?

[Singlestack]

I would highly suggest that a review of the new rules be started, that the new rules are put on hold and input from members is solicited for consideration to changes.

You are aware that we are talking IPSC rule changes, not USPSA, right?

Does it really matter?

OH YEAH!

[Nik Habicht]

I would highly suggest that a review of the new rules be started, that the new rules are put on hold and input from members is solicited for consideration to changes.

You are aware that we are talking IPSC rule changes, not USPSA, right?

Does it really matter?

Sure it does. In the U.S. you're not likely to encounter an IPSC shotgun match.....

[ima45dv8]

I would highly suggest that a review of the new rules be started, that the new rules are put on hold and input from members is solicited for consideration to changes.

You are aware that we are talking IPSC rule changes, not USPSA, right?

Does it really matter?

To those that read, comprehend and administer them...absolutely.

[aztecdriver]

I would highly suggest that a review of the new rules be started, that the new rules are put on hold and input from members is solicited for consideration to changes.

You are aware that we are talking IPSC rule changes, not USPSA, right?

Does it really matter?

How many IPSC multigun or shotgun matches have you shot?

[chendersby]

Does anyone think these rules will migrate over to USPSA 3gun?

Nope.

Not just no but HELL NO.

[Chuck Anderson]

Does anyone think these rules will migrate over to USPSA 3gun?

Nope.

Not just no but HELL NO.

What Chris said.

[West Texas Granny]

I would highly suggest that a review of the new rules be started, that the new rules are put on hold and input from members is solicited for consideration to changes.

You are aware that we are talking IPSC rule changes, not USPSA, right?

Does it really matter?

How many IPSC multigun or shotgun matches have you shot?

Let's see. If I understand things correctly iPSC is the umbrella organization of which USPSA is under. So thinking in corporate terms it's the parent organization with USPSA being a division of and if the parent goes one way the division will follow. That is where my concern is. If I'm wrong please tell me but I can't help to be concerned that Open is no longer Open. If one does it the other is more likely to follow and frankly the best way to stop things is before they find it wraped the the red tape of an organization

[aztecdriver]

Let's see. If I understand things correctly iPSC is the umbrella organization of which USPSA is under. So thinking in corporate terms it's the parent organization with USPSA being a division of and if the parent goes one way the division will follow. That is where my concern is. If I'm wrong please tell me but I can't help to be concerned that Open is no longer Open. If one does it the other is more likely to follow and frankly the best way to stop things is before they find it wraped the the red tape of an organization

You are making assumptions about the role IPSC has in governing USPSA and USPSA's rulebook. They don't have that type of influence. For example, production in USPSA is 10 round and IPSC is 15 round. That's pretty drastic - and it's not going to change. They even have completely different divisions than USPSA has (Modified?). IPSC could make a rule that you have to jump in a pool before every stage, it won't happen here.

[ima45dv8]

Let's see. If I understand things correctly iPSC is the umbrella organization of which USPSA is under. So thinking in corporate terms it's the parent organization with USPSA being a division of and if the parent goes one way the division will follow. That is where my concern is. If I'm wrong please tell me but I can't help to be concerned that Open is no longer Open. If one does it the other is more likely to follow and frankly the best way to stop things is before they find it wraped the the red tape of an organization

Without going into the full history of the agreement and how it was reached, USPSA secured the right to have a rulebook independent of the IPSC rulebook.

We can adopt rules they suggest but are under no obligation to do so.

And in this case, we won't.

[Flexmoney]

...the best way to stop things is before they find it wraped the the red tape of an organization

You got that part right, for sure!

Luckily...USPSA doesn't have the red tape that IPSC has. I hope it stays that way. And, in this case, we have two of the members of the USPSA Board of Directors posting here and making their intentions crystal clear on the matter. (Thanks gentlemen!)

[Chuck Anderson]

Just a bit of additional information. When it comes to 3-Gun/Multigun, USPSA and IPSC are very, very different. IPSC, doesn't have Multi-Gun. When they run a 3-Gun match it's actually three different matches run at the same time, Pistol, Rifle and Shotgun. USPSA moved to Multigun in 2005. Actually, some of IPSC's rules are less restrictive than USPSA at this time. For example the Open SG capacity. Right now in USPSA the total limit in Open is 10+1. I'm trying to change that to true Open, but for now, IPSC is less restrictive in that regard. We do allow significantly more options for carrying spare ammo than IPSC. We also don't have limitations on differences in shot size or restrictions on shot and slugs in one stage. I think USPSA MG has less in common with IPSC 3-Gun than it has in common. USPSA has used it's own rules for the last couple years, only using IPSC rules for certain events, IPSC Nationals, IPSC Pan Am Shotgun, and a very small handful of others. With the current BOD it's very unlikely that any of the changes IPSC just adopted will find there way to the USPSA rule book. That may change with future BOD's but I don't think anyone on the BOD now is in a rush to eliminate sight pictures or dryfiring, or any of the other dozens of changes IPSC made to their rule book.

[Sako92S]

Just a bit of additional information. When it comes to 3-Gun/Multigun, USPSA and IPSC are very, very different. IPSC, doesn't have Multi-Gun. When they run a 3-Gun match it's actually three different matches run at the same time, Pistol, Rifle and Shotgun.

Not totally correct. IPSC have 2 different type of 3-gun/multigun matches. Tournament and grand tournament.

Tournament can consists like 12 stages on one match where 4 with pistol, 4 with rifle and 4 with SG.

Grand Tournament consists of separate discipline matches like 1 for pistol, 1 for rifle and 1 for SG

GT can also be like with 2 different disciplines in 2 separate matches.

IPSC rules do not allow to use more than 1 gun in 1 stage like USA multigun does.

In Finland we have real 3-gun matches but they are not under IPSC.

Basically rules are the same but simplified and you can use more than 1 gun on the stage.

Scoring system is basically same but all hits are counted as major.

[Neil Smith]

In the UK a growing number of shotgunners, clubs & range owners have grown tired of all the IPSC rules & we now have an organisation that only started this year who are working with the clubs to hold a series of new shotgun matches, if IPSC & also our UKPSA continue as they are doing it is sure to swell the ranks of this new series.

Next year they already have a growing calendar.

They have a website here..

http://four4islands.org/

N

Edited October 12, 2011 by Neil Smith

[kurtm]

Goodbye Flite-Controll, it,s been fun.

[Jim Norman]

Let's see. If I understand things correctly iPSC is the umbrella organization of which USPSA is under. So thinking in corporate terms it's the parent organization with USPSA being a division of and if the parent goes one way the division will follow. That is where my concern is. If I'm wrong please tell me but I can't help to be concerned that Open is no longer Open. If one does it the other is more likely to follow and frankly the best way to stop things is before they find it wraped the the red tape of an organization

USPSA is in fact if not name the 'older' organization. IPSC started here, we are the basis, IPSC is the body for the rest of the world. We shoot USPSA matches under USPSA Rules. If your club wants to hold and IPSC Rules match it can, but that is not what the vast majority of clubs do. The vast majority of clubs inthe USA shoot USPSA.

Your Parent Organization reference is sort of OK, but it is more like extended family than Parent-Child. We are the ancestor so to speak from whence IPSC was formed. We still have dinner with the relatives but we don't live with them and after a few days around the holidays we are anxious to get away and get back home where we can live under our rules again. Evolution is a strange thing. We are all from the same root organism, but our environments have influenced our development in many ways.