LnL Die Bushing kept loosening for Powder Drop Station

[Phil413]

So I'm humming along reloading then suddenly the press stops. Fortunately, I've got the RCBS lockout die on station #4 to alert me that an empty case was there! I looked at the powder drop and it was 75% full BUT, it had loosened itself somehow. I gave it 1/8 turn to "lock" it in but sure enough after 50 rounds or so, the Powder Drop station unwound itself and was precariously sitting above the press.

Called Hornady and they're sending me a shim to lock it down. I'll post back with an update.

[a.roberts]

I had that happen a couple of times. Then I snugged the bushing down with a wrench. Doesn't take much.

No move no more.

[SSTim]

I have been using that shim for about a year - its simple and it works no more movement

[Jeff686]

I stuffed a piece of paper under the die as a shim. Easy to install/remove, but keeps things from moving.

[Mush from PA.]

I stuffed a piece of paper under the die as a shim. Easy to install/remove, but keeps things from moving.

+1 - Quick fix and scrap paper is easy to find in my house....

[noylj]

Put a paper or thin metal cut-out to act as a shim

Check the bushings for one that goes on tighter

Get an O-ring with a larger cross-sectional diameter

Check to be sure that the bushing and the press adapters have not cracked.

[Mush from PA.]

After I shimed with a piece of paper I took a "Sharpie" marker and put a mark on the bushing and where the "mark" met the top of the LNL. If the bushing rotates I can see where the bushing mark is and where the LNL mark is which should always meet while I am reloading. I can also see how far the powder drop bushing has moved so I can re-shim or just move it back into place.

[SlowShooter]

I've been having this problem for a while, also. Gotten into the habit of using a wrench to tighten-down the powder bushing into the press.

problem is I can't always get into the right angle to get a wrench on it, sometime I have to remove other dies, put a wrench on the powder-feeder, then re-install the other dies.

I didn't know that Hornady would send you a shim, thanks for that info, now I know what to do.

Fortunately, I've got the RCBS lockout die on station #4 to alert me that an empty case was there!

Yes I love the lock-out die, I never reload without it.

-SlowShooter

[CocoBolo]

Golly Gee Whiz, I tighten all my dies with a wrench. Trick is to start and go clock wise. If you think it is tight now try it with a Bullet Feeder Die.

With my bullet feeder I can't use a powder cop, and unless I sit just right of center no hope of seeing powder in the case.

At the bottom of the stroke I look up at the powder measure if the powder plunger is pointed at the moon then the case has powder. This is sort of like looking at the powder cop, no? When the powder measure goes below 1/2 at the next stop for primers it gets filled up.

I have duct tape holding in the plastic tube in the powder measure. I was loading along the powder measure was full and the tube came out an landed in my lap. This happened a couple times, so I invereted the tube so that the square edges are down and this helped. It was a big mess so I grabbed my trusty shop vac and turned it into a flame thrower.

[SlowShooter]

With my bullet feeder I can't use a powder cop, and unless I sit just right of center no hope of seeing powder in the case.

I don't like the "Powder Cop" die's premise: you have to actively look at it each time. It is only an indicator, it does not do anything. IMO it does not serve the purpose of preventing over/under powder charges.

That's why I'm a big fan of the RCBS Lock-out Die: it is automatic even if you aren't staring at it. It stops the motion of the press if there is too little or too much powder.

(because it won't let the brass case go into the die, stops the ram on the upstroke)

Edited August 12, 2011 by SlowShooter

[noylj]

<650 primes easily compared to the LnL.

<Even you have admitted that you use a snapping motion to seat primers. 650 <doesn't require any of those tricks. It just works.

Where do you get this idea? I have never had to use extra force to seat a primer in any of the Hornady APs I've owned. When I used my friends's 650, I noticed no particular easing of the effort.

Now, when I was not getting primers seated below flush, I did try to use more force, but that didn't do anything. Only tightening the shell plate solved my problem.

I remember a stereo store in CA that had a Klipsch K-horn for demo. They had damaged the drivers and used it to show how superior their inventoried models were. Klipsch tried through the courts to get them to stop, but the courts wouldn't do anything.

Did you also make sure that your experiences were bad or are you just making it from whole clothe?

All mechanical instruments have some problems and reloading presses are no different. I have read of problematic 650s, 550s, and SDBs (and I have seen these people attacked by the Blue-or-else crowd for "making things up."

[CocoBolo]

<650 primes easily compared to the LnL.

<Even you have admitted that you use a snapping motion to seat primers. 650 <doesn't require any of those tricks. It just works.

Where do you get this idea? I have never had to use extra force to seat a primer in any of the Hornady APs I've owned. When I used my friends's 650, I noticed no particular easing of the effort.

Now, when I was not getting primers seated below flush, I did try to use more force, but that didn't do anything. Only tightening the shell plate solved my problem.

I remember a stereo store in CA that had a Klipsch K-horn for demo. They had damaged the drivers and used it to show how superior their inventoried models were. Klipsch tried through the courts to get them to stop, but the courts wouldn't do anything.

Did you also make sure that your experiences were bad or are you just making it from whole clothe?

All mechanical instruments have some problems and reloading presses are no different. I have read of problematic 650s, 550s, and SDBs (and I have seen these people attacked by the Blue-or-else crowd for "making things up."

Noylj - I don't think its about choosing up sides, it is more like the Chevy or Ford. However I've run into some narcicistic Ford owners. One day when Home Depot was about to drop a fork lift load of sheetrock on my Chevy a Forder walked by and said it will never haul it, as I stood there on my crutches, I said it will hual it and tow your Ford and I'll do it all on one leg!

Honestly I've had more issues priming on the XL650 than the Hornady, which has had no primer issues in 50k plus rounds. I consider them "Peers" in reloaders equals, each has its better points but if I could only have one that answer is the Hornady LNL. There are things I can do on it I wouldn't even try on the XL650, but for pure volume of rounds at the end of the day the XL650 pile would be bigger and so would the SD.

But if you want some ammo for Blue hunting, talk about all the plastic parts on the Dillon, There are only two on the LNL the one that holds the rod on the primer assy and the little wheel on the primer slide. The index assembly on the Dillon is plastic! Speaking of parts, maybe we should do a count of parts the Dillon has an SL of parts, the designer of the LNL well pure Genius, extremely few parts.

That Lock out Die sounds like a winner, too bad I only got 5 holes, and when I don't use the bullet feeder I use a seperate expander die, does a lot better job than the PTX die and a lot easier to adjust.

Truth being stranger than fiction, when we go to Walmart and buy ammo about all we look at is the price, but when we reload Geeeezzz we disect the smallest components, become OCD, must be pulling that ram prduces some kind of hormones.

[noylj]

Cocobolo:

I figure if you actually have a problem, you ask for help. I don't trust the opinion of anyone who has a problem and complains on-line before EVER contacting the manufacturer--particularly if said person says they "threw out the POS" and STATE that they never contacted the manufacturer.

I have never had any thing but great help from Hornady, RCBS, and Dillon. I have generally had nothing but great help from Lee.

I would never want to be without my 1050s, but there are certainly times I wish my wife hadn't "given" my L-N-L to my son.

If you love the idea of proprietary dies, the SDB is fine.

If you don't "need" 5 stations, the 550 and Lee Pro 1000 may be just what you want. The 550 in particular if you don't the press do anything on its own and you want complete and utter control of everything.

If you really have to crank out thousands of rounds, quickly, the 1050 is for you.

If you are a "general reloader" who likes a really nice press and sees the advantage of 5-station, then the L-N-L or 650 would be for you. If you have to have a case feeder, get the 650--you'll never regret it.

When Hornady comes out with an AP designed from the ground up to use a case feeder, that recommendation might change.

However, if you don't want/need a case feeder (and believe me, they are problematic), get the L-N-L (the 650 then becomes a PITA).

That is all I ever said...

[Jetracer013]

Can someone please explain where this shim is placed. I have the same problem however I don't see how tightening the locknut can have any effect as it is the bushings that rotates and causes the entire powder measure to rise when the case is raised.

[Glock XIX]

Can someone please explain where this shim is placed. I have the same problem however I don't see how tightening the locknut can have any effect as it is the bushings that rotates and causes the entire powder measure to rise when the case is raised.

I put mine between the lip of the bushing and the O-ring, where it sets in the press frame. Fixed the problem right away.

[m41]

I had the same problem a couple of times. I removed the bushing's and ground flats on two sides. Tighten them up with a wrench and problem solved. Not sure why Hornady didn't put flats on them in the first place. Love my LNL AP. My two blue machines just sit idle now. Need to get them sold I guess.

[jmorris]

The quick change dies are not so cool when they decide to change themselves. I went the fatter O-ring route.

[mizer67]

<650 primes easily compared to the LnL.

<Even you have admitted that you use a snapping motion to seat primers. 650 <doesn't require any of those tricks. It just works.

My LNL takes some effort to get primers seated. It's much more pronounced in large pistol than small.

The main problem being that my LNL won't seat primers below flush, no matter how much force is applied, and my M&Ps are very intolerant of any primer that's not slightly below flush.

I like everything else about the press itself except its priming. The casefeeder on the other hand, is giving me all kinds of fits loading 9mm. I load faster manually feeding the press than fixing the case feeder malfs., at least so far.

Those two issues will have a new blue press on my bench next month. Just need to decide bewteen a 650 and it's bigger brother.

[spideysteve]

One wrap of Teflon tape did it for me .... Pretty simple and fixed right away ...

[Babaganoosh]

<650 primes easily compared to the LnL.

<Even you have admitted that you use a snapping motion to seat primers. 650 <doesn't require any of those tricks. It just works.

My LNL takes some effort to get primers seated. It's much more pronounced in large pistol than small.

The main problem being that my LNL won't seat primers below flush, no matter how much force is applied, and my M&Ps are very intolerant of any primer that's not slightly below flush.

I like everything else about the press itself except its priming. The casefeeder on the other hand, is giving me all kinds of fits loading 9mm. I load faster manually feeding the press than fixing the case feeder malfs., at least so far.

Those two issues will have a new blue press on my bench next month. Just need to decide bewteen a 650 and it's bigger brother.

What exactly is your problem with the casefeeder? Lnl is sometimes a pita with 9mm and case feeders. The empty case dropping off the side?

[mizer67]

<650 primes easily compared to the LnL.

<Even you have admitted that you use a snapping motion to seat primers. 650 <doesn't require any of those tricks. It just works.

My LNL takes some effort to get primers seated. It's much more pronounced in large pistol than small.

The main problem being that my LNL won't seat primers below flush, no matter how much force is applied, and my M&Ps are very intolerant of any primer that's not slightly below flush.

I like everything else about the press itself except its priming. The casefeeder on the other hand, is giving me all kinds of fits loading 9mm. I load faster manually feeding the press than fixing the case feeder malfs., at least so far.

Those two issues will have a new blue press on my bench next month. Just need to decide bewteen a 650 and it's bigger brother.

What exactly is your problem with the casefeeder? Lnl is sometimes a pita with 9mm and case feeders. The empty case dropping off the side?

1.) Brass rain

2.) Cases jamming horizontally in top of feeder

3.) Cases not dropping free of case feed plate and jamming up rotation

4.) Cases dropping off the side of the sub plate

5.) Upside down cases

6.) Cases tipping over during feeding, or just not feeding completely into the shell plate station #1

7.) Cases jamming up at the transition from the case feeder to the drop tube, catching on the aluminum funnel

I'm sure there are a few others I'm forgetting. I have a solid bench, so that's not the issue. I've worked up a few fixes for the cases flying off the shell plate and brass rain, but the other problems are frequent enough to be annoying and eliminate any time savings from the case feeder.

Edited November 22, 2011 by mizer67

[98sr20ve]

My LnL had pretty much all the above issues (except #7)

1) Would not seat CCI SP primers. My 550 would the 650 would. Same primers. LnL was getting about 3% failure with CCI SP. Two different LnL frames. Factory could not get it fixed.

2) LnL casefeeder is just not as good as the 650 in 9mm. Slider is problematic. Small case, a little bit of primer flow from a Glock and the cases rock on the slider. Dillon has a channel and captures the case by the rim to prevent this issue. It's why caliber conversion cost more. Parts specific to each caliber. The Case Collator is not as nice but I was able to get it to work with a couple mods. Slider was enough of a issue to make me want to scream.

Some people love the LnL. I think it's caliber and even gun specific (primer flow/tippy case). Mine was finally about 99% as far as feeding cases. Not great but not horrible. NOT good enough for my expectations. It would not seat primers. My gun went from being 100% reliable for years with a 550, to about 97% with the LnL and back to 100% with the 650. PLUS, the 650 primes super, super easy. During my many conversations with Hornady they actually admitted that the 650 had better leverage then the LnL. When they said that I decided to find some way to get rid of the LnL. I tried for 6 months to get it to work. To Hornady's credit they bought the entire LnL setup back at my full retail. Good service. I was treated well during the entire frustrating process.

Edited November 22, 2011 by 98sr20ve

[spideysteve]

I have had all of the exact same 7 issues posted above. I really like the LnL. Just the case feeder is a POS. an it seems the whole case feed system was a secondary thought to the machine as opposed to having it built with care feeder in mind from the start

[98sr20ve]

Dillon designed the 650 with a Casefeeder from the start.

Dillon added a casefeeder to the 550. It's not as good of a slider setup as the 650. Better then the LnL in some ways and not in others.

Hornady added a casefeeder to the LnL just like Dillon did to the 550.

Add on casefeeders are just not as reliable as machines designed for a casefeeder from the start. I have owned a 550/650 and LnL all with casefeeders. With out a doubt, not even close, the 650 is the best. Not perfect. But the best by far.

[mizer67]

Not to side track this thread any more than I already have, but issue #8 today with the case feeder:

8.) Case drop activation plunger binds, causing the case not to feed and the cam wire to pop out of alignment.

My case feeder is now in a box awaiting shipment back to its mfg.

I've chimed in about the primer seating before. Mine won't seat primers fully. CCI or Wolf are the most problematic, particularly with my M&Ps I'll get as many as 2 in 10 light strikes or more. Winchesters are better, but only run 98-99%, and Federals are ~99.5%.

I would deal with hand feeding my LNL for several calibers I shoot if it would seat primers fully. It's a great low volume press in that regard. Changeovers are a breeze, adjustments are rarely needed if you stick with one primer size and the powder measure is excellent. Case feeder is a POS afterthought, along with the PTX, IMO.

Edited November 22, 2011 by mizer67