SHERIFF Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Two days ago at the HELLENIC NATIONALS i had a timing problem with the one of my 625-7 PC.the problem apeard sudenly at the midle of the stage and i notice that the cylinder didnt turn properly but was stoped at the midle of its turn.when i open the side plate to take a look at the problem i notice that it works properly when the side plate is off.and when i put it back the probem still exist.the gun is new one(has fire about 2000 rounds) I didnt notice any wear on hand , at the excector assembly or at the cylinder stop. Does any one else had the same problem or can help??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooper_999 Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Hi Sheriff, I once had some dust/sand/grease/oil mixture in the window for the hand. This also caused some trouble with transportation of the cylinder....maybe somthing like that? How did you finish the Nats? Looking very forward to Rhodes! Best, Sascha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHERIFF Posted June 21, 2011 Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 Hi Sheriff, I once had some dust/sand/grease/oil mixture in the window for the hand. This also caused some trouble with transportation of the cylinder....maybe somthing like that? How did you finish the Nats? Looking very forward to Rhodes! Best, Sascha as you said with a lot of sun,dust,and swimming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revoman Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Do you have any peening on the cylinder stop notches? I had that on my 625 PC and it gave me the same problem that you are decribing. If you slow fire it works perfect and if you shoot fast as you would at a match it starts skipping. It doesn't take much to make them skip. On the ramp going into the cylinder notch run your fingernail and it should go in smooth if you feel any metal then you probably have peening and need to clean it up. I carry a small 1/4" round ceramic sharpner to clean the ramps and a thin square one to clean the notches them selves. On another revolver I had my ramps going into my notches recut a little wider and deeper. I hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHERIFF Posted June 21, 2011 Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 Do you have any peening on the cylinder stop notches? I had that on my 625 PC and it gave me the same problem that you are decribing. If you slow fire it works perfect and if you shoot fast as you would at a match it starts skipping. It doesn't take much to make them skip. On the ramp going into the cylinder notch run your fingernail and it should go in smooth if you feel any metal then you probably have peening and need to clean it up. I carry a small 1/4" round ceramic sharpner to clean the ramps and a thin square one to clean the notches them selves. On another revolver I had my ramps going into my notches recut a little wider and deeper. I hope this helps. Thanks a lot for the answer but the cylinder stops at the half of its run and this is'nt hapens on a specific chamber but to all chambers with by chance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooper_999 Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 (edited) ...but the cylinder stops at the half of its run and this is'nt hapens on a specific chamber but to all chambers with by chance this was it what let me think of a problem of the hand. To be correct - you are pulling the trigger slowly, the cylinder starts to rotate and then, while pulling the trigger further, the cylinder stops anywhere before reaching the end-position (cylinderstop pops into the notch)? -> Did you check movement of the hand with cylinder open? How does it look like? I would disassemble it completely, clean and oil all parts and assamble it again. Then next try. Edited June 21, 2011 by cooper_999 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHERIFF Posted June 21, 2011 Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 ...but the cylinder stops at the half of its run and this is'nt hapens on a specific chamber but to all chambers with by chance this was it what let me think of a problem of the hand. To be correct - you are pulling the trigger slowly, the cylinder starts to rotate and then, while pulling the trigger further, the cylinder stops anywhere before reaching the end-position (cylinderstop pops into the notch)? -> Did you check movement of the hand with cylinder open? How does it look like? I would disassemble it completely, clean and oil all parts and assamble it again. Then next try. the problem begins when i put the side plate back on its position.when i run the gun slowly it works perfect. the problem starts when i run it fast enough . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooper_999 Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 is the sideplate pressing on the trigger action? I´ll stay with the hand. When you are pulling fast, it seems to slide over the star. Do I remember right, that you had similar timing probs at the nationals on Crete 2009? Didn´t a oversize hand solve the prob then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHERIFF Posted June 21, 2011 Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 is the sideplate pressing on the trigger action? I´ll stay with the hand. When you are pulling fast, it seems to slide over the star. Do I remember right, that you had similar timing probs at the nationals on Crete 2009? Didn´t a oversize hand solve the prob then? this one is a new gun .I'll try clean the window and we'll see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4mike Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 (edited) ............the gun is new one............ ...the problem begins when i put the side plate back ........ deburr and polish the cylinder stop, side plate can brake they check the hand and cylinder stop springs thats the surface i thought Edited June 23, 2011 by 4mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregg K Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 Hi Sheriff Let's check the simple most common things first. Is the ejector rod loose? It's possible that the ejector rod backed off and is binding the action and when you remove the side plate and the yoke screw that the pressure is eased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHERIFF Posted June 23, 2011 Author Share Posted June 23, 2011 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCCkZp2ueMA Here is a video of the problem. Without the side plate the gun works perfect. With the side plate it starts crazy.the problem started 4 days before and as you can see the gun is almost new (3000 rounds) id like to know your opinion about it because here in Greece there is;nt a gunsmith who knows the revos well enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHERIFF Posted June 25, 2011 Author Share Posted June 25, 2011 Αny idea about it?????does anyone can help? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toolguy Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 (edited) I watched the video several times. If I recall correctly, there is another piece on the back side of the trigger that is operated by the hand pivot pin. If the hand pivot pin is not in the slot in the other part, it may be binding up the hand when the sideplate is on. To fix that, you remove the rebound slide and trigger. Then replace the trigger while making sure the end of the pin goes into the slot in the other part (cylinder latch block). The cylinder latch block should ride up and down with the hand and trigger movement. Also it looks like the firing pin retaining pin is missing. Those have a bad habit of jumping out and getting lost if you dryfire the gun with the sideplate off. If that is not the problem, let us know and we will try to come up with another answer. Edited June 25, 2011 by Toolguy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
50GI-Jess Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 (edited) Interesting pointers by Toolguy. However ! It is like your car and the mechanic...he'll have to see and inspect it. otherwise it's guess work. In order to help yourself with this timing problem, you'll have to get it inspected by a professional. It's usually a simple fix, but sometimes it can become a real problem, if not dealt with that way. Just a thought. Edited June 25, 2011 by 50GI-Jess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowrider Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Is the hand spring broken or disengaged? It should be spring loaded with tension toward the ratchet on the cylinder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Round_Gun_Shooter Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) I have not seen the innards of newer revolvers so first a question. Did they recently re-design the rebound slide or has this one been cut back? lot of spring showing. Look at the inside of the side plate and see if you have any rub marks that show tell tale dragging of parts or pins Now, with the way you are able to move the cylinder at the end of the video, your stop is not engaging. Looks to me like if you replace the cylinder stop and rebound slide with unmodified parts, it may solve your problem. Also, best way to break or bend a trigger pin is dry fire without the side plate on. They are designed to be supported on both ends Edited July 7, 2011 by Round_Gun_Shooter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RePete Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 I bought a 586 that was "worn/shot out". The hand wouldn't move the cylinder all the time. The problem was the hand was cacked. Installed a new hand and all was right with the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Griffin Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 (edited) I bought a 586 that was "worn/shot out". The hand wouldn't move the cylinder all the time. The problem was the hand was cacked. Installed a new hand and all was right with the world. I'm with RePete, that has to be a hand problem. Either the sideplate is holding it back or it is fundamentally flawed. Cycle the gun without the sideplate while holding the hand firmly down, see if it fails. Also inspect the inside of the sideplate for anything that might be touching the hand. You should be able to put a bit of counterpressure on the cylinder and feel the hand engage, it will engage during the earliest part of the trigger stroke and maintain engagement throughout the stroke if you don't back off at all. Any letoff will let it slip. Matt Edited July 8, 2011 by Matt Griffin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom E Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 Check to see if the gun runs ok with the sideplate on but the yoke screw removed. Leave the other two sideplate screws in place and tight. If it does run ok, you have a cylinder endshake / yoke endshake issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHERIFF Posted July 11, 2011 Author Share Posted July 11, 2011 First of all thanks for helping and forgive me if i was late to answer but i was on vacations... Is the hand spring broken or disengaged? No its O.k. Look at the inside of the side plate and see if you have any rub marks that show tell tale dragging of parts or pinsNow, with the way you are able to move the cylinder at the end of the video, your stop is not engaging. Looks to me like if you replace the cylinder stop and rebound slide with unmodified parts, it may solve your problem. There are two marks on the side plate where the contact point between the hand and side plate is.The cylinder doesnt complete its moving but stops at the half of it.all the parts are originals and unmodified I bought a 586 that was "worn/shot out". The hand wouldn't move the cylinder all the time. The problem was the hand was cacked.Installed a new hand and all was right with the world. We have the same thought!!I'll do it in the next days.. I bought a 586 that was "worn/shot out". The hand wouldn't move the cylinder all the time. The problem was the hand was cacked.Installed a new hand and all was right with the world.I'm with RePete, that has to be a hand problem. Either the sideplate is holding it back or it is fundamentally flawed. Cycle the gun without the sideplate while holding the hand firmly down, see if it fails. Also inspect the inside of the sideplate for anything that might be touching the hand. You should be able to put a bit of counterpressure on the cylinder and feel the hand engage, it will engage during the earliest part of the trigger stroke and maintain engagement throughout the stroke if you don't back off at all. Any letoff will let it slip.Matt I have an oversize one and i'll fit it at the next days Check to see if the gun runs ok with the sideplate on but the yoke screw removed. Leave the other two sideplate screws in place and tight. If it does run ok, you have a cylinder endshake / yoke endshake issue. As you can see on video the problem exists even trere is'nt any screw on the side plate .Thats why i believe this is'nt a yoke issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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