Bentsight Posted May 27, 2011 Share Posted May 27, 2011 Didn't want to hyjack the LMOS thread so, anyone made any comparisons between the two or similar BCG for competition AR's? If not, could you make up for the weight difference between the two by different settings on the gas block and get like results? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsmith918 Posted May 27, 2011 Share Posted May 27, 2011 I'm wondering the same thing right now. I can get a great deal on Young NM Light BCG's until the end of the month, but can't find a comparison of the Young Light and the JP. I already have JP gas blocks and LMOS buffers and am trying to decide on which BCG to get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShooterSteve Posted May 27, 2011 Share Posted May 27, 2011 I have a Youngs NM lw in my match gun and I am very happy with it. It cleans up very easily, just a simple wipe down and it looks like brand new. I've never had a problem with the gun cycling. I think it has enough weight to get the job done, but it is light enough to help a lot with recoil reduction, and this gun has always run great for me. It is matched up with a Vltor emod kit, so that is the spring and buffer I'm using with it. I am extremely happy with this set up, and if I build another rifle, I would do it the same way again. I know JP makes great stuff, as I use a lot of it, but I don't have any experience with their carriers. I read somewhere in these forums about the Youngs products, and happened to be in the middle of a build at the time. I'm glad I did because it has been a great product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShooterSteve Posted May 27, 2011 Share Posted May 27, 2011 I meant to add that I take an occasional class from a local grandmaster, and he shot this rifle and was very impressed with how softly it shot and how good the recoil reduction was. The parts mentioned above are matched with an 18" JP supermatch barrel with the coolie comp. The whole system works together to make a great shooting rifle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted May 27, 2011 Share Posted May 27, 2011 You can't make up for the mass difference. The less reciprocating mass the less its gonna hit you in the shoulder period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted May 27, 2011 Share Posted May 27, 2011 You can't make up for the mass difference. The less reciprocating mass the less its gonna hit you in the shoulder period. Yep. The Youngs NM is HEAVIER than Mil-Spec. When they "lighten" it, it ends up being about the same weight as a Mil-Spec. Both have enlarged contact surfaces, so essentially, on the Youngs, you end up with more drag which slows down the carrier assembly, not necessarily a bad thing, but it does change the recoil characteristics and it will take a bit more gas to run than the JP. The JP is lighter, so the enlarged contact ends up providing about the same force (remember F=ma, always!) and carrier speed, but with less momentum to the rear which is what the recoil is really all about. When it coems down to the brass tacks, the JP LMOS is superior to the Youngs. For the OP, yes I have tested both in the same gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
00bullitt Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 I've got a fair amount of experience with all of the bolt carriers. I've got two Young Lightened NM, A standard Young NM, a JP Lightened SS, a few full auto BCG's and a semi auto that I lightened myself. Weights are as follows: Full Auto BCG - 11.5 ounces Semi Auto BCG - 11.1 ounces Young NM - 11.2 ounces Young Lightened NM - 10.5 ounces JP Lightweight SS - 9.5 ounces Lightened Semi auto by me - 10.7 ounces My personal choice for my competition guns are the Youngs Lightened NM. Reason being...I've had malfunctions in a rifle that has never malfunctioned when I ran the JP. The JP definitely had the lightest feeling recoil impulse, but my confidence is not there with it. I have never had a single problem in thousands of rounds with the lightened Young's NM. I do not run an adjustable gas block. I personally just don't feel the decreased reliability is worth the small amount that it gains. I believe heavily in an effective comp. I choose to run the SJC Titan and I run the Lightened Young NM carrier that I IonBonded over the hard chrome. I can spit on it and clean it up and it looks new. That combo provides me excellent tracking and follow through and it is reliable. Reliability means a lot more to me than a slight decreased recoil feel. The Titan does a phenomenal job of that already. Thats my .02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickB Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 There are two Young light carriers; Young Light Carrier http://www.youngmanufacturing.net/product-info.php?pid102.html Young Super Light; http://www.youngmanufacturing.net/product-info.php?pid135.html I believe the Super Light is about 0.5 oz heavier than the JP LMOS carrier. When my Super Light carriers arrive I'll weigh them. I'll also be making comparisons against rifles with Colt M-16 carriers and the Super Lights. Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 I have two of the Young's lightened bolt carriers and two of the JP's. Personally I prefer the Young's because you can use it with a forward assist. The JP doesn't have the notches for the FA. I find the JP's shoot a tad softer. But I'd give up that small edge for FA compatibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmchambers06 Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 If you need a forward assist during a match you've got big problems!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 With a FA it's a minor problem. Without an FA you've turned a minor problem into a...??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
00bullitt Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 With a FA it's a minor problem. Without an FA you've turned a minor problem into a...??? Im gonna have to disagree with you there. If you've got an ammo problem or an extremely dirty chamber....you can quickly compound your problem by 10. By using the Forward Assist under the wrong conditions, you very might well end up with a DNF for that stage. But hey.....as Kelly Neal likes to say..."I hope all of my competition uses the Forward Assist". And for the weight comparisons above...I was not referring to the new Super Light Young. I have not yet felt the need to obtain one yet since the regular lightweight works so well in my setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 You need to know when to use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERIC Posted May 29, 2011 Share Posted May 29, 2011 I never had a problem with my JP and I'd rather jack the round out instead of using the FA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted May 29, 2011 Share Posted May 29, 2011 I was using my CTR02 today during a rifle match. The gun was dry and was sluggish. At one time I had to recycle the bolt and feed another round in after I didn't like how it chambered a round. Wouldn't have had to do that if I had an FA. With an FA I would have just smacked it once or twice to make sure it was in full battery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carbon9 Posted May 29, 2011 Share Posted May 29, 2011 I was using my CTR02 today during a rifle match. The gun was dry and was sluggish. At one time I had to recycle the bolt and feed another round in after I didn't like how it chambered a round. Wouldn't have had to do that if I had an FA. With an FA I would have just smacked it once or twice to make sure it was in full battery. Hmmm, preventive maintenance/lubricant or forward assist. Hell of a pick between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted May 29, 2011 Share Posted May 29, 2011 I only clean my rifles after it gets sluggish or before a big match. The CTR02 still ran 100%. Sluggish and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted May 29, 2011 Share Posted May 29, 2011 So yeah... I would pick an FA and clean only when it's sluggish or before a big match. Over cleaning the gun more than the above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warpspeed Posted May 29, 2011 Share Posted May 29, 2011 To the OP's original question, I'd go with the JP LMOS. I've seen JP stuff on the prize tables and their support of USPSA & 3 gun matches. That is all I'd need . BTW, I run a JP LMOS. I've never had any issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bentsight Posted May 31, 2011 Author Share Posted May 31, 2011 Great site that is new shooter friendly! Thanks to all for the replies and the valuable info for comparisons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norone Posted May 31, 2011 Share Posted May 31, 2011 Excellent reading! I have a book I keep on my CTR since opening to log rounds and "incidents/observations". I have had no problems but one soft primer hit on the second round fed at the beginning of the shooting day at round count of about 100. No issues as of then. The goal is 600 rounds before I claw the grit off. But listen, I am experimenting on purpose. I have not altered the gun nor cleaned or oil since I opened it in January. I'm gonna run it till it literally trys to run away from home. As for FA's I have not seen any tactical applicability to it in my carbine use overseas and in 3 gun or fun. When in doubt rack the sucka over and over till your happy. You can do .20 splits on IPSC's A's at 30m with a rack in between with one mag of practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corey Posted May 31, 2011 Share Posted May 31, 2011 would a person be able to simply swap bolt carriers and notice a difference? Im assuming that getting the whole package (bolt carrier, bolt, low mass buffer) would be the ideal way but would just a single part even be worth talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickB Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 Yes. It's the carrier that is reduced mass. A JP low mass rifle buffer is basically the same weight as a standard carbine buffer. Mick would a person be able to simply swap bolt carriers and notice a difference? Im assuming that getting the whole package (bolt carrier, bolt, low mass buffer) would be the ideal way but would just a single part even be worth talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carbon9 Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 (edited) Let me start with..... this is not a fair comparison, just a really quick one. I'll add more in about 3 weeks when I get the time. I have a 20" rifle length gas LW barrel, Young's MFG NM Lightened carrier with, carbine(UBR) stock, carbine buffer, SSS spring and Titan comp. I just built a "cheapie" 16" mid-length gas Nordic/Wilson barrel, Young's MFG SLC(super light carrier), rifle(PRS) stock, rifle buffer, SSS spring and Nordic Corvette comp. Both have non-adjustable gas. The "cheapie" seems to move a lot less(neither moves much) even though it is lighter but the action is a whole lot noisier. I just did a few things which may tone the action noise down, we'll see. The 20" feels super smooth and solid in a very positive and precise manner. I could live happily with either one(and will). I do have a JP LMOS Carrier and JP rifle light buffer I will try in their respective places on both builds when I get back from my travels. I will also try both JP rifle and carbine springs in place of the SSS to see what the difference is. Personally, I feel you can tune and or get used to any combination of the above and be perfectly fine. Practice is so much more important. We are all probably splitting hairs at this point instead of just shooting more! Build what you want,shoot, learn, change it, shoot, learn more! ....and then....shoot more. edited for typos Edited June 1, 2011 by carbon9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpha Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 Great site that is new shooter friendly! Thanks to all for the replies and the valuable info for comparisons. +1 very helpful thread. This thread helped me pick out a new BCG for my 3-gun rifle. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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