nxfedlt1 Posted November 29, 2010 Share Posted November 29, 2010 getting the wife and her friends into shooting after they approached me about wanting to learn. I have 0 experience with 9mm, and load only 45 and 6,6.5mm rifle. I purchased them a Dan Wesson Pm9 and need to come up with something easy. I added a tungsten GR I had laying around, so I'm hoping to find a powder puff load. It just needs to punch holes and smack steel. thanks, nick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB38Super Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 140 gr cast lead bullet, 3.0 to 3.2 gr WST. All of our beginning students just love this (so do I!). Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aircooled6racer Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 Hello: Try 147 grain Precision moly's and 2.6 grains of Tite Group and a 1.140" OAL. I think it will be about 120PF. Thanks, Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nxfedlt1 Posted November 30, 2010 Author Share Posted November 30, 2010 that sounds perfect for what I am after. Any one have loads for clays? I have jugs of that laying around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Vigilante Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 (edited) I found a load in LoadData for Clays and 9mm and 147g lead bullet. 1.9g is the starting load and 2.8g is the maximum load. After you try it out let us know how it works out. The 1.9g makes 98PF. The 2.8g load makes 128PF. This has to be one of the "Powder Puff" loads of all time!!! Edited November 30, 2010 by The_Vigilante Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodownzero Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 I found a load in LoadData for Clays and 9mm and 147g lead bullet. 1.9g is the starting load and 2.8g is the maximum load. After you try it out let us know how it works out. The 1.9g makes 98PF. The 2.8g load makes 128PF. This has to be one of the "Powder Puff" loads of all time!!! Stay away from Clays in 9mm with heavy bullets. It will hardly cycle the gun at 2.8-3 grains and there's a reason why most books won't list it. I have not tried Clays with lighter bullets but I would avoid it with heavy bullets, for sure. My load is 3.4-3.5 Solo 1000, 147 moly, at 1.120" and it's in the 135-137 pf range. I'm sure the gun would still run at 3 grains of Solo and it'd be super soft. Even my minor load (3.4-3.5) is very soft. Any lighter than that is going to be even softer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWFAN Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 I found a load in LoadData for Clays and 9mm and 147g lead bullet. 1.9g is the starting load and 2.8g is the maximum load. After you try it out let us know how it works out. The 1.9g makes 98PF. The 2.8g load makes 128PF. This has to be one of the "Powder Puff" loads of all time!!! Stay away from Clays in 9mm with heavy bullets. It will hardly cycle the gun at 2.8-3 grains and there's a reason why most books won't list it. I have not tried Clays with lighter bullets but I would avoid it with heavy bullets, for sure. My load is 3.4-3.5 Solo 1000, 147 moly, at 1.120" and it's in the 135-137 pf range. I'm sure the gun would still run at 3 grains of Solo and it'd be super soft. Even my minor load (3.4-3.5) is very soft. Any lighter than that is going to be even softer. ^THIS^ My PM-9 runs great on 147gr BBI, and 3.8gr Solo 1000 (its a slow lot, my old load was 3.4) It also runs on 4.0 Titegroup and 124jhp. Not to hot of a load, but the 147 will be better. If you want jacketed, 3.2Titegroup and a 147jacketed is very soft also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Vigilante Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 Twodownzero, Just curious, have you actually tried the 2.8g Clays with a 147g bullet? Not trying to be a smartass-just curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodownzero Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 Twodownzero, Just curious, have you actually tried the 2.8g Clays with a 147g bullet? Not trying to be a smartass-just curious. Yes I have. I loaded about 500 of them back in 2008. They'd cycle the gun in practice, about 85% of the time, if you got a good, tight grip on the gun. Even a minor amount of limp wristing would result in a malfunction. I ordered the Lyman Pistol and Revolver manual just so I could verify that this was an actual published load before I loaded any. If you look back through my posts from that time, you might find some info on it. It was that experience that caused me to discover Solo 1000 on this forum. Clays is great in .45 and shotguns but I don't load it in .40 major or 9mm minor. There's a reason why the published loads for it are few and far between and I recommend against it. Even so, if you want to load it, they're in the Lyman book and I suggest you do so with extreme caution and be very sure that you chrono the ammo AND double check your COAL. I wouldn't publish a recommendation on the open forum for any load without having actually tried it unless the recommendation was blatantly obvious from inspection (pistol powder in a rifle or something). I have loaded it and I wouldn't load it again. I don't think I'm out of line in sharing my experience, but if you think so, by all means, feel free to load it. It's a published load by Lyman--even if Hodgdon will no longer publish it. It's also one that I have strong reasons to believe leaves very little margin for error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Vigilante Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 Thanks for your feedback. I noticed you didn't mention .40 Minor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodownzero Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 Thanks for your feedback. I noticed you didn't mention .40 Minor. I don't load .40 minor. I've thus far been lucky and not even loaded any by accident! The .40 case is much bigger than 9mm, so if I were loading .40 minor, I'd consider using Clays. But ever since I discovered Solo 1000, which works great in .40 and 9mm, I haven't had any desire to go back to Clays. I do wonder if Clays would make my .40 any softer, but Solo and Clays are so close that I'm not sure I could tell much difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 If it's at all possible (even renting), I'd recommend having your wife and her friends shoot a .22 pistol (even a little bit) before the 9mm 1911, it will pay dividends. While a 9mm 1911 is mild, and nothing to us, it still makes a fair amount of noise and moves around enough that it's distracting to new, uncertain shooters. After they've shot a couple of magazines worth of .22, hand them the 9mm and let them know it'll be somewhat louder, and move more, but won't hurt. I say this because most of my time instructing is fixing the results of when people don't do the above. R, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All-Gator Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 I've been shooting a 147g. Zero JHP in front of 3.0/3.1 Clays for about two years. The OAL is 1.115 and the crimp is moderate from a Lee Factory Crimp die. My CZ85C and my CZ7SA have absolutely no problems with reliabiliy. Muzzle flip is virtually absent. The PF is 130 and the hulls are chucked a good distance. The WSR primers show no flow, flattening, or cratering. The only problem is convincing other shooters that it is a legal load...it pretty much sounds like a mouse fart. I repeatedly have seen the admonition that Clays should not be used with heavy bullets. But I never see why...just the warning. There may be some history of which I am unaware, but I have had no problem. BTW, in playing around with various loads, I found that at about 2.6g. both pistols will fail to cock the hammer about one out of three...even though ejecting the hull. Never gone lower. A-G One last addition: Playing around at the range I shot some of the load through my Czechmate. It funtioned perfectly and...for whatever reason...the fps increased about 100 fps. ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred5876r Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 3.4 TG give 135 PF in my M&P 9L with 147 FMJ. I use 3.0 TG for steel and club matches. Very soft but 100% reliable with a 13# ISMI spring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All-Gator Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 Read the reply above and realized both of my pistols are set up for competition: Thus, they have 11# recoil springs and 13# main springs. Another variable that should be taken into account. A-G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikerburgess Posted December 1, 2010 Share Posted December 1, 2010 my soft load is a 158g lrn over 3g bullseye shoots very soft but smokes a bit. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nxfedlt1 Posted December 1, 2010 Author Share Posted December 1, 2010 thanks, this is exactly the info I have been looking for. I checked my Hornady book last night, and sure enough no load for clays. Now to find some 147gr zeros.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M-Bear Posted December 2, 2010 Share Posted December 2, 2010 3.7 gr tight group over a MG 124 is pretty soft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robin303 Posted December 4, 2010 Share Posted December 4, 2010 that sounds perfect for what I am after. Any one have loads for clays? I have jugs of that laying around. I like 4.5 of Clays at a 1.130 OAL with the 115. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOF Posted December 4, 2010 Share Posted December 4, 2010 Winchester Super Field (WSF)is an extremely good powder for 147/9mm. It seems to have an ideal burn rate for that small case, although it sucks in .38 Special, and isn't the best choice in .45 ACP. I use 3.4 grains and make 875 fps from a 4.25 inch 9mm M&P with perfect functiong with factory springs. It makes 125 PF easily, with less recoil than any 115 or 124 grain load that will make 125 PF (and drops steel better than the lighter bullets). It also works beatufully in my CZ-85 Combat, with factory springs. Little muzzle flash, very clean burning, and very nice, soft, recoil. There are 7000 grains in a pound of powder. At 3.4 grains per load I'm getting about 2,000 loads per pound. Works with jacketed (my choice) or cast lead (I've used them with this load without problem or smoke). GOF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
open17 Posted December 4, 2010 Share Posted December 4, 2010 MG 147CMJ over 3.5 gr N320. OAL 1.140. 132 PF. My wifes single stack gun is a Series 70 Colt 9mm. 17 lb mainspring, 11 lb recoil, it's like shooting a .22. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 thanks, this is exactly the info I have been looking for. I checked my Hornady book last night, and sure enough no load for clays. Now to find some 147gr zeros.... There's a reason for that 3.7gr of Clays with a 125gr FMJ is a max load. To give you an idea, the load mentioned above (4.5gr with a 115 at 1.13") is .6gr OVER book max. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhyrlik Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 3-3.5 grains of N320 under a 147 is the softest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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