Which has least parallax: Aimpoint M2/M3/M4, EOTech, or other ?

[StealthyBlagga]

I want to start running a 1x red dot optic on my 3-gun rifle. Parallax is a concern - I could be shooting out to 500yds, and would like to know which optic offers the least parallax error when the dot is not centered properly. I know the manufacturers claim their products are "parallax free", but I don't trust what I haven't measured. Does anyone know how the parallax compares between these optics at different distances out to 500yds ?

Edited August 9, 2010 by StealthyBlagga

[Pro2AInPA]

Parallax is an issue at CLOSE range, not far. Most optics are advertised as being parallax free past 25 yards or so.

[THM7]

Stealthy....check out the Eotech 557-AR223...it would be my first choice for Tac Iron (Limited). I love my Aimpoints but for 3gun I think the Eotech is the way to go for that div.

[SMSI]

I want to start running a 1x red dot optic on my 3-gun rifle. Parallax is a concern - I could be shooting out to 500yds, and would like to know which optic offers the least parallax error when the dot is not centered properly. I know the manufacturers claim their products are "parallax free", but I don't trust what I haven't measured. Does anyone know how the parallax compares between these optics at different distances out to 500yds ?

My understanding and belief is that the Eotech/Holosights are parallax free, and that this was and is an important feature to the special forces guys that tested them. I am told by reliable sources that you can break off most of the view screen, but as long as you can see the dot thru a part of the lens, no matter the angle of your view, you should still be hitting on the dot point of aim. I don't understand how that works, but so I am told. I haven't tried it myself and my eyes are way too old to shoot long range w/o magnification.

[2011BLDR]

There are 2 kinds of parallax as related to small arms :

1. Optical

2. Sight location relative to bore

Aim points and EOTech are both pretty much optical parallax free.

Both will have a parallax in the over bore height, the distance between the sighting mechanism and the weapon's bore can introduce significant errors when firing at close range and is also influenced by the chosen BZO and ballistics. A 14.5” barreled .223 firing M855 with a 25M/ 300M BZO will have a -4” offset at 1m a + 18” offset at 175M and be on at 25M & 300M

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax

Out.

2011BLDR

Edited August 13, 2010 by 2011BLDR

[grywlfbg]

Parallax is a by-product of magnification. Reflex sights like Aimpoints and EOTech's do not magnify so therefore are completely parallax free. If the dot is on the target there's where the bullet will go. Variable power optics actually magnify and "de-magnify" to get to 1X. This means that even at 1X you can have parallax problems. But not so w/ reflex sights. I like the EOTech reticle better for 3-gunning (smaller center dot for distance plus a BDC in the 557 and the large circle for close-in) but they are harder and batteries and more fragile than Aimpoints. Of course if you through a magnifier behind it then you have parallax to deal with again

I started out using an EOTech 557 w/ 3X magnifier behind it and it worked great at local matches that stopped at 200yds. But as I began shooting more big matches w/ distances out to 450 I just wanted more magnification. I'm even looking at going to 6 or 8X from my current 4X. Not all of us can shoot irons at 450 like Pat, Kurt, and Trapr

Edited August 13, 2010 by grywlfbg

[Jadeslade]

Eotech. 1moa dot with 65moa circle. I have friends who can routinely hit 300-400-500 yd IPSC or E targets with this. Quickly. Of course they used to do that for a living and are well trained. It is about getting the position and the vision.

[StealthyBlagga]

Parallax is a by-product of magnification. Reflex sights like Aimpoints and EOTech's do not magnify so therefore are completely parallax free...

I don't believe this is an accurate statement. I have a cheap red dot optic on a .22 rifle I built for my son. His zero is different from mine (shooting off a sand bag, tight groups etc.); I am pretty sure this is due to parallax (different head size/position).

I contacted EOTech and Aimpoint to ask about this question.

EOTech said the following: "The parallax free distance of the more recently produced HWS (after 2001) is somewhere between 100m and 300m. Older ones are between 50m to 100m. The change is due to the increase use of the sight at longer distances instead of just in CQB. There is some sight to sight variation due to the manufacturing tolerances in such a compact sight. Nevertheless, the effect to on accuracy is small. The sight aperture of the HWS is about 32mm x 22mm. In precision shooting, the reticle is likely to be looked through with the reticle within the center half of the window or about +/- 8mm from the center of the window. As an example, a sight that is set to be parallax free at 100m, the parallax error at 500m is +/- 32mm. That corresponds to +/- 0.22 moa of parallax error which is extremely small for a 1X scope."

Aimpoint claims "parallax free" on their website, and has a pretty convincing explanation as to why. They assert that other red dot sights do indeed suffer from parallax error.

I was hoping somebody had actually measured parallax on one or both optic types. Maybe I'll try to borrow an EOTech and compare it with my Aimpoint. Or maybe I'll just buy another Aimpoint and be done with it.

Edited August 15, 2010 by StealthyBlagga

[kellyn]

Team Leupold says that the Prismatic has less parallax (although I have no idea if it's true).

[NPSS]

Parallax is a by-product of magnification. Reflex sights like Aimpoints and EOTech's do not magnify so therefore are completely parallax free. If the dot is on the target there's where the bullet will go.

This is simply false.

[Stlhead]

Parallax is a byproduct of magnification, but magnification is not the only cause. In the two models of aim points I used in limited prior to converting to a Priz I found the parallax to be considerably less of a factor than in the magnified optics commonly in use in our sport, but still enough to require good shooting technique for small targets or long shots (2 MOA or over 300). The Priz does seem to be more forgiving at distance as to eye placement, but you pay for it with the same optical aberration at close distance that all the variables have at 1x if you leave both eyes open. I ran aim points for years and had good success with them, parallax will not be your biggest issue with them, the variable size of the aiming reticle was what ultimately pushed me to the Priz, along with the ability of the Priz to adjust the diopter (no more perscription shooting glasses that made it tough to see the front sight on my pistol as clear as I like). On a sunny day I would have to crank up my dot to see it, it would get bigger and less distinct making long shots tougher. I still got my hits, but I get them faster and with less effort with the Priz.

[Alita]

I used 2 EoTech red dots in 3 gun for 2 years. a 512 and an EXPS 3-4. I didn't notice any parallax issues at all. I successfully engaged a 500m target with the EXPS on my ACR 75gr handload, and was 12" high on a single shot bonus target at 700m with the 512 on my stock AR-15 55gr FMJ factory load (ACR was in the shop). I have hit numerous 300m and in targets I hit with no issues, as long as I did my part with rifle fundamentals. My 75gr handloads pattern better past 300m.

[dauntedfuture]

They are all about the same. I have used Aimpoint M2, M3, M4, MICRO and EOTECHs. I don't think that you will be able to tell a difference. Head position will effect shot position if shots are inside 50M. The close to 50M you are the less parallax there is. Past 50M there is none. If you zero these optics at 25M, head position and position of the dot will effect your shots on target. We are not talking much, 1" at most but there is some. Is general its not an issue on close big targets if the dot is anywhere close to the center and no issue at all past 50M.

I don't know about the leupold 1X.

Shot placement in relation to bore to sight, hold over, is another matter

[Alita]

They are all about the same. I have used Aimpoint M2, M3, M4, MICRO and EOTECHs. I don't think that you will be able to tell a difference. Head position will effect shot position if shots are inside 50M. The close to 50M you are the less parallax there is. Past 50M there is none. If you zero these optics at 25M, head position and position of the dot will effect your shots on target. We are not talking much, 1" at most but there is some. Is general its not an issue on close big targets if the dot is anywhere close to the center and no issue at all past 50M.

I don't know about the leupold 1X.

Shot placement in relation to bore to sight, hold over, is another matter

Yup, which is why I perfered the EoTech for competitions, the bottom of the outer ring is 7m if you use a 50m zero. Anything about a car length away you use the bottom of the circle, works great.

[Stlhead]

I love the internet, multiple contradictory answers to a simple question. I am changing my answer to "Borrow and test them for yourself" PM me if you need an M4 or a micro to play with. I do not have a spare Priz to lend right now, and EoTechs never worked for me, so you are on your own with those options.

[kurtm]

AH....WELL......Richard, real IRON sights have zero paralax .... now carry on!

[Alaskapopo]

No its not correct to state red dots are parallax free. They are not. Now the amount of parallax is very minor and most don't notice it but its is there.

Pat

[StealthyBlagga]

Wow - someone brought this thread back from the dead. In the end I chose an Aimpoint ML3 2MOA, and have been running it for the past 5 years. When I miss it is because I suck, not because of parallax.

[Stlhead]

Zombie threads are the best.