IPSC scoring for Android

[Kupsi]

Hi.

I'm creating an IPSC match scoring app for Android. The app is released in the Android Market, but I need feedback and comments from you to make it better.

If someone with an Android phone would take a look and give me feedback it would be nice. You can get the app from this website: http://www.psmsapp.com/

Best regards,

Arild

[wgnoyes]

It needs to do USPSA matches and not just IPSC.

[Chris Keen]

I have a Droid Eris from HTC with 2.1 loaded on it, so I'll give it a try. Thanks for your efforts.

[Heckler]

Just installed it on my Droid, will let you know.

[Kupsi]

Looking forward for your replies

[Chris Keen]

Wow! ! ! Super impressed with this app! This is the real deal folks. I downloaded the app this morning as I was headed out the door to go shoot, then attempted to use it at our local match today but the rain kept me from using it on the last stage, but I am really really impressed. Add some functionality to enable the user a choice between Ipsc and Uspsa and I think it would be perfect!

Two thumbs up!

[edison]

Love the "A-time" tool.

[Chris Keen]

Not sure I saw that little feature in the program. What's the "A-time" tool?

I havent fully checked it out yet, but I plan to. Wasn't sure where to find a place to mark for a "no-shoot/penalty target (could that be the P/T box?) and definitely didn't find a place to mark a no-penalty mike. And unless you're seeking an official blessing from USPSA/IPSC, I would like to see a way display a "combined results" list, even though it's not an official list it's still fun for friends to compare themselves to each other even while shooting 2 different divisions.

[Kupsi]

Hi again.

I've changed the box name from P/T to NS in version 1.5.1. (Update from the market.)

But what is a no-penalty mike? And what's the differences between IPSC and USPSA scoring?

I don't do practical shooting my self, there was a friend asking me to make this app, so sorry for my lack of knowledge. I also live in Norway, so please excuse my bad english.

Chris: "A time" is the the time you could have used on a stage, to get the same hitfactor, if you scored only A and had no Miss, NS or Proc. You find it under "Tools" in the "Main menu". If you want to score shooters from different divisions combined, please change them to the same division temporary. Go to "View / Register particpants" and click on the participants you need to change. That shouldn't take long.

Thank you for your replies.

Best regards,

Arild

Edited June 28, 2010 by Kupsi

[Chris Keen]

Hi again.

I've changed the box name from P/T to NS in version 1.5.1. (Update from the market.)

But what is a no-penalty mike? And what's the differences between IPSC and USPSA scoring?

I don't do practical shooting my self, there was a buddy asking me to make this app, so sorry for my lack of knowledge. I also live in Norway, so please excuse my bad english.

Chris: "A time" is the the time you could have used on a stage, to get the same hitfactor, if you scored only A and had no Miss, NS or Proc. If you want to score shooters from different divisions combined, please change them to the same division temporary. Go to "View / Register particpants" and click on the participants you need to change. That shouldn't take long.

Thank you for your replies.

Best regards,

Arild

No problem, your English in good enough for us shooters.

Hey that's a great idea on combined scoring .... in fact I suppose one could enter all competitors as OPEN just to see combined results. Especially since this is not an "official" scoring program.

Thanks for changing the P/T to NS. We were talking about what P/T could stand for, and Penalty Target was all I could come up with. Is that right? Without any instructions that was my best guess. Maybe IPSC doesnt have No-Penalty Mikes, but in USPSA from time to time we have a moving target that disappears at the end of travel (either a gravity-turner or a sliding target) so if the shooter has a mike on that target we call that a No-Penalty Mike, and he only loses the points available on that target, no added penalty for the miss.

The other difference between IPSC & USPSA is the "name" of the different divisions. OPEN stays the same, and so does PRODUCTION, but STANDARD becomes LIMITED. For the purposes of a handy-dandy scoring program that is nothing more than a novelty, We can probably get by with using the word STANDARD. Or like I said just enter all competitors as OPEN.

The scoring portion of the app is the bomb! The inclusion of 1 box to act as an BRAVO or a CHARLIE (B/C) was brilliant, since they both score the same points! I like the interface of just touching the boxes to add the hits. That's a lot easier than trying to enter a number from the 10 digit keypad for each target. Love it.

Thanks again for your efforts. This is awesome! Can't wait to see what else you can do with it in the future!

Edited June 28, 2010 by Chris Keen

[pmd]

Cool - I'll download and check it out today.

BTW - I have an HTC Incredible..

Also - Any thoughts about making a simple app for scoring Steel Challenge?

Thanks.

Paul

[Kupsi]

Chris: Yes, P/T was ment to be penalty target.

A disappearing target, is it always a paper target or could it be steel targets too? And is it possible to get a normal miss and a no penalty miss on the same disappearing target, or is only no penalty miss possible?

I ask because if it's always a paper target and you can't get a normal miss and a no penalty miss on the same target, I could let the button turn yellow (indicating that it's a no penalty miss) if you long press it. And then you wouldn't get the -10 points for the misses registered on that button when calculating the hitfactor.

If I must make a new column for the no penalty miss, it would make the other buttons smaller :/

pmd: What's a Steel Challenge?

Edited June 28, 2010 by Kupsi

[DWFAN]

How about for Windows Mobile.

[lugnut]

Love the "A-time" tool.

+1 That is really cool! USPSA guy here too. Nice work.

[Heckler]

I have spent a little time playing around with the app is it really is amazing. Looking forward to having USPSA divisions.

Arild, for not being a practical shooter you have done a GREAT job.

[Chris Keen]

Chris: Yes, P/T was ment to be penalty target.

A disappearing target, is it always a paper target or could it be steel targets too? And is it possible to get a normal miss and a no penalty miss on the same disappearing target, or is only no penalty miss possible?

I ask because if it's always a paper target and you can't get a normal miss and a no penalty miss on the same target, I could let the button turn yellow (indicating that it's a no penalty miss) if you long press it. And then you wouldn't get the -10 points for the misses registered on that button when calculating the hitfactor.

If I must make a new column for the no penalty miss, it would make the other buttons smaller :/

A No-Penalty-Mike target is ALWAYS a paper target, and will ALWAYS incur the mikes as No-Penalty. Both hits would be scored the same way. In other words a NPM target will NEVER incur a normal "miss" penalty on either hit.

If you need a new column for the NPM, I would think you could do away with the X (clear score) column because you can always clear the hits/penalties in the other columns by taping that button again. However I like the idea of it being yellow for easy visibility. Those type of misses are easily overlooked, causing all kinds of scoring errors. I know because I do stats for 3 out of 4 local clubs in my area.

Whatever you do please don't make the buttons any smaller. They are just about perfect as is.

Thanks for the quick work ...... I've already downloaded the update which changes the P/T to a NS!

This is awesome!!!!!

Edited June 28, 2010 by Chris Keen

[lugnut]

Is there a place to put shooter's classifications? Looks solid to me so far.

[Chris Keen]

Classifications for each shooter would be nice, but not necessary. Just as having their USPSA membership number is not really necessary either. This appears to be a simple way to personally keep track of the scores of people on your own squad, to see how you compare in the standings, while still shooting stages. This is not an "official" way to score a match.

I certainly like what I see so far.

However while adding the stages for some upcoming Sectional/Area matches I plan to attend, I noticed a couple of flaws. First it's not possible to have a stage with cardboard targets that require any more or any less than 2 hits. In other words, I would like to be able to designate that a stage have 6 targets, each target scoring the best 4 hits (4 being an example, maybe more or maybe less), for a total of 24 hits.

The same stage scenario might also dictate that there are 2 (or even 3, or 4) strings of fire, each with a separate "time". While I know I can simply add the 2 or 3 times to get my Total Time, it seems like there should be a way to allow multiple string times to be entered in the software. Would certainly make it easier & alot more convenient. I know I slowed waaay down yesterday when I came upon a multiple string stage, and did not get any of my fellow shooters scores entered for that stage, as adding 3 times for every shooter became too much to do.

Also I noticed that you cannot have more than 16 targets. But there is a stage at an upcoming match that only requires 1 shot per target, and has a total of 24 paper targets. This generated an error when I tried to enter more than the max. 16 targets.

* SEE NEXT POST FOR FURTHER INFO ON THIS SUBJECT * We also need a place to designate the type of scoring that will be used: Comstock, Virginia Count, or Fixed Time. Comstock is an unlimited number of shots, while Virginia Count only allows a MAXIMUM number of shots/hits (eg: no more than 1 per target, or 2 per target, etc.)(this also requires additional penalty boxes (1 for Extra Shot, 1 for Extra Hit)), and finally Fixed Time is just what it sounds like - a "par time" stage where it is not necessary to record the time - only the hits (misses are NOT penalized ..... but this style of scoring also requires extra penalty boxes (1 for Extra Shot, 1 for Extra Hit, and 1 for "Late Shots" fired beyond the par time which only penalize -5 points off instead of the usual -10 points).

Edited June 28, 2010 by Chris Keen

[Chris Keen]

After talking to a buddy, we decided that maybe I am being a little bit too OCD. In the interest of keeping this thing simple and easy to use (not to mention write the program).

VIRGINIA COUNT, and the penalties that go along with it, may not be absolutely necessary, because they can simply be recorded as "Procedurals".

FIXED TIME, I suppose could always be entered with the TIME the same for each shooter. However "Overtime Shots" would need to be fixed to only give the shooter a -5 penalty instead of the regular -10 penalty. Or if that's not feasible, I guess as long as this is still just for fun, and everybody got the same penalty (-10) then it really wouldn't be that big of a deal. Fixed Time stages aren't very popular, and don't come up more than once or twice a year, if that.

Edited June 28, 2010 by Chris Keen

[Chris Keen]

One last thing I just thought of is when a stage doesn't have any steel targets (all paper), then it's not really necessary to have the row for steel targets at the top of the screen on that stage. Not a problem, per se, just a thought.

[Kupsi]

My friend have only told me about the Comstock scoring, so I thought that was all. Now I need to look into the Virginia Count and Fixed Time to see what can be done. He also told me that 16 paper targets would be max because there's a limit of 32 shoots pr. stage, and 2 shoots / target. Ouch...

But I've uploaded a new version (1.5.2) where you are able to "long click" the Miss buttons and then they turn yellow. Could you give it a try and tell me if this is an OK method to tell the app that the miss is a "no penalty miss" instead of a "penalty miss"? (I haven't changed the calculation of the hitfactor yet, so it's still calculated as a "penalty miss" regardless of color.)

[Chris Keen]

Will do .......

[Chris Keen]

But I've uploaded a new version (1.5.2) where you are able to "long click" the Miss buttons and then they turn yellow. Could you give it a try and tell me if this is an OK method to tell the app that the miss is a "no penalty miss" instead of a "penalty miss"? (I haven't changed the calculation of the hitfactor yet, so it's still calculated as a "penalty miss" regardless of color.)

Hey that's pretty nifty! I like it! Is it possible to have it say 1NP or 2NP when the box is yellow, instead of a standard 1 or 2?

[Chris Keen]

I also discovered another small difference between IPSC scoring & USPSA scoring. IPSC has a maximum of 2 No-Shoots per Penalty target. Which is the way it used to be for us here in the States as well. But a few years ago we switched back to an unlimited number of No-Shoots per Penalty Target. Could you add functionality to add as many No-Shoots as we need? I would think about 10 per P/T would be enough. Maybe 12. Not necessarily an unlimited number. Remember we're talking "per target" here so more could always be added to another target (T2, T3, etc.)

Also I'm not sure we need an unlimited number of "Procedurals" per target. Again maybe 10-12 per target.

I'm trying to make it easy to correct going over the intended number of Procedurals, without having to hit the X and clear ALL the hits on that target, when maybe you just want to correct hitting 2 Procedurals, when you only meant to hit 1. The A, B/C, D, M, and NS boxes are easy to correct, but the Proc. box is not.

[Kupsi]

dwfan: I believe I have enough work to do on the Android version for a while

lugnut: Classifications can be added later. No problem. But I'll focus on getting the score right first