outerlimits

have real open shotguns, not limited 10. come up with ways to better separate tactical and open in rifle allow for a mixture of paper target types within a multigun stage-the turtle targets are great for rifle, but suck for everything else. dump the double penalty values of of enhanced targets. look at a long range rifle stage with 10-300+ yard targets worth 20 pts. each. say someone hits 8 of 10 for 160 pts. his penalties for the 2 are -40 each, so he ends up dropping 120 pts and has a whopping 40 pts for hitting 8 of 10. i love flying clays, but if they cannot be thrown consistently for EVERY shooter, get rid of 'em.

Elvis Costello "Beyond Belief" I met you Before the fall of Rome And I begged you To let me take you home You were wrong I was right You said goodbye I said good night ___ ____ ______ ______ bare naked ladies?

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=dd9_1257297747

As Pat mentioned earlier, there probably isn't one "best" comp. A lot of it does have to do with body size/shape, and shooting style. Personally, I'm an average height fat kid, but I love the PWS comp w/ the flash hider. I have run three other comps and this one is the heat. Flat and no blowback. Two inch doubles at 50 yards. It is also fun to shoot at night....no flash Adios, TG hey travis-was that the comp that you shoved thru 1/2" of plywood at the MG nats?

here's that wild clay...an exception, but still wild.

I would have to disagree with the wind comment, I do not recall a tornado or rogue sandstorm when both clays zipped directly over my head and one actually hit the stage wall 20 feet behind me. Just an observation from one of the "wild flier" recipients. It was all good fun though, I think I have had Teel fly over my duck blind slower than that i'll upload a video on utube tonight of one. i was behind the shooter with the camera and the clay landed at my feet. after the shooter we measured how far and it traveled 43 feet behind the shooter's location. the flipper was a good 26 feet in front of the shooter.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f89_1257192312

we did observe a rather bizare safety table, i think it was on stage 8 or 9. it was around table marked "safe area". a few of us walked up there and went "i don't think so"!

I thought it was good-thought 2006 in Albany was better. Didn't make last year so can't compare. Only a couple stages were not up to nationals standards. Stage 1 needed some QC. I do think the range was great and I hope they come back. I know I'll get lit up for this, but I do think the stages need a bit more review. RO's were all great (with one old exception). I'll go again, but I'll probably be looking at the "outlaw" matches from now on.

big dave's what, 7' 6" gotta like this rule. but, the RM told me that sign was not a wall or a vision barrier-just a sign.

it is a strange interpretation of the rules. 10.2.1 states: A competitor who fires shots while any part of their body is touching the ground or while stepping on an object beyond a Shooting Box or a Fault Line, or who gains support or stability through contact with an object which is wholly beyond and not attached to a Shooting Box or Fault Line, will receive one procedural penalty for each occur­rence. However, if the competitor has gained a sig­nificant advantage on any target(s) while faulting, the competitor may instead be assessed one proce­dural penalty for each shot fired at the subject tar­get(s) while faulting. No penalty is assessed if a competitor does not fire any shots while faulting. i guess the argument was the sign was attached to the 1st box, even though the sign also was braced an touching the ground outside of the box. i remember a plastic pail right there that was clearly outside the box but screwed to the box. i asked if i could stand on it and shoot over the sign...RO said that would be considered out of the box.

here's the new one.

That ain't it...that's the ta33 version. The ta11 version is different. Trijicon site has it up there. Craig, what do u mean I haven'tused the one ihave? Ask and ye shall receive......

the only pain in the arse is tumbling loaded rifle hollow points...if yer media is a bit dirty and fine, you will fill up the tiniest of hollow points making them fmj's.

trijicon had one at the MG nats last weekend, think it was designated ta11h-g. this thing was sweet. normal super clear glass, but that new reticle looks awesome. loved the green and nice touch with the little green tip on top of the 300 yd hash mark. i think this is better than the donut. might just have to get one...but the green horseshoe is new and pretty rare in the ta11 right now. couldn't get the trijicon guy to go to the head so i could steal it.

I had read that post today when I did a search, but to be sure, do you take the retainer nut off after the loctite sets to put the barrel in, or is the barrel supposed to be on the whole 24 hrs? And lefty, is that because of a concern the outer nut will shift during the drying time, and putting in the retainer nut helps prevent it from shifting? i did the pin route like gentleman jim suggested...came right off the next day.

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They always are.. although for you and Chris.. they just seem normal .... practice yer shotgun reloads...prone...did i say alot? 22 rounds, baby...all prone. oh yea, then u get up and run a ways with a hot pistol and then shoot out to 360 with a rifle. oh yea, then back to shotgun for 12 slugs.

There's gotta be a rule against it somewher, modifying the stage or something.. next thing you know people will be bringing ladders to shoot over all the barricades.. I'd let you do it if you took the 20% handicap penalty... hey dave-wait till the thanksgiving match...every port will be LOW!

another thought on stage 1. being only 5' 8", i could not engage those flashers over the sign like many of my taller bros. i thought of sticking my bag in that spot and standing on it, but figured that was gay. but, having said that, what rule would prevent a shooter from gaining that type of advantage?

while on the topic of larues, i'm curious how they are even legal rifle targets, given 4.3 and appendix B7. if i read that right, the dimensions of metal plates have to be between 8" and 12".

The question I had was why were they calling hits on Stage 2 with steel that falls? Doug why not? they call hits on flashers. by calling hits, i mean when the larue fell, they called "hit". at 360+ yards it's hard for some folks to see hits anyway. we asked if they were and they said yes. and after what happened on stage 1 thursday morning, that was a good idea.

i might add that the stage 2 RO's were calling hits on the larues. not sure why they weren't for stage 1.

Which Division was won with a rifle making major power factor? From what I can tell looking at the results D. Horner did not get any additional penalties, which would lead one to believe that he was shooting Major PF in rifle. A few years back the 3gun Nationals was won by a shooter with a FN/FAL in .260. I think that was the last time a Majpr PF rifle was used by the winner. Alan i believe he shot some tricked out ar in 6.5 grendel.

great range, great match, great ro's, great location. based on the range improvements, i'm guessing we'll be back there soon. heard rumors tht all 3 will be there next year, with the MG being in spring. again, just rumors. lots of flying clays, i mean lots. only 2 swingers, and they were so slow it surprised everyone. stages all fair with many ways to shoot them. gotta love shooting at larues at 330 yds from a roof. that was great. tall guys got revenge finally, with stage 1. instead of having to shoot those flashers off-hand, you could take 4 of them over the top of a sign. i'm 5'8" and took one look thru my optic, couldn't see them. and i can't remember a MG nationals with so many pistol shots. great idea. can't wait to come back.