1050 primer feed problems

[kbear38S]

Dillon has not been able to solve this problem. I've spent far too many hours on the phone with them and the machine was returned Dillon and supposedly fixed but it's no better.

Out of every 100 rounds, one or two primers do not feed correctly. When it occurs, one primer, smeared at one side, and another undamaged primer are ejected onto the bench or the floor.

The damaged primer looks like this:

Sorry the pic isn't better.

When this occurs, a case is transferred to the powder station without a primer and depending on the powder, it makes a real mess as it runs out the primer hole. Sometimes I hear the primer get tossed out but not always.

I'm not loading real fast - 400-500 rounds per hour. The primer feed bar was already replaced without affecting anything, and the primer feed tube has been swapped with the one in my 550 where both work fine. I have no similar problems with the 550 so I doubt the Fed 205 primers are the problem. I cycle the lever to the stops at both ends.

Any ideas?

(Edited by kbear38S at 4:27 pm on Aug. 7, 2002)

[Flexmoney]

Is that the new Super 1050?

[TravisT]

This is sounding so familiar, but it’s been a long time. I’m thinking that the solution lied in the primer seating mechanism. I recall taking that whole assembly apart and polishing the piston that pushes the primer up through the primer feed bar. This solved a major issue, but I’m not certain if it was this particular one. It's worth a try. If it comes to me I'll let you know.

[Roger Rabbit]

Try disassemble the machine and clean every part. And try again.  May be the left over powder cause the feeding problem

[kbear38S]

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Try disassemble the machine and clean every part. And try again.  May be the left over powder cause the feeding problem

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Nah, the machine's been apart and cleaned many times without result.

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Is that the new Super 1050?

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It's a Franken1050. I purchased a Super1050 in May of 2001 to load Super. The early 1050s had several design flaws that made them index super fast - probably the last 1" of the up stroke, and all it was good for was throwing powder all over the table. On tech rep at Dillon actually told me it wasn't made for loading .40 S&W and .38 Super (!!).

I spent about 6 hours on the phone with Dillon and they finally had me return the machine. It was replaced with a second on that had some design changes but still wasn't really suitable for loading high charge volumn pistol cartridges. That one wasn't much better (this was before the cam change and index pawl overtravel mods). A friend of mine had purchased a Super 1050 at the same time and was having similar problems and talked Dillon into replacing it with the older RL1050. I asked Dillon to do the same for me and they supposedly did but the frame still has the pawl overtravel limiter so I'm not sure exactly what I have besides the general z of Dillon and the 1050. If there was any other game in town, I'd go with it. I've probably spent 12 hours on the phone with Dillon, had the machines apart at least a dozen times, 2 replacements, one additional return, and I still can't load 100 rounds without 1 or 2 defects.

[Flexmoney]

I know it is probably the machine...but can you pretend that it couldn't be?  Assume the machine is 100%.  What else could it be?  (bench? brass? primers?  ???)

[kbear38S]

I use the same brass, primers, and bench (heavy, solid, rigid) for my 550 and 1050. I've swapped primer tubes and powder measures between the presses. They work fine on the 550.

[benos]

I'm guessing Dillon should have covered this, but just in case... I remember The Greatest Ever, Arnt Mhyre, telling me about a very thin shim that sometimes needs to be installed between the "cylinder shaped bushing with a flat ring around it that stops the rearward movement of the primer slide," and the part that it bolts to. (Sorry, I'm not near my machine at the moment.) This aligns the position of the hole in the slide to the hole in the tube, perfectly, when the slide is at rest. Does your machine have this shim? It may only be a few-thousandths thick.

To test to see if the shim is needed, (meaning if the slide hole aligns perfectly with the tube when it's in its rearward position), drop a single primer down the tube and then hand cycle the slide and  and see if the primer comes out perfectly in the slide - every time. Do this test 20 or more times. If it doesn't drop in the slide perfectly every time, you will have problems.

be

[David Olhasso]

In my opinion, the weakest link of loading on the 1050 getting primer into the case.

The biggest potential problem with primers is not properly adjusting the "Primer Station Retain Tab" (part #12930).  If the tab loose at all, the brass can easily fload around and the primer may not properly aling with the case which usually results with a crushed primer.  The tab should almost provide tension against the case.

The next biggest problem is primers not falling into the primer slide.  To help solve this problem, I have polished the lips of the hole on the primer slide where the primer falls into.  I have also had to shim the "primer slide stop" (#13108) on one of my presses to insure that the primer drops into the primer slide when the slide is at rest.  This sounds like the same action that benos had to take.

[kbear38S]

I'll check the primer retention tab this weekend. I think that's the one thing I haven't messed with. Under the guidence of a Dillon tech, I did try different shims in the primer slide stop but the one supplied from the factory worked best. A little polishing around primer hole will help too (polish feed ramp & throat?).

The 1050 primer feed is effectively the same design as used on the 550 which has been completely reliable for 50 or 60,000 rounds.

[Flexmoney]

Wow...no less than three Grand Masters say to polish that sucker up...must be something there.  (Wonder why Dllon hasn't taken care of that already?)

[chi]

I remember having a problem like yours and I found that  the primer slide bar, the hole was too small or in other words Dillon actually had slide bars with different size holes.     Now this is only with small primers.   Do what Brians suggests but also ask Dillon is that have different size hole primer slide bars.   They did when I called and I was surprised to hear they did.     Small primers seem too be always troublesome.    

[Bret Heidkamp]

I have the same problems with my Super 1050.  I have found two things that were causing it.  One, the rubber boot on the primer slide that covers the roll pin was too long.  Although this didn't result in crushed primers yet, it did cause the press to come to sudden haults as the indexing pin tried to push through 1/4" of bar stock.  Cut the boot shorter or throw it behind the neighbor's raspberry bushes.

Secondly, the blue tip on the primer feed tube was too tight.  It actually hangs up primers and the result is rounds without primers.  Loosen it up slightly by taking .001" off the I.D. with a round file.  If you screw up, don't worry, it's only a tip, Dillon makes more.  

I too have spent at least 4 hours on the phone with Dillon.  I have given up on them, and resorted to fixing the thing myself.  

Perhaps the first clue would have been when I uncased the shiny new press and the handle came off in my hand.  The circlip wasn't clipped.  

It only got worse from there.  The index ball would jam in the down position all the time.  I took it apart, cleaned, polished, etc.  But the thing would stick down with flake powder (!)  Finally it quit doing it but I don't know what happened there.  

The indexing was too fast, and spilled powder everywhere.  A new pawl and cam fixed that after waiting at least 4 to 6 months for them to redesign it.  (I was an early buyer of this press... note to self... never be the first to buy any new design!!)

Then, the cases would not feed properly into the shellplate.  A little dremelling to put a nice polished feed angle at each case position cured that (after I had done this, the next time I spoke with Dillon they said they do this too, on returned presses for repair)

I agree to tighten the primer tab (the white plastic locator) so the case is aligned and held pretty snug.  

Last, I still have primers hang up on old brass.  The pockets in 38 super get hammered and the edges seem to get pretty square, resulting in primers hooking themselves on the edge of the pocket.

Also tighten the shellplate to 1/16 turn off from bottomed.  

Finally, after much tinkering the thing runs.  It will still hook a primer on occasion and that rattles the press shellplate enough to launch powder.

My presses are bolted to a stell worktable (3/8" plate) which is in turn bolted to the wall with lag bolts and has steel legs.  The table absolutely does not move, nor does the press.

The last thing that helps alot (even on my 650) is securing the casefeeder.  It tends to get wiggly and the press seems to run better without that weight up there moving around.

If I can remember anything else, I'll post it.

Does your press work yet?  I was about ready to throw this thing in the dumpster.

Bret

[EricW]

KBear,

Have you got satifaction yet from Dillon regarding the problems you were having?  

What's the general overall consensus of the owners of the new Super 1050's usability?  Thumbs up or down?

Thanks,

E

[kbear38S]

No, I remain unhappy with it. I thought I had the problem worked out. I loaded two sets of 500 rounds and at about 750, a tossed a primer into the works and locked the machine up hard. I had to disassemble most of the primer feed to get it out. When I was done, I found a cartridge without a primer which of course dumped powder down into the works and further gunked up the machine.

I have to call Dillon back tomorrow - we're trying 'one more thing'. We'll see how it works out. I really think it's time for Dillon to replace the lower press and the primer feed mechanism. I think I set myself up for trouble with Dillon though. When I sent the press back it was right after a whole series of rounds without primers and it was locked up solid from all the powder that fell out the primer hole down into the works. I disassembled it to clean the powder out before shipping it back and never really reassembled it so now they're referring to it as the "machine that was all messed up". Clearly that's coloring their opinion of my competence (though it definitely exceeds that of at least two of their techs) and I think they're convinced the problems are operator error.

Bottom line is I'm not getting many failures but they generally take enough time to clean up that it's no more productive than my 550. When it runs, it cranks the rounds out fast but it just isn't 100% reliable.

[Dr64]

Did anyone else get the Primer Upgrade System sent to them for thier Super 1050 Dillon?

I installed this and the primer system really started to work.  It was so bad before that it was just easier to primer before even using the machine, but now, its working great!

Dr64

[EricW]

Cool!  Will this be a standard "feature" on new presses?

[Thomas Moore]

dr64,

are you talking about the racheting system? i just got off the phone with dillon and they're not aware of any primer upgrade.

keep me posted.

[Dr64]

Yes, thats the kit I got, it included a brand new primer arm, (2) ratcheting bars, springs detent & ome other small parts.

With it installed and adjusted I have had alot better luck then before.

The ratchet bar alone seems to do alot in the fact that it starts the primer slide moving in the right direction, also the new primer arm seems to have a little different geometry.

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Quote: from Limited40 on 6:54 am on Oct. 15, 2002

dr64,

are you talking about the racheting system? i just got off the phone with dillon and they're not aware of any primer upgrade.

keep me posted.

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[Thomas Moore]

this equipment is designed so one wouldn't pull a half stroke, it really has nothing to do with the priming system. but i'm glad it's working better for you. some people bash dillon and i always tell them, "you must be doing it wrong'

[kbear38S]

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some people bash dillon and i always tell them, "you must be doing it wrong'

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Damn right. There's no way a fine, upstanding company like Dillon could ever do anything wrong. All us dumb-####s just keep screwing up so much Dillon had to spend all that money re-engineering that fine press to make sure us dumb-$$$ user can't screw up.

[enhanced sarcasm mode off]

[translation mode on]

No, I just think your comment is wrong.

(Edited by kbear38S at 3:07 pm on Oct. 18, 2002)

[John Dunn]

This thread had me worried as I recently ordered a 1050, and subsequently found these posts.  Today was the first day using the thing, and I love it.  I did not experience any primer feed problems, and only a couple case feed snafus.  Once everything was assembled and adjusted I cranked out 2M rounds of .40.  They gauged nicely and ran through the STI without a glitch.  I only timed my output for one primer tube (100 rds), and it was 5 minutes flat.

So far so good.  If I run into similar problems, I'll be sure to post them.

[swagerman]

Dear reloader, "what a problem, isn`t it?" Well well well, lets start from the begining, THE BLUE MACHINE NEVER NEVER FAILS, ITS YOU, that happened to me once. I reload in a comercial way, and had in a time FIVE (5) 1050 blue perfect machines. What would you thing of a man that goes on vacation and in the side of the bed puts a RL1050 photo just not to miss her? Well, say what ever you want, but that is ME!! I disassemble and re assemble it with my eyes shut, and I have proof of it. I know it by heart, thats because Im in true and deep in love with it. So pleas dont tell things as you did about her. Its only bad regulated. Where? ok, ill tell you, just change the old springs to new ones, the one of the arm that pull the primer tray, and this arm too mus be in perfect harmony with the tray and just seem to touch the body of the machine when the primer tray is in the deep position.

If you have any furthur question, well, call me when ever you want, if im not working, im talking to my BLUE GIRL FRIEND. Ill be glad to help you.

Remember, the machine alone cant work at all. You must have some personal skill to make it work gentle, in a smooth way.

sorry about my broken english, but I was born in the south part of South America. If you want to speak it in spanish it would be better for me. Best regards, Swagerman

honoriomc@hotmail.com

[EricW]

Sounds like someone is really "at one" with his Dillon.  There ought to be a Blue Press article in the last post.

Ohhh......Duuuaaaayyynnneee....

[Bret Heidkamp]

Just a quick note on the primer feeding system on the super 1050 - I found one other thing last summer that was responsible for the headaches, and I wanted to add it to this archive:

The track the primer arm slides in was not machined 100%. Turns out the last pass on the mill didn't go all the way toward the center of the machine. This resulted in a little lip in the track bottom of about .010" It wouldn't goof things up until there was a little buildup of gunk (very little!) in the track from use, and then the primer bar would start hanging up.

This resulted in smashed primers and cases without primers - up to one in every 100 cases. It was driving me batty last summer, and the only way to fix it was to tear down the press and clean that track.

Once I milled off the lip, it works 1000% better. You can check your press for this fairly easily:

Remove the shellplate and primer tube, then just press lightly downward on the primer slide and you will feel it toward the end of it's stroke moving to the center of the press (forward). If there is a lip you'll feel it. Get rid of it and there ya go.

The last thing to check is something a Dillon tech told me: Put the press back together and without primers in the tube look down the tube while shining a flashlight into the base at the shellplate. Make sure the primer slide comes all the way back to pick up a primer and lines up 100%. Adjust by shimming (or removing shims) from the primer bar stop bolt (the half-circle shaped part that stops the primer bar on it's return stroke).

Hope this helps someone, post if it does!